Ownership philosophy is the problem

[SunsetBengal]

(01-10-2018, 08:48 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: While i definately agree that this conservative approach in FA makes it nearly impossible to improve into a SB contender,
Marv and his terrible 2nd halfs are another huge reason we don't succeed in the postseason. Maybe if him and his coaches
could coach up these young players by the postseason this would help once we get there?

Most is definately on MB and his antiquated ways but a lot has been on Marv in the past as well. Just hoping that Marv
getting to pick his own coaches is a start at actually our coaches doing better in coaching our players.

Stonyhands is absolutely right.  It all comes back to Mike Brown, and his methods of doing things.  

Look, if we had an owner that moved his ideas forward with the times, would we all really be getting excited about assistant coaching changes?  C'mon, how many of us were expecting a change at HC this season?  I know that I certainly was.  No disrespect intended to Marvin, but if after 15 years you haven't won a playoff game, it's time to move on.

The only one to blame for this is Marvin's boss, the team owner, Mike Brown.  Back at the beginning of the season, I went through the dulldrums about Mike Brown, got a little negative for a minute, even went on to write a diatribe or two about it.  Until Mike either steps aside, or passes away, no wholesale changes to the philosophy of the organization will ever occur.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-10-2018, 09:26 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Stonyhands is absolutely right.  It all comes back to Mike Brown, and his methods of doing things.  

Look, if we had an owner that moved his ideas forward with the times, would we all really be getting excited about assistant coaching changes?  C'mon, how many of us were expecting a change at HC this season?  I know that I certainly was.  No disrespect intended to Marvin, but if after 15 years you haven't won a playoff game, it's time to move on.

The only one to blame for this is Marvin's boss, the team owner, Mike Brown.  Back at the beginning of the season, I went through the dulldrums about Mike Brown, got a little negative for a minute, even went on to write a diatribe or two about it.  Until Mike either steps aside, or passes away, no wholesale changes to the philosophy of the organization will ever occur.

Well, hard to argue with any of that Sunset. All i know is in the end it does come down to the coaches and players
on the field. I know if i was Marvin Lewis i would be sticking to what i can change cause i want a damn Superbowl.

He gets paid more than i can ever dream and has a great life coaching my favorite team. Cannot blame him for
what he cannot change but i can blame him for his failures. MB just doesn't know what the hell he is doing.

I always remember what Jesus said lol

[fredtoast]

Here is the problem with free agency. Almost every team locks up their best players instead of letting them go in free agency, then when players hit the free agent market their value is driven up by market competition. The players that hit free agenmcy are usually not the best players at their position, but when they are the best players AVAILABLE at thier position teams get in bidding wars over them and end up over paying.

So, if you are always looking "long term" the Bengals approach to free agency actually makes a lot of sense, but the problem is that when you have a team that is just a player or two away from competing for a championship you have to take chances with free agents. And that is where the Bengals have failed.

[sandwedge]

(01-12-2018, 03:02 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Here is the problem with free agency.  Almost every team locks up their best players instead of letting them go in free agency, then when players hit the free agent market their value is driven up by market competition.  The players that hit free agenmcy are usually not the best players at their position, but when they are the best players AVAILABLE at thier position teams get in bidding wars over them and end up over paying.

So, if you are always looking "long term" the Bengals approach to free agency actually makes a lot of sense, but the problem is that when you have a team that is just a player or two away from competing for a championship you have to take chances with free agents.  And that is where the Bengals have failed.

Agree with you here Fred. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-12-2018, 03:02 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Here is the problem with free agency.  Almost every team locks up their best players instead of letting them go in free agency, then when players hit the free agent market their value is driven up by market competition.  The players that hit free agenmcy are usually not the best players at their position, but when they are the best players AVAILABLE at thier position teams get in bidding wars over them and end up over paying.

So, if you are always looking "long term" the Bengals approach to free agency actually makes a lot of sense, but the problem is that when you have a team that is just a player or two away from competing for a championship you have to take chances with free agents.  And that is where the Bengals have failed.

Cannot argue with any of this. I actually think the Bengals played it right in letting MLJ and Zeitler go who were severely
overpaid, but letting Whitworth go was a big mistake cause he was affordable. I know Whit was old but you have to take a
gamble once in awhile even on your own players.

And just sometimes on outside ones damn it.

[sandwedge]

(01-12-2018, 03:10 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Cannot argue with any of this. I actually think the Bengals played it right in letting MLJ and Zeitler go who were severely
overpaid, but letting Whitworth go was a big mistake cause he was affordable. I know Whit was old but you have to take a
gamble once in awhile even on your own players.

And just sometimes on outside ones damn it.

Till this day, I still believe Whit got sick of the BS here and saw the writing on the wall. We could have offered the same contract he got, but he was dead set on leaving. With a young coach and the warm California sun, I'd have adios myself.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-12-2018, 03:20 PM)sandwedge Wrote: Till this day, I still believe Whit got sick of the BS here and saw the writing on the wall. We could have offered the same contract he got, but he was dead set on leaving. With a young coach and the warm California sun, I'd have adios myself.

I could see this but it is contrary to what Whit himself said. He said he would of rather stayed here if they offered
him the same contract the Rams gave him. He said it wasn't even close which is a slap in the face for a guy that
always played his ass off here.

The thing is, if we offered him that contract we would probably be still stuck with PA. Whit would of helped our
team that much judging from what he did in LA this year.

Gotta take the bad with the good and i am just happy Pollack is now here and PA is not.

[leonardfan40]

Didn’t mike once say he was waiting for that “magical season where all of the stars align and we go on a run”? Basically saying he’s waiting for us to get lucky...if all it took was luck to win then we wouldn’t be pushing 30 years without a single playoff victory and the pats wouldn’t have 5 teams worth of super bowl victories in that same time.

That’s why we’ll never win with him in charge, he’s just up there hoping we win a Super Bowl lmao. I guess he thinks if he hopes hard enough or is patient enough, eventually he’ll get lucky. Unfortunately that’s not the way the world or NFL works.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-12-2018, 03:35 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Didn’t mike once say he was waiting for that “magical season where all of the stars align and we go on a run”? Basically saying he’s waiting for us to get lucky...if all it took was luck to win then we wouldn’t be pushing 30 years without a single playoff victory and the pats wouldn’t have 5 teams worth of super bowl victories in that same time.

That’s why we’ll never win with him in charge, he’s just up there hoping we win a Super Bowl lmao. I guess he thinks if he hopes hard enough or is patient enough, eventually he’ll get lucky. Unfortunately that’s not the way the world or NFL works.

Very true but i have never seen us move so fast to grab a good coach before like we did with Pollack.

Hopefully this is a sign of Marv taking over and MB stepping aside and hoping lol

[fredtoast]

(01-12-2018, 03:20 PM)sandwedge Wrote: Till this day, I still believe Whit got sick of the BS here and saw the writing on the wall. We could have offered the same contract he got, but he was dead set on leaving. With a young coach and the warm California sun, I'd have adios myself.

This is ridiculous.  The Rams were in a lot worse shape than us when he signed with them.

It was all about the money.  And I don't blame Whitworth.