Drafting without Marvin Lewis

[XenoMorph]

(01-16-2019, 10:28 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Has anyone thought about how the loss of Marvin Lewis could affect our drafting?

Many of us on the board have given ML a lot of props for his talent evaluation and for having success in the draft. With him gone, does that all change now?

With the Bengals not having a GM to guide the process, does anyone wonder how Zac Taylor will be with evaluating talent and drafting? The guy has never done this before...

We still have Duke Tobin, I guess, but I think one of the biggest impacts of ML leaving is going to be player drafting.

We wont know the impact till the draft and a few years beyond...  

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(01-16-2019, 10:43 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: My guess for Og was that Paul Alexander picked him and Fisher.  Ross seemed like someone other than Lewis, probably Tobin.  

You're right about Alexander.....it was stated as such.  Ross SCREAMS a  Mike Brown pick.

[HarleyDog]

(01-16-2019, 11:34 AM)Wyche Wrote: You're right about Alexander.....it was stated as such.  Ross SCREAMS a  Mike Brown pick.

Mike should really never force anything on a coach. Hopefully, with the way things are going, that is something of the past.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(01-16-2019, 11:39 AM)HarleyDog Wrote: Mike should really never force anything on a coach. Hopefully, with the way things are going, that is something of the past.

I'm hoping so as well.

[*ochocincos*]

(01-16-2019, 10:43 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: My guess for Og was that Paul Alexander picked him and Fisher.  Ross seemed like someone other than Lewis, probably Tobin.  

I just looked back at that draft and remembered how bad that draft was for LT prospects. It was better for RT prospects. Also, it's a shame that just four picks after the Bengals selected Fisher, Rob Havenstein went to the Rams. I remember liking Havenstein as a RT prospect.

[SunsetBengal]

I don't know that we'll miss Marvin all that much, come draft day. I don't think that Marvin's drafts were exceptional, when compared to most other teams around the league. Every year is seems like "can't miss" prospects bomb out, and guys that you never heard of become household names. With the Bengal coaching staff serving also as scouts, combined with the notion that young Zac Taylor is looking to surround himself with experience, we may just be pleasantly surprised come draft weekend.

I just hope that they do a good job of identifying players with a particular skill set, that benefits what the team is looking to run on the field. I.e. if they're looking to defend against passing offenses, then get some fast, athletic LBs with good ball skills.

[Socal Bengals fan]

Hmmm we have been shitty with high picks not sure why we give ML any love. Jackson , Dunlap , Whitworth, Green , Mixon , are Guys we hit on. But there’s a lot longer list of WiFf

[*Synric*]

They have been really good drafting in the second round in the Marvin Lewis Era.

Bates
Mixon
Boyd
Hill
Gio
Dalton
Dunlap
Maualuga
Whitworth
Thurman
Steinbach

[*psychdoctor*]

(01-16-2019, 11:56 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I just looked back at that draft and remembered how bad that draft was for LT prospects. It was better for RT prospects. Also, it's a shame that just four picks after the Bengals selected Fisher, Rob Havenstein went to the Rams. I remember liking Havenstein as a RT prospect.

that draft just makes me sick to my stomach.

[CJD]

(01-16-2019, 12:29 PM)Synric Wrote: They have been really good drafting in the second round in the Marvin Lewis Era.

Bates
Mixon
Boyd
Hill
Gio
Dalton
Dunlap
Maualuga
Whitworth
Thurman
Steinbach

They should have just traded all their first round picks for second round picks...

[Socal Bengals fan]

(01-16-2019, 12:29 PM)Synric Wrote: They have been really good drafting in the second round in the Marvin Lewis Era.

Bates
Mixon
Boyd
Hill
Gio
Dalton
Dunlap
Maualuga
Whitworth
Thurman
Steinbach

Hill , Maualuga n Thurman were not stellar picks. Especially when you look at who was drafted around them. Funny thing and good thing I’m not a GM I wanted all 3 of those guys where they were drafted too.

[*ochocincos*]

(01-16-2019, 12:29 PM)Synric Wrote: They have been really good drafting in the second round in the Marvin Lewis Era.

Bates
Mixon
Boyd
Hill
Gio
Dalton
Dunlap
Maualuga
Whitworth
Thurman
Steinbach

They also got solid production out of Madieu Williams and Keiwan Ratliff was alright.

Their misses have been:
Jerome Simpson
Margus Hunt
Jake Fisher
Devon Still
Kenny Irons (big injury, but never did play)

You'd think with getting at least solid production out of 13 of 18 players over those years, they'd have realized their success in that round and tried to get more picks in that round.

[motoarch]

I was happy with Marvin’s drafting for a while but he hasn’t really had much luck the last few drafts. Some late picks have worked out well but we’ve blown quite a few first and second rounders.

[BengalChris]

(01-16-2019, 10:28 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Has anyone thought about how the loss of Marvin Lewis could affect our drafting?

Many of us on the board have given ML a lot of props for his talent evaluation and for having success in the draft. With him gone, does that all change now?

With the Bengals not having a GM to guide the process, does anyone wonder how Zac Taylor will be with evaluating talent and drafting? The guy has never done this before...

