I feel like we really needed a d-lineman on the first 2 days. It's a bit of a disappointment that we didn't get one, but whatever.
If they can nab Joseph or Wilson in 4, then that will go a long way to strengthening the overall viability of the awful linebacker group. Wouldn't mind Coney or BK, either.
We probably need a QB and a WR, too. I look for them to get Finley if he's still around at 125. Driskel isn't a worthy backup. Wouldn't mind seeing Hakeem Butler either if he's BPA.
(04-27-2019, 12:42 AM)BobJones4980 Wrote: Just because you guys say something over and over doesn't make it fact / true. Nobody on this board and no "Expert" knows how the draft is gonna fall and who is gonna go where or we wouldn't still have CBS's 40th prospect, NFL's 2nd round prospects, and ESPN's 30th ranked players still on the board at pick 65. Also look at all the board members and "experts" mocks right about now, how many of those are knocking it out of the park?
You guys are just in a whiny mood because the guy you wanted didn't get taken, and while Sample may have been a reach, us or the experts have no idea what the 32 teams in the NFL's big boards looked like, so just stop with your "fact" bullshit because its exactly that, bullshit.
Now if everybody can stop whining about the 2nd round, who do we want in round 4? I'm pretty interested in Hakeem Butler with on of those picks.
I never said anything about wanting anyone specific.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(04-27-2019, 12:46 AM)NKURyan Wrote: I'm not saying those guys would be scrubs at all. But do I think any of those corners would play over Dre, WJII, and Dennard? No. Do I think any of those WRs are playing over Green, Boyd, or Ross? Hell no to the first two, and a maybe to Ross. Do I think Sample can see plenty of time on the field even with a healthy Eifert and Uzomah (which is obviously no guarantee)? Yes, I do. I think there's a good chance he contributes in the red zone as a receiver and as a blocker, and I'd bet he helps bust Mixon or Bernard loose on a few long runs.
I'll freely admit that over the rest of their careers a few of the guys taken between Sample and the Bengals next pick will probably have higher upsides even if Sample ends up having a good career here. Would they do it here? Not sure. I feel confident the Bengals will get a more immediate return from Sample than they will most of those others even though it most likely won't be reflected in his stats.
If taking him in the 2nd round cost them severely at other positions and hurt the rest of the draft, I'd be a lot more upset about. I just really don't feel like it has. They still got the linebacker they wanted. A few of the DBs and QBs I was looking at with interest in the 2nd are still sitting there to potentially be grabbed in the 4th. Hell, several LBs that you'd think would've been off of the board by now are *still* sitting there if they want to double up. I just think there's a good chance when we see the whole haul as a group it ends up being fairly in line with what people would've been happy with regardless of the order they were taken in. Does that make sense? I'm genuinely not trying to argue just to argue here, that's just the way I see it as of now.
So, none of the guys we didn't pick would play much in front of the guys in their position group...yet, the guy we picked has a good chance to see plenty of time on the field ahead of a healthy Eifert and Uzomah...
That's kind of exactly what i was alluding to at the end of my last post.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(04-27-2019, 12:39 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Who needs experts. How many blocking TEs were taken after the Bengals picked their guy?
/argument
I'm not sure what this statement is going to prove. A team that would have hypothetically taken Sample after us would not necessarily reach for the next best blocking TE on their board.
I personally like Sample as a prospect and I think he's a good scheme fit and will be a good contributor. We definitely took him a lot higher than the pundits thought he would go, though. At the same time, the pundits thought Jawaan Taylor was a Top 10 pick.
So far I'm satisfied and will remain happy until proven otherwise. Of the 3 drafted thus far not a single player has been proven to be a terrible pick nor player. None have been busts yet and on the same hand none have been selected to go to the probowl.
I know many of you are disappointed and wanted certain players drafted, but until they actually take the field and prove or disprove themselves there's really nothing to get worked up about.
So you don't like the 2nd round pick.. So what? What has he done in the NFL to make you believe he cannot play up to standards? College and the pros are completely different games and in the case of Drew it may very well be just a case of a TE who was underused by the Washington State coaching staff. That's happened a LOT over the years where certain players who go on to great NFL careers were barely used in college. Once in the pros under different coaching staffs they get used a lot more and go on to have great careers.
In short, they're good players until proven otherwise.
In the immortal words of my old man, "Wait'll you get to be my age!"
Chicago sounds rough to the maker of verse, but the one comfort we have is Cincinnati sounds worse. ~Oliver Wendal Holmes Sr.
(04-27-2019, 01:09 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: I never said anything about wanting anyone specific.
Where did I say you did? I said you guys clearly didn't get the guy you wanted, whether you mentioned who that was or not doesn't matter, its clear you did not get the guy you wanted.
I'll just leave you alone to ramble, maybe get some sleep because man you are talking some nonsense over a guy that has never taken a snap in the NFL and 0 people can tell you what he will do but don't let that stop you.
