Where is Ross?

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-30-2019, 03:06 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Which game was that?

I can't remember but it was a midseason game. Don't think it was the Falcons game, i think it was one we lost.

Gonna have to look but i remember arguing it at the time on here.

Ross had 1 TD but was underthrown twice and one was an interception. I remember if Dalton just put the ball out there a little further Ross would of had a chance at 3 TD's in that game. I am going off of memory though so i could be wrong.

[Bengalfan4life27c]

Desean Jackson struggled his first 2 years. The Goat Jerry Rice was a bum his rookie year. hope isnt lost yet

[McC]

It will not take long this year to see what an utter failure the end of Marvin's regime was. Everyone will look much better, including John Ross. Better schemes and better coaching will make all the difference in the world. And how refreshing it will be to see a Bengals team finally reach its true potential.

[Tiger Teeth]

(05-30-2019, 03:51 PM)McC Wrote: It will not take long this year to see what an utter failure the end of Marvin's regime was.  Everyone will look much better, including John Ross.   Better schemes and better coaching will make all the difference in the world.  And how refreshing it will be to see a Bengals team finally reach its true potential.

Careful, you're gettin' me all tingly.

[McC]

(05-30-2019, 03:55 PM)Tiger Teeth Wrote: Careful, you're gettin' me all tingly.

I'm gonna whisper this so it stays between you and me---

ZT is a coaching savant.  The football gods finally said enough is enough.

[*ochocincos*]

(05-30-2019, 03:20 PM)Bengalfan4life27c Wrote: Desean Jackson struggled his first 2 years. The Goat Jerry Rice was a bum his rookie year. hope isnt lost yet

There's gotta be someone thinking, "But Jerry Rice wasn't even a Top 10 pick and Jackson wasn't even a first rounder! A top 10 pick shouldn't struggle at all!!!!"

[*ochocincos*]

(05-30-2019, 03:51 PM)McC Wrote: It will not take long this year to see what an utter failure the end of Marvin's regime was.  Everyone will look much better, including John Ross.   Better schemes and better coaching will make all the difference in the world.  And how refreshing it will be to see a Bengals team finally reach its true potential.

I still don't have high hopes for the defense even though I'm excited to see the offense flourish.

[3wt]

I'm as hopeful as the next guy.   But I have no confidence in Ross.  I just don't think he's got the football smarts or mental toughness.

I truly hopes he proves me wrong, but I'm pretty sure he's a bust.

My son is convinced that he has just been really badly coached and poorly utilized.   I'm clinging to that.

[Shake n Blake]

(05-30-2019, 09:22 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Ok just wanted to make sure because some people say WR3 but really mean the 3rd receiving option.
I too think the depth isn't great, but Ross was drafted to be that true WR3. He didn't contribute as a rookie, and he was a great RZ threat last year but not much else. Hoping this year he blossoms.
With that said, the WR3 was the 4th or 5th option in the passing game for the past decade, as evidenced by a bigger emphasis on a receiving TE and also a pass catching RB. This makes it hard for a WR3 to contribute as much as we'd like and also makes the team invest less in the position.

Yeah it certainly didn't help that Ross hasn't lived up to expectations thus far.

[McC]

(05-30-2019, 04:23 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I still don't have high hopes for the defense even though I'm excited to see the offense flourish.

I believe the defense won't be top notch this year but it will be good enough to not sink the ship.  Next year, with a couple more additions, it will be top notch.

[Catmandude123]

(05-30-2019, 11:18 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I hope he does well, but I don't think anything short of him being on the bench all year is going to break him.  I can see us 365 days from now talking about how excited we are to see what he can finally do now that he's been elevated to the #2 WR role, unless this year is a total disaster for him.

I haven't studied the cap situation, but who else could be our WR#2 going into 2020?  I'm not convinced Boyd would refuse all outside offers to stay here, if that's his option.

You may take this a little farther and ask who will be the WR#1. AJ is getting a little long in the tooth and his foot could turn into a chronic problem. Green , Boyd, and Ross look good on paper for the near future but things could change drastically. We could be as bad off as the Ravens have been the last few years.

[Catmandude123]

(05-30-2019, 01:52 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Maybe we are thinking of a different game. In the game i was talking about Dalton badly underthrown Ross twice, one of which resulted into an ugly interception. I just think Dalton needs to get used to Ross's speed, obviously he was not used to it last season especially early.

