ADVANTAGEOUS BENGAL RECEIVING CORP!

[grampahol]

(09-11-2018, 12:16 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Uhh. Dalton completed 75 percent of his passes, 8.7 ypa and a 109 passer rating, completing passes to 8 different receivers...

How is that not taking advantage of mismatches?

I just don't get fans and their expectations sometimes.

Ehem... I seem to recall several posters (maybe it was the old board..My memory isn't as good as it  used to be)  who proclaimed that they were not going to settle for mediocrety and didn't have to... So..they obviously all became billionaires and bought their own NFL teams .
Actually I think Andy is a whole lot better than he gets credit for and a hell of a lot better than Dak Prescot who was (HAHAHA) rated #12 overall while Andy was rated somewhere around 24. Now whoever made that silly rating obviously was a Cowboys fan, but they don't have to settle for mediocrety either since the Star owner owns them. They suck instead.  

[Bilbo Saggins]

(09-11-2018, 12:22 AM)jwayne Wrote: Almost a 110 passer rating, and 70% completions, WEAKNESS.

I LAUGH IN YOU FACE! 

I will take Andy's obvious problems. 

GO BENGALS!

I agree, after this week it's not really the right time to criticize Dalton.  He's played fantastic for the most part.  That being said, I've been watching him for his entire career and the Colts defense was a 4 win defense last year with Brissett(a luxury backup).  It becomes a weakness when it doesn't work and when elite defenses start playing rope-a-dope with him(like in the playoffs).  I have nothing but good things to say about Dalton the person, I'm glad that he has played so well this year, and I really hope that he shuts up all the haters sooner rather than later.  I said what I said based upon his history.  A history that can be re-written in any given season.

[*SHRacerX*]

(09-11-2018, 12:16 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Uhh. Dalton completed 75 percent of his passes, 8.7 ypa and a 109 passer rating, completing passes to 8 different receivers...

How is that not taking advantage of mismatches?

I just don't get fans and their expectations sometimes.

This.  Well said.  We could have done what a Gruden or maybe even Hue-led Bengal offense would do, which is air it our 50-plus times (like Luck did) and have one more tipped ball turn in to an INT (they didn't, but DAMN was Carlos "the Colt Killer" close) or we could have kept the decent balance of run/pass and moved the ball as they did.  

The only real timed the Colts stopped the Bengals was when they fumbled or had a costly penalty to get off schedule.

The biggest complaint I have with this offense (STILL!!!) is when a play breaks down and Dalton is forced out of the pocket that most of the WRs just freeze.  The steelers (puke) have a designed "scramble play" where they all take off to certain spots and piggy knows where his options are.  

For instance, on the play where Dalton scrabled hard to his left (forcing a throw across his body, should he air it out) Ross just stood there in front of him on the sideline with a player on his back.  He should have spun away and took off deep down the sideline!  If nothing else, he takes a defender with him but it gives Dalton and option for a potentially big play.  Ross (or any of the receivers) might also get held as DBs scramble to stay on them for that extended period of time.  

It is always 3-4 plays during a game that yield the Bengals NOTHING that could be potentially big plays.  

[Daddy-O]

(09-11-2018, 02:12 AM)RASCAL Wrote: this thread was NOT meant to be a downer on Dalton. I will however say that he had a good game but I believe he could be a lot better by having his head on a swivel.

 You're right, he could have been better if he'd of completed 100% passes and had a 158.3 rating.  Good grief what game were you watching man?

Time to bring in Matthew Stafford.  Oh wait......

[Fan_in_Kettering]

(09-10-2018, 11:13 PM)RASCAL Wrote: do you really want a response from me on this?

Sure. If Joe Mixon wasn’t gashing the Colts on the ground and with screen passes I would be solidly in your corner. If the run game had been ineffective you would be spot-on in your analysis but let me remind you the Colts had their safeties playing one- or two-man over the top to prevent the deep ball — just like Cincinnati did to limit Andrew Luck.

It took Luck 39 pass completions to reach 300 yards passing. That means the Cincinnati secondary limited the Indianapolis receivers’ yards after catch.

Back to Andy Dalton. He took what the Colts gave him and completed 21 passes for 243 yards. I’ll take those numbers when combined with Joe Mixon’s stellar job on the ground. Against Baltimore on Thursday Night what you originally wrote will be critical to winning the game. It’s hard to run on the Ravens, period, so Andy Dalton will have to spread passes around to every receiver he has on every route they can run.