(04-27-2019, 12:46 AM)NKURyan Wrote: If taking him in the 2nd round cost them severely at other positions and hurt the rest of the draft, I'd be a lot more upset about. I just really don't feel like it has. They still got the linebacker they wanted. A few of the DBs and QBs I was looking at with interest in the 2nd are still sitting there to potentially be grabbed in the 4th. Hell, several LBs that you'd think would've been off of the board by now are *still* sitting there if they want to double up. I just think there's a good chance when we see the whole haul as a group it ends up being fairly in line with what people would've been happy with regardless of the order they were taken in. Does that make sense? I'm genuinely not trying to argue just to argue here, that's just the way I see it as of now.
Yes, it makes perfect sense in hindsight. But before that, you're essentially throwing a pick away and hoping it works out. The NFL of today isn't the NFL of 1999 when RK went in the 2nd round to the Falcons. Think about how the TE position has changed in just the last few years and where it's headed. No one drafts a blocking TE with the 2nd pick today when you can put just about anyone there to do the job, ala, Roland and Fisher.
No one except the Bengals, because Taylor comes from a system where that type of TE is used. There aren't very many teams that use TEs in that way anymore.
I'm not upset they picked him because i think he sucks. I'm not even upset they picked him period.
One thing is for sure. They will never get to see a 2nd round (insert position here), from this draft, inducted into the HOF, because they wasted the pick on a blocking TE that even they say "should be adequate" in the receiving game--who fits their current system.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(04-27-2019, 01:14 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: So, none of the guys we didn't pick would play much in front of the guys in their position group...yet, the guy we picked has a good chance to see plenty of time on the field ahead of a healthy Eifert and Uzomah...
That's kind of exactly what i was alluding to at the end of my last post.
Do you disagree? It seems pretty obvious that Sample will have a role as a blocker in this offense.
(04-27-2019, 01:25 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: No one drafts a blocking TE with the 2nd pick today when you can put just about anyone there to do the job, ala, Roland and Fisher.
Or maybe they, you know, wanted someone who could do the job well for the next 4+ years? Plugging Roland and Fisher in sure worked out fabulously.
(04-27-2019, 12:55 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: I don't think it's just that Sample is a terrific inline blocker, which will be an important element - and specific need - in Taylor's offense. It's also that he's a very high character and work ethic guy, as well as being a film room junkie and a self proclaimed perfectionist in practice. I think all those things combined made Sample the pick. He fits what Taylor needs from a schematic point of view, but also from a locker room / culture mentality as well.
I can agree that he was picked too high based the on projections. He might have well been there in the 3rd. Hell, he might have still been available in the 4th. But, if Taylor views him as an important cog in his system and wanted to make sure he got him, I personally don't have an issue with them trading back and taking him in the 2nd, even if it's too high for him based on rankings.
Well, that's where we differ. Zac Taylor hasn't done jack squat as a HC in the NFL yet, so he has no cache to make a decision to draft a blocking TE in the 2nd round without it being questioned. A blocking TE isn't even an integral part of today's NFL. TE are weapons that you use to exploit mismatches, not to stand at the end of the line and block for a running back.
I get that people will go to their grave defending the team. I'm going to remain in the group that watches and cheers but will just as quickly slam them when they do something stupid. They don't deserve anything else.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
Some combination of guys I’d like to see drafted in the 4th-7th
Hakeem Butler
Blake Cashman
Ben Burr-Kirven
Hjalte Froholdt
Phil Haynes
Oli Udoh
Sutton Smith
Drue Tranquill
Amani Hooker
Sheldrick Redwine
Bryce Love
Maxx Crosby
D’Andre Walker
Gary Jennings
Hunter Renfrow
Cortez Broughton
Albert Huggins
(04-27-2019, 01:25 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Yes, it makes perfect sense in hindsight. But before that, you're essentially throwing a pick away and hoping it works out. The NFL of today isn't the NFL of 1999 when RK went in the 2nd round to the Falcons. Think about how the TE position has changed in just the last few years and where it's headed. No one drafts a blocking TE with the 2nd pick today when you can put just about anyone there to do the job, ala, Roland and Fisher.
No one except the Bengals, because Taylor comes from a system where that type of TE is used. There aren't very many teams that use TEs in that way anymore.
I'm not upset they picked him because i think he sucks. I'm not even upset they picked him period.
One thing is for sure. They will never get to see a 2nd round (insert position here), from this draft, inducted into the HOF, because they wasted the pick on a blocking TE that even they say "should be adequate" in the receiving game--who fits their current system.
Running an extra OT out there sort of defeats the purpose of a blocking TE. The opposition knows you're trying to pound it, so they go to a heavier personnel group. With a blocking TE, you can still run your 11 personnel group on offense and force the defense to respond with nickel and have the advantage pounding the rock and the D still has to play honest and account for him in the passing game.