But yeah Ross definately needs to work on the juggs machine. His hands have not been up to par.

Probably comes down to them reading the defense differently. There is no connection between them. The receiver and QB have to read the same thing. Put Ross in the same room with Dalton at camp and let them build some kind of connection  that gets them on the same page.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-30-2019, 04:23 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I still don't have high hopes for the defense even though I'm excited to see the offense flourish.

Why? We added Tem our new Linebacker coach and Germaine Pratt a 3 down, fast Linebacker that can cover and tackle very well. The LB's were the main problem last year, Haslett has been a terrible LB coach and our LB's were injured all year and Burfict fell off a cliff. We are not that far off from what i am seeing, i just think our guys need to stay healthy and tackle well.

I hope Lou is really concentrating on tackling up and down the Defense.

If Lou is a bad DC i guess the Defense could struggle, but i think we have a lot of good to great players for him to work with and we are pretty young. I hear we are playing really fast and the players are loving these uptempo OTA's.

Also if the Offense is flourishing it will only help the Defense stay fresh.

(05-30-2019, 05:11 PM)McC Wrote: I believe the defense won't be top notch this year but it will be good enough to not sink the ship.  Next year, with a couple more additions, it will be top notch.

Might take a bit for the new coaches and players to mesh, i could see this or Lou isn't good.

Lou has done good with talented players but as a whole he doesn't have the best resume, i guess this is where i question the Defense. The players will have to be put in good positions and we need to play aggressive with more blitzing, more man to man and be unpredictable.

(05-30-2019, 07:03 PM)Catmandude123 Wrote: Probably comes down to them reading the defense differently. There is no connection between them. The receiver and QB have to read the same thing. Put Ross in the same room with Dalton at camp and let them build some kind of connection  that gets them on the same page.

That definately could be the biggest reason, still think a QB has to get used to a really fast Receiver. I was seeing how Goff was really putting that ball way out in front of Cooks and letting him go get it last season and that is the way Dalton needs to throw the ball to Ross. Atleast on those go routes.

[*ochocincos*]

(05-31-2019, 12:45 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Why? We added Tem our new Linebacker coach and Germaine Pratt a 3 down, fast Linebacker that can cover and tackle very well. The LB's were the main problem last year, Haslett has been a terrible LB coach and our LB's were injured all year and Burfict fell off a cliff. We are not that far off from what i am seeing, i just think our guys need to stay healthy and tackle well.

I hope Lou is really concentrating on tackling up and down the Defense.

If Lou is a bad DC i guess the Defense could struggle, but i think we have a lot of good to great players for him to work with and we are pretty young. I hear we are playing really fast and the players are loving these uptempo OTA's.

Also if the Offense is flourishing it will only help the Defense stay fresh.


Might take a bit for the new coaches and players to mesh, i could see this or Lou isn't good.

Lou has done good with talented players but as a whole he doesn't have the best resume, i guess this is where i question the Defense. The players will have to be put in good positions and we need to play aggressive with more blitzing, more man to man and be unpredictable.


That definately could be the biggest reason, still think a QB has to get used to a really fast Receiver. I was seeing how Goff was really putting that ball way out in front of Cooks and letting him go get it last season and that is the way Dalton needs to throw the ball to Ross. Atleast on those go routes.

Why? Anarumo was like the 5th choice for DC and didn't do a good job at DC when given opportunity. He's good with DBs which is why he was put back to DB coach when Gase arrived in Miami and then DB coach again in NY. And I question Amarumo (or at least his influence) for not prioritizing interior pass rushing more in the offseason. I think the Bengals end up with the same problem they've had for years, which is no true pass rush threat inside next to Atkins.

As for Tem Lukabu, is he a great LB coach? I know he was the LB coach back at Rutgers when Kaseem Greene was a stud there but I haven't heard him having a lot of impact since then. So I guess I'm skeptical there too. He too, similar to Haslett, may not really get much out of the LBs. I also don't agree with not adding a better LB in FA when there were multiple opportunities to do so.

Could I definitely be wrong and Anarumo and/or Lukabu could be great additions to the coaching staff? Absolutely. However, previous experience doesn't really give a lot of confidence that they will drastically turn around points of weakness from a year ago.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-31-2019, 01:03 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Why? Anarumo was like the 5th choice for DC and didn't do a good job at DC when given opportunity. He's good with DBs which is why he was put back to DB coach when Gase arrived in Miami and then DB coach again in NY. And I question Amarumo (or at least his influence) for not prioritizing interior pass rushing more in the offseason. I think the Bengals end up with the same problem they've had for years, which is no true pass rush threat inside next to Atkins.