[yang]

Well, it's one game so we need to keep things in perspective. My biggest concern is targets to Ross as he is such a weapon and at times, despite being wide open, Dalton went elsewhere into coverage. ( Think of the incomplete TD pass with Ross wide open in the flat) Is it a lack of trust? Is it that Dalton can't work the progressions? It did seem Lazor rolled him out a bit more to get him some looks, so we'll see.

This could be because of the success we had we had and only running a limited number of plays - 28 passes.

Targets went

Green -8
Mixon-7
Boyd-5
Eifert-3
Ross-2
Gio, Kroft, Uzumoh all -1

I more ideal mix would be to get Green and Ross and Eifert all about 3 additional targets. This is all obviously game script dependent.

But like T. Hill with KC, you need to get the ball in Ross's hands more. You need WR Screens, slants, reverses, whatever. Only 2 targets should be a criminal offense.

The more targets Ross gets, the more open AJ will be as well.

Eifert needs to continue improving and seeing more targets as time goes.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(09-11-2018, 12:16 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Uhh. Dalton completed 75 percent of his passes, 8.7 ypa and a 109 passer rating, completing passes to 8 different receivers...

How is that not taking advantage of mismatches?

I just don't get fans and their expectations sometimes.

Yeah, 8 different receivers with those stats is pretty damn nice.  When you give him time, he is a pretty good QB.  When he doesn't have time, he has troubles.

(09-11-2018, 03:07 AM)grampahol Wrote: Ehem... I seem to recall several posters (maybe it was the old board..My memory isn't as good as it  used to be)  who proclaimed that they were not going to settle for mediocrety and didn't have to... So..they obviously all became billionaires and bought their own NFL teams .
Actually I think Andy is a whole lot better than he gets credit for and a hell of a lot better than Dak Prescot who was (HAHAHA) rated #12 overall while Andy was rated somewhere around 24. Now whoever made that silly rating obviously was a Cowboys fan, but they don't have to settle for mediocrety either since the Star owner owns them. They suck instead.  

This.  This is why I have a hard time putting much stock in what "egg spurts" (see what I did there?) have to say a lot of times.  Often, it doesn't jive with what actual former players and ex coaches who weigh in and announce games have to say about any given topic.  Also, Derek Carr hasn't really impressed much since his injury.  I still say Andy is SOLIDLY 11-14 range, with the ability to hit top ten.

(09-11-2018, 03:36 AM)Bilbo Saggins Wrote: I agree, after this week it's not really the right time to criticize Dalton.  He's played fantastic for the most part.  That being said, I've been watching him for his entire career and the Colts defense was a 4 win defense last year with Brissett(a luxury backup).  It becomes a weakness when it doesn't work and when elite defenses start playing rope-a-dope with him(like in the playoffs).  I have nothing but good things to say about Dalton the person, I'm glad that he has played so well this year, and I really hope that he shuts up all the haters sooner rather than later.  I said what I said based upon his history.  A history that can be re-written in any given season.

This is a good point.  The last two seasons have been rough, but until then, his arrow was progressively pointing up.  The better the protection, the better he is.  He's historically not been a guy that can carry a team if he doesn't have good protection.

(09-11-2018, 07:10 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: This.  Well said.  We could have done what a Gruden or maybe even Hue-led Bengal offense would do, which is air it our 50-plus times (like Luck did) and have one more tipped ball turn in to an INT (they didn't, but DAMN was Carlos "the Colt Killer" close) or we could have kept the decent balance of run/pass and moved the ball as they did.  

The only real timed the Colts stopped the Bengals was when they fumbled or had a costly penalty to get off schedule.

The biggest complaint I have with this offense (STILL!!!) is when a play breaks down and Dalton is forced out of the pocket that most of the WRs just freeze.  The steelers (puke) have a designed "scramble play" where they all take off to certain spots and piggy knows where his options are.  

For instance, on the play where Dalton scrabled hard to his left (forcing a throw across his body, should he air it out) Ross just stood there in front of him on the sideline with a player on his back.  He should have spun away and took off deep down the sideline!  If nothing else, he takes a defender with him but it gives Dalton and option for a potentially big play.  Ross (or any of the receivers) might also get held as DBs scramble to stay on them for that extended period of time.  

It is always 3-4 plays during a game that yield the Bengals NOTHING that could be potentially big plays.  