(04-27-2019, 01:36 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Well, that's where we differ. Zac Taylor hasn't done jack squat as a HC in the NFL yet, so he has no cache to make a decision to draft a blocking TE in the 2nd round without it being questioned. A blocking TE isn't even an integral part of today's NFL. TE are weapons that you use to exploit mismatches, not to stand at the end of the line and block for a running back.
I get that people will go to their grave defending the team. I'm going to remain in the group that watches and cheers but will just as quickly slam them when they do something stupid. They don't deserve anything else.
The league is cyclical. We saw the Patriots go old school, smash mouth in the playoffs and win the SB trotting a FB out there. The Rams put up a ton of points last year by pounding the rock and running play action out of 11 personnel.
(04-27-2019, 01:07 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: Yep, and every NFL message board is pretty much the same on draft night...crazy! But that's what makes it fun!
Yuuuuuuuuuuuuup
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(04-27-2019, 01:40 AM)t3r3e3 Wrote: Some combination of guys I’d like to see drafted in the 4th-7th
Hakeem Butler
Blake Cashman
Ben Burr-Kirven
Hjalte Froholdt
Phil Haynes
Oli Udoh
Sutton Smith
Drue Tranquill
Amani Hooker
Sheldrick Redwine
Bryce Love
Maxx Crosby
D’Andre Walker
Gary Jennings
Hunter Renfrow
Cortez Broughton
Albert Huggins
Out of this group, I like Tranquill, Burr-Kirven (even with Pratt), and Butler. Butler is a man-child hard to cover. I do not know about his routes however. D' Andre Walker if not Burr-Kriven.
-Paul Brown “When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less.”
(04-27-2019, 01:15 AM)Whatever Wrote: I'm not sure what this statement is going to prove. A team that would have hypothetically taken Sample after us would not necessarily reach for the next best blocking TE on their board.
I personally like Sample as a prospect and I think he's a good scheme fit and will be a good contributor. We definitely took him a lot higher than the pundits thought he would go, though. At the same time, the pundits thought Jawaan Taylor was a Top 10 pick.
But a team that's looking for a blocking TE isn't likely to swing 180 and take a pass-catcher.
I don't really care about the pundits. I'm talking about my opinion that they took him 2 rounds too high based on what he is and what the NFL is today.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(04-27-2019, 01:18 AM)grampahol Wrote: So far I'm satisfied and will remain happy until proven otherwise. Of the 3 drafted thus far not a single player has been proven to be a terrible pick nor player. None have been busts yet and on the same hand none have been selected to go to the probowl.
I know many of you are disappointed and wanted certain players drafted, but until they actually take the field and prove or disprove themselves there's really nothing to get worked up about.
So you don't like the 2nd round pick.. So what? What has he done in the NFL to make you believe he cannot play up to standards? College and the pros are completely different games and in the case of Drew it may very well be just a case of a TE who was underused by the Washington State coaching staff. That's happened a LOT over the years where certain players who go on to great NFL careers were barely used in college. Once in the pros under different coaching staffs they get used a lot more and go on to have great careers.
In short, they're good players until proven otherwise.
As usual, thank you Captain Obvious.
Then again, what's the use in discussing anything that hasn't happened, until it actually happens? We should all just become ineffectual drones that wait for an outcome and then react in our usual apathetic way dot dot dot
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(04-27-2019, 12:42 AM)BobJones4980 Wrote: Just because you guys say something over and over doesn't make it fact / true. Nobody on this board and no "Expert" knows how the draft is gonna fall and who is gonna go where or we wouldn't still have CBS's 40th prospect, NFL's 2nd round prospects, and ESPN's 30th ranked players still on the board at pick 65. Also look at all the board members and "experts" mocks right about now, how many of those are knocking it out of the park?
You guys are just in a whiny mood because the guy you wanted didn't get taken, and while Sample may have been a reach, us or the experts have no idea what the 32 teams in the NFL's big boards looked like, so just stop with your "fact" bullshit because its exactly that, bullshit.
Now if everybody can stop whining about the 2nd round, who do we want in round 4? I'm pretty interested in Hakeem Butler with on of those picks.
(04-27-2019, 01:09 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: I never said anything about wanting anyone specific.
(04-27-2019, 01:22 AM)BobJones4980 Wrote: Where did I say you did? I said you guys clearly didn't get the guy you wanted, whether you mentioned who that was or not doesn't matter, its clear you did not get the guy you wanted.
I'll just leave you alone to ramble, maybe get some sleep because man you are talking some nonsense over a guy that has never taken a snap in the NFL and 0 people can tell you what he will do but don't let that stop you.
Uhhh, right there?
lol. Words matter. When you say someone is in a "whiney mood" because "the guy you wanted didn't get taken", there's a very clear implication.
There is no whiney or guy i wanted. Just the opinion that they took a guy in the 2nd that they could have taken in the 4th.
Talk about rambling nonsense. Sheeesh.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
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