As for Tem Lukabu, is he a great LB coach? I know he was the LB coach back at Rutgers when Kaseem Greene was a stud there but I haven't heard him having a lot of impact since then. So I guess I'm skeptical there too. He too, similar to Haslett, may not really get much out of the LBs. I also don't agree with not adding a better LB in FA when there were multiple opportunities to do so.

Could I definitely be wrong and Anarumo and/or Lukabu could be great additions to the coaching staff? Absolutely. However, previous experience doesn't really give a lot of confidence that they will drastically turn around points of weakness from a year ago.

Agree on Lou, my biggest question on the team. We will see if he sees what was blatantly obvious last season with our Defense. We suck in the zone with the players we have, we are good man to man, we need to tackle better in the Secondary namely Kirkpatrick. The Linebackers need to recognize dump offs and shut them down and tackle better. With Pratt and Davis added and Preston and Vigil healthy we should be much better under Tem.

Tem Lukabu coached Von Miller and has a great resume. Don't have it in front of me but him and Nick Eason were the two Defensive coaches i really liked that we brought in. I think that Lukabu will definately be better than Haslett, how much better is the question.

[Joelist]

If the game we are thinking of is the same one Ross caused two turnovers - one by quitting on a route before the play even developed and the other by not cutting his route according to the play design. Remember everyone - even Andy - was yelling at him over the second one.

Ross issues so far in the pros have been part utilization and part mental on his part. And I would add schematic too as with all our receivers - no coaching to be aware of the pocket and none to break back to the ball.

[cj1895]

(05-30-2019, 03:20 PM)Bengalfan4life27c Wrote: Desean Jackson struggled his first 2 years. The Goat Jerry Rice was a bum his rookie year. hope isnt lost yet

Had to make an account to respond.  This is patently untrue.  Desean Jackson was a stud from the get-go.

"Jackson finished a successful rookie season with two receiving touchdowns and a team-leading 62 receptions (the most by an Eagles rookie wide-receiver, second only to tight end Keith Jackson's 81 in 1988, and joining Jackson and Don Looney as the only Eagles to lead the team in receptions their rookie seasons).[28] His 912 receiving yards surpassed Keith Jackson's rookie record of 869.[29] He also led the NFL with 50 punt returns (an Eagles' rookie record and 3rd all time) for 440 yards (third in the NFL, fifth ever by an Eagle, and an Eagles' rookie record)."


"Jackson ended the season as the Eagles' leading receiver with 1,167 yards.[42] He was selected to the 2009 Pro Bowl as a starting wide receiver and a kick returner, the first time in Pro Bowl history that a player was selected at two different positions.[43][44] At the Pro Bowl, Jackson caught six passes for a team-high 101 yards and two touchdowns, including a 58-yard catch-and-run touchdown pass from McNabb. He was selected to the Sporting News' All-Pro team as a punt returner for the 2009 season, averaging 15.2 yards per punt return in 2009 as the league leader."



John Ross can't carry Desean Jackson's jock strap.  His comparison is almost identical to Laquon Treadwell who is a massive bust and sucks.


"Despite having high hopes following the draft, Treadwell's rookie year was limited as he only appeared in nine games and finished the season with only one reception for 15 yards."



"In the 2017 season, he recorded 20 receptions for 200 receiving yards.[14]"


I would love for John Ross to turn the corner, history and trends say that's not going to happen.  Hopefully we can get some return by trading him.

[*jason*]

(06-01-2019, 01:02 PM)cj1895 Wrote: Had to make an account to respond.  This is patently untrue.  Desean Jackson was a stud from the get-go.

"Jackson finished a successful rookie season with two receiving touchdowns and a team-leading 62 receptions (the most by an Eagles rookie wide-receiver, second only to tight end Keith Jackson's 81 in 1988, and joining Jackson and Don Looney as the only Eagles to lead the team in receptions their rookie seasons).[28] His 912 receiving yards surpassed Keith Jackson's rookie record of 869.[29] He also led the NFL with 50 punt returns (an Eagles' rookie record and 3rd all time) for 440 yards (third in the NFL, fifth ever by an Eagle, and an Eagles' rookie record)."


"Jackson ended the season as the Eagles' leading receiver with 1,167 yards.[42] He was selected