Yep, still pains me to see it.  Although, there was one play on a rollout to his right, where he hit a receiver that got open along the sideline.  I think it was Boyd?

[Sled21]

(09-11-2018, 07:10 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: The biggest complaint I have with this offense (STILL!!!) is when a play breaks down and Dalton is forced out of the pocket that most of the WRs just freeze.  The steelers (puke) have a designed "scramble play" where they all take off to certain spots and piggy knows where his options are.  

For instance, on the play where Dalton scrabled hard to his left (forcing a throw across his body, should he air it out) Ross just stood there in front of him on the sideline with a player on his back.  He should have spun away and took off deep down the sideline!  If nothing else, he takes a defender with him but it gives Dalton and option for a potentially big play.  Ross (or any of the receivers) might also get held as DBs scramble to stay on them for that extended period of time.  

It is always 3-4 plays during a game that yield the Bengals NOTHING that could be potentially big plays.  

You would think Andy would tell them, if I get flushed I'm going to look for Mixon, if he's covered I'm flinging it as far downfield as I can right at the hash marks and AJ and Ross... "Go get it".

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(09-11-2018, 07:10 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: This.  Well said.  We could have done what a Gruden or maybe even Hue-led Bengal offense would do, which is air it our 50-plus times (like Luck did) and have one more tipped ball turn in to an INT (they didn't, but DAMN was Carlos "the Colt Killer" close) or we could have kept the decent balance of run/pass and moved the ball as they did.  

The only real timed the Colts stopped the Bengals was when they fumbled or had a costly penalty to get off schedule.

The biggest complaint I have with this offense (STILL!!!) is when a play breaks down and Dalton is forced out of the pocket that most of the WRs just freeze.  The steelers (puke) have a designed "scramble play" where they all take off to certain spots and piggy knows where his options are.  

For instance, on the play where Dalton scrabled hard to his left (forcing a throw across his body, should he air it out) Ross just stood there in front of him on the sideline with a player on his back.  He should have spun away and took off deep down the sideline!  If nothing else, he takes a defender with him but it gives Dalton and option for a potentially big play.  Ross (or any of the receivers) might also get held as DBs scramble to stay on them for that extended period of time.  

It is always 3-4 plays during a game that yield the Bengals NOTHING that could be potentially big plays.  

You know, this line got me thinking; he really has had beastly games against the Colts:

2010: 2 tackles, 1 sack (big drive killer that Manning was probably going to score on)
2011: 1 tackle, 35 yard fumble TD recovery (for the game-sealing TD)
2013: 4 tackles, 2 of them TFL
2014: 5 tackles, 0.5 sacks
2017: 3 tackles, 1 TFL, 1 sack, 16 yard interception TD (to put us ahead)
2018: 2 tackles, 1 TFL, 1 PD 1 sack

So, in 6 regular season games, he has:

17 Tackles
3.5 sacks
4* TFL
X* PDs
Fumble return for a TD
INT return for a TD

I have stars there because I can't find full data.

That's pretty damn good.

[BengalD]

(09-10-2018, 08:56 PM)Gamma Ray Tan Wrote: The Colts played a cover 2 the whole game, (2 safeties playing over the top) obviously to mitigate the Green/Ross deep threat. They are going to see that a lot this year. Dalton found some success in the middle and flats, but it really helped Mixon be as productive as he was. The play action and RB pass out of the backfield worked like a charm. The More Mixon can carve up the D, the more it will force the D to drop a safety and open up the deep ball more.

Spot On - Rep!

[*SHRacerX*]

(09-11-2018, 11:59 AM)Wyche Wrote: Yeah, 8 different receivers with those stats is pretty damn nice.  When you give him time, he is a pretty good QB.  When he doesn't have time, he has troubles.


This.  This is why I have a hard time putting much stock in what "egg spurts" (see what I did there?) have to say a lot of times.  Often, it doesn't jive with what actual former players and ex coaches who weigh in and announce games have to say about any given topic.  Also, Derek Carr hasn't really impressed much since his injury.  I still say Andy is SOLIDLY 11-14 range, with the ability to hit top ten.


This is a good point.  The last two seasons have been rough, but until then, his arrow was progressively pointing up.  The better the protection, the better he is.  He's historically not been a guy that can carry a team if he doesn't have good protection.


Yep, still pains me to see it.  Although, there was one play on a rollout to his right, where he hit a receiver that got open along the sideline.  I think it was Boyd?