We still have Duke Tobin, I guess, but I think one of the biggest impacts of ML leaving is going to be player drafting.

The position coaches were involved in player evaluations, made trips to college pro days, the combine and interviews, plus watching film. I doubt that stops, but the new staff will have less time to do it in.

(01-16-2019, 10:34 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: I believe that Lewis was good at spotting talent.  Not sold on Tobin yet.  I hope Taylor has a strong voice in the war room on draft day.  I hope Mike Brown is at home asleep!

Your last point is absolutely key to not having a bad draft.

(01-16-2019, 10:37 AM)PhilHos Wrote: I think when Taylor becomes officially a head coach could have a somewhat significance on our draft in the fact that he needs to time to evaluate who is currently on our roster, who is a free agent, and where we need improvement (and not just in the obvious). That said, I figure Tobin is probably the biggest key to scouting draft picks, so as long as Taylor has a good plan in place going in, we should be alright.

Our needs are pretty obvious I think.

A. Right side of the OL is awful.

B. LBers in coverage was awful.

C. There's no WRs other than Green and Boyd who can consistently run their routes and make clutch catches, we need a 3rd WR who can BE a WR and DO what WRs do on a routine every down basis. Plus AJ and Boyd are both free agents after 2019. Re-signing them would be a good idea this off season, something the old Mike Brown front office failed to do with Marvin Jones when he was heading into a contract year and Jones wasn't adequately replaced until last year when Boyd found his rhythm.

D. Our TEs resemble the walking dead more than live players.

How the teams fills these holes I have no idea. The front office typically will only sign outside free agents who are of bandaide quality only, and occasionally one of these bandaides turns out to be a keeper, but more times than not they come off before the wound is healed leaving a big sore.

[hotweales]

(01-16-2019, 04:21 PM)ochocincos Wrote: They also got solid production out of Madieu Williams and Keiwan Ratliff was alright.

Their misses have been:
Jerome Simpson
Margus Hunt
Jake Fisher
Devon Still
Kenny Irons (big injury, but never did play)

You'd think with getting at least solid production out of 13 of 18 players over those years, they'd have realized their success in that round and tried to get more picks in that round.

Hunt played pretty well for Indianapolis this season. Makes me think that maybe we just need to be better with player development and putting players in the right scheme to be successful.

[BengalChris]

(01-16-2019, 09:46 PM)hotweales Wrote: Hunt played pretty well for Indianapolis this season. Makes me think that maybe we just need to be better with player development and putting players in the right scheme to be successful.

Or we could just not draft guys who take 6 years to develop. Hunt was a project coming out and to burn a 2nd round pick on a project was not too bright.

For me I wouldn't want to spend any draft picks on projects, I'd want all my picks to be guys I expect to contribute in year 1. Let someone else draft the projects and develop them. If we like them after their 4 year rookie deal is up we can sign them as free agents. Every one of the 53 man roster spots has to be able to contribute or the team is just setting a ceiling right there. That's why I never understood why the team didn't cut Ogbuehi last year and use that roster spot for someone who can actually play football.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

84 Pro Bowlers have been added to the NFL from the last 5 draft classes.

The Bengals have 0 of them despite having 46 draft picks in that time span.

They will be fine without Marvin's drafting. I actually worry a little about Tobin still being around, too.

[*psychdoctor*]

(01-16-2019, 09:51 PM)BengalChris Wrote: Or we could just not draft guys who take 6 years to develop. Hunt was a project coming out and to burn a 2nd round pick on a project was not too bright.

For me I wouldn't want to spend any draft picks on projects, I'd want all my picks to be guys I expect to contribute in year 1. Let someone else draft the projects and develop them. If we like them after their 4 year rookie deal is up we can sign them as free agents. Every one of the 53 man roster spots has to be able to contribute or the team is just setting a ceiling right there. That's why I never understood why the team didn't cut Ogbuehi last year and use that roster spot for someone who can actually play football.

Isn't hunt like 30 something years of age now?  

[Jojo the Circus Boy]

My only hope is the new coaches will evaluate everyone with a clean slate and an open mind on how players can help this team. Ross has been misused(and on a short leash ie. getting benched after his first fumble. Kareem Hunt fumbled his first carry and got the ball first on the next series and said the coaches "weren’t going to give up on me and put me on the bench. Honestly it helped me out.") , Westerman has been riding the bench behind the worst guard in the NFL while looking decent in his few chances, Jefferson never saw a defensive snap despite all 3 starters being hurt, and we finally realized how to use Mixon after Dalton got hurt (3 - 100 yard rushing games after his injury vs. 1 with a healthy Dalton. The biggest knock on Lazor in Miami was he ignored the run game). There seem to be some draft picks that are not being used to their true potential, whether through preconcieved ideas, bad coaching, bad game planning, or being in Marvin's doghouse.

[*ochocincos*]

(01-16-2019, 09:46 PM)hotweales Wrote: Hunt played pretty well for Indianapolis this season. Makes me think that maybe we just need to be better with player development and putting players in the right scheme to be successful.

Any player who doesn't perform well for the Bengals is a bust for them in my eyes.