Does the psyche of a team live or die with the QB?

[2MinutesHate]

(11-26-2018, 10:30 AM)fredtoast Wrote: When Bengal fans see another QB yelling at a teammate it is because he is a fiery leader.

When Bengal fans saw Palmer yelling at Chad it was "division between teammates" and possibly a "fratured lockerroom".

Of course you're only speaking for some Bengal fans as many of us were very tired of Chad's antics and upset at Marvin and Mike Brown for not doing anything about it.  Nevertheless, Palmer really wasn't much of a leader at all, but he was a very good player.

Boomer was the last true leader at QB that we've had in my opinion.  It's almost like they're hand-picking these "monkey see, monkey do" quarterbacks.  However, they did miscalculate with Palmer who ended up giving them trouble by quitting on them because he wanted to win.  In walks Andy who sure as hell isn't going to cause a stir and will toe the company line to the end.  Haven't heard a peep out him in 8 years, right?

[fredtoast]

(11-26-2018, 01:26 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote:  However, they did miscalculate with Palmer who ended up giving them trouble by quitting on them because he wanted to win.

"Because he wanted to win"?!?!?!

 

That's a good one.

He agreed to play for the Raiders "because he wanted to win"

[2MinutesHate]

(11-26-2018, 01:41 PM)fredtoast Wrote: "Because he wanted to win"?!?!?!

 

That's a good one.

He agreed to play for the Raiders "because he wanted to win"

Palmer didn't see Mike Brown making moves to help the team win, so he wanted out.  I guess he thought the Raiders were trying harder than the Bengals to achieve that.  Whether or not he made the right choice is his own business. 

Now why don't you give us a clever stat showing us how great Marvin is and why we should continue to support him.  I think we're all waiting.   :heart: :giggle:

[BengalChris]

(11-26-2018, 12:23 PM)fredtoast Wrote: So you are saying the O-line is not responsible for missing blocks because Dalton didn't "pump them up"?

Apparently you don't have a clue about the real world.

No, you know what I mean. You are just twisting my words to imply something I never said. I never used the words "pump them up", you did.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(11-26-2018, 01:55 PM)BengalChris Wrote: No, you know what I mean. You are just twisting my words to imply something I never said. I never used the words "pump them up", you did.

He was quoting me. I asked if that embarrassing pregame clip of Dalton would pump you up. But instead of admitting that is one category Andy is extremely lacking excuses are made, and having a QB that players actually want to follow is being downplayed.

[fredtoast]

(11-26-2018, 01:58 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: He was quoting me. I asked if that embarrassing pregame clip of Dalton would pump you up. But instead of admitting that is one category Andy is extremely lacking excuses are made, and having a QB that players actually want to follow is being downplayed.

Players don't "want to follow" a guy because he squeals and jumps up and down.  They want to follow guys who work hard and lead by example.


Bengals want to follow Andy.  Only the fans hate him.

[fredtoast]

(11-26-2018, 01:55 PM)BengalChris Wrote: No, you know what I mean. You are just twisting my words to imply something I never said. I never used the words "pump them up", you did.

Actually, no, I don't know what you mean.

Would it change anything if I used the word "inspire" instead of "pump up"?

How is it Andy's fault when the O-line misses blocks just because he doesn't jump around yelling on the sidelines?

[*ochocincos*]

(11-25-2018, 10:51 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: The psyche of a team lives and dies with the head coach.

And the QB mimics the HC...very laid back.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(11-26-2018, 02:50 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Players don't "want to follow" a guy because he squeals and jumps up and down.  They want to follow guys who work hard and lead by example.


Bengals want to follow Andy.  Only the fans hate him.

I can only speak for myself, but I certainly don’t hate Andy Dalton. He seems like a good person, but I want better for my team. I want better players at lots of positions. But his happens to be the most important. And all players in the NFL work hard. They wouldn’t be there otherwise. Also, pregame speeches must have some worth, or players wouldn’t do them.

[grampahol]

To be fair to Driskle he came in stone cold in a really bad game to dig out from under . I didn't expect miracles because he's never started an NFL game in his life .
I don't expect miracles next week either, but if we get one and he somehow lights up Denver I'll be pleased as will everyone I'm sure. 
What would utterly shock me would be to see him win every game the rest of the season by large margins and if that happens Andy will be toast and probably demand a trade. 

[McC]

(11-26-2018, 12:17 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: Driskel wasn't terrible but he started that way.  He basically was staring down targets because of being thrown into the situation.  Once he settled down he got better at not telegraphing so much.

I'm not thinking he's a saviour or anything but would like to see what he can or cannot do in a prepared start and whole game.

Also as others mentioned in a game where they weren't getting blown out and a defense had game planned for him at QB.