It was Boyd, but the defense simply lost Boyd.  As wonderful as a play that was, it wasn't improvisational by our WRs.  We simply don't work those situations. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(09-10-2018, 08:40 PM)RASCAL Wrote: after re watching this game against the Colts, I was wondering why we are not taking advantage of the miss match play of Green, Ross, Boyd and Eifert! It seems to me if AJ is doubled, which he was, Ross Boyd or Eifert are the only options as at least 1 of the three left should be wide open. Maybe the rest of you saw it better than I did, but there should NEVER be a play that someone is NOT open, short or long. I believe Dalton looks only for 1 receiver most of the time, at least that is what I am seeing in replays, and he should get his head on a rotation to take advantage of this. There is NO Defense in this league that can hang with all of the weapons we have at receiver. I know Dalton has to RUN FOR HIS LIFE AT TIMES but typically the line holds up long enough for him to find a receiver.Maybe that is what Lazor is trying to get accomplished, maybe not but the pieces are there. Maybe you guys can fill me in on what you saw in the game.

At this point it is really early, it will get better, the timing, the Line play, Dalton trusting his Line etc.

Depends on how the Defense is playing us as well, the Colts were playing their Safeties deep to try and take AJ and
Ross's speed out of the equation. This opens up the middle of the field and that is where our guys will need to feast.

We do have a lot of weapons for sure, was a good game for our guys against the Colts to open up and it should get
much better as the Line and the players gel. Much better Defense this next game though with a much better pass
rush. Hart is our weakness at this point and you better bet the Ravens know it and will be going after him. Dalton
will need time to get it to our Receivers, we will need Mixon to take pressure off of him.

[RASCAL]

(09-11-2018, 10:37 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Sure.  If Joe Mixon wasn’t gashing the Colts on the ground and with screen passes I would be solidly in your corner.  If the run game had been ineffective you would be spot-on in your analysis but let me remind you the Colts had their safeties playing one- or two-man over the top to prevent the deep ball — just like Cincinnati did to limit Andrew Luck.

It took Luck 39 pass completions to reach 300 yards passing.  That means the Cincinnati secondary limited the Indianapolis receivers’ yards after catch.

Back to Andy Dalton.  He took what the Colts gave him and completed 21 passes for 243 yards. I’ll take those numbers when combined with Joe Mixon’s stellar job on the ground.  Against Baltimore on Thursday Night what you originally wrote will be critical to winning the game.  It’s hard to run on the Ravens, period, so Andy Dalton will have to spread passes around to every receiver he has on every route they can run.

child please! or should I say...old man please!

[RASCAL]

(09-11-2018, 10:04 AM)Daddy-O Wrote:  You're right, he could have been better if he'd of completed 100% passes and had a 158.3 rating.  Good grief what game were you watching man?

Time to bring in Matthew Stafford.  Oh wait......

what is it with the I hate Dalton posts? I am a fan of Dalton and I can as an avid Bengals season ticket holder say what I feel is anything to make any football player better. While Dalton is far from perefect as some of you think he is, he always has room for the betterment of himself and the team. Bt the way I have watched the game several times now. How many times have you watched it?

[RASCAL]

(09-11-2018, 03:56 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: At this point it is really early, it will get better, the timing, the Line play, Dalton trusting his Line etc.

Depends on how the Defense is playing us as well, the Colts were playing their Safeties deep to try and take AJ and
Ross's speed out of the equation. This opens up the middle of the field and that is where our guys will need to feast.

We do have a lot of weapons for sure, was a good game for our guys against the Colts to open up and it should get
much better as the Line and the players gel. Much better Defense this next game though with a much better pass
rush. Hart is our weakness at this point and you better bet the Ravens know it and will be going after him. Dalton
will need time to get it to our Receivers, we will need Mixon to take pressure off of him.

I didn't even include Mixon as a pass catcher, my bad! Lots of weapons. 

[*rfaulk34*]

(09-11-2018, 02:15 AM)RASCAL Wrote: what I don't get is posters such as yourself that think they know everything. And you ARE ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE!!! So go DUH yourself !

lol





Uhhhh. I said "uhh", not "duh".

[SladeX]

On his highlight reel coming out of college (when gruden was analyzing that qb class)
his highlight reel (!),
he was staring his receivers down. When he's under duress, I bet he reverts to form. Hopefully Price can help. The ravens game will be a better barometer of this team and the state of the Oline.