You know... common sense stuff without passing full judgment either way.

Yep.  I don't get the rush to decide on a guy who has played less than a half of football.  Magic 8 ball sez--Too soon to tell.

Now, I'm off to find and kill the guy who writes Farmers only dot com ads because I truly cannot stand hearing that ad even one more time.

[McC]

(11-26-2018, 01:50 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: Palmer didn't see Mike Brown making moves to help the team win, so he wanted out.  I guess he thought the Raiders were trying harder than the Bengals to achieve that.  Whether or not he made the right choice is his own business. 

Now why don't you give us a clever stat showing us how great Marvin is and why we should continue to support him.  I think we're all waiting.   :heart: :giggle:

If the majority around here expressed Marvin love in every thread, Fred would be the one hating because that is what argumentative contrarians do.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-26-2018, 01:50 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: Palmer didn't see Mike Brown making moves to help the team win, so he wanted out.  I guess he thought the Raiders were trying harder than the Bengals to achieve that.  Whether or not he made the right choice is his own business. 

Now why don't you give us a clever stat showing us how great Marvin is and why we should continue to support him.  I think we're all waiting.   :heart: :giggle:

Palmer really had no choice but to go to Oakland if he wanted to play again.....

[Shake n Blake]

(11-26-2018, 11:03 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: For some reason, fans villanize our best players: Pickens, Palmer, Dillon, Dalton, etc.

The players aren't the main issue. The organization/organizational culture is.

Mike Brown loves fans who scapegoat players. Keep looking forward to that next big player that will turn this team around. I'm sure it'll happen any minute now...and make sure to buy season tickets!

(11-26-2018, 01:50 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: Palmer didn't see Mike Brown making moves to help the team win, so he wanted out.  I guess he thought the Raiders were trying harder than the Bengals to achieve that.  Whether or not he made the right choice is his own business. 

Now why don't you give us a clever stat showing us how great Marvin is and why we should continue to support him.  I think we're all waiting.   :heart: :giggle:

(11-27-2018, 02:45 PM)Wyche Wrote: Palmer really had no choice but to go to Oakland if he wanted to play again.....

Exactly Wyche. Palmer didn't choose Oakland. It was just his only way out. I recently saw where Palmer pretty much said Mike was punishing him by trading him there.

[fredtoast]

(11-27-2018, 04:46 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Exactly Wyche. Palmer didn't choose Oakland. It was just his only way out. 

No.  He could have just continued to sit out.

If it was about winning that is what he would have done because the Raiders were in worse shape than the Bengals when he ecided he was not going to play anymore.

[fredtoast]

(11-27-2018, 12:50 PM)McC Wrote: If the majority around here expressed Marvin love in every thread, Fred would be the one hating because that is what argumentative contrarians do.

Lame.  Doesn't the majority around here agree Mike Brown is the worst owner in the league?


Also the funny thing is that I am the ONLY one who is consistent.  The people who are constantly bashing Marvin change their position from wek to week.

"Marvin sucks because he is never aggressive at the end of the first half"
"Marvin sucks because he was aggressive at the end of the half against the Ravens."


"Marvin sucks because he is too conservative with a lead in the second half."
"Marvin sucks because he didn't run the ball more with a lead against the Chargers in the second half."

[Shake n Blake]

(11-28-2018, 03:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No.  He could have just continued to sit out.

If it was about winning that is what he would have done because the Raiders were in worse shape than the Bengals when he ecided he was not going to play anymore.

He was signed through 2014 with the Bengals, so the "sitting out" option would've ended his career for all intents and purposes.

His chances of getting a starting gig after sitting for 3 full seasons were none to zero. 

By taking the Oakland option, he was able to deal with an owner who wasn't completely irrational, and hence get out of the deal entirely after 2 years of playing and staying relevant. By going this route, Palmer was able to get to a better franchise by 2013. 

[*rfaulk34*]

(11-28-2018, 08:28 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: He was signed through 2014 with the Bengals, so the "sitting out" option would've ended his career for all intents and purposes.

His chances of getting a starting gig after sitting for 3 full seasons were none to zero. 

By taking the Oakland option, he was able to deal with an owner who wasn't completely irrational, and hence get out of the deal entirely after 2 years of playing and staying relevant. By going this route, Palmer was able to get to a better franchise by 2013. 

Plus, the Raiders weren't in worse shape than the Bengals at that time. They were coming off an 8-8 year and were 4-2 when Campbell got hurt. 

[Shake n Blake]

(11-28-2018, 08:56 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Plus, the Raiders weren't in worse shape than the Bengals at that time. They were coming off an 8-8 year and were 4-2 when Campbell got hurt. 

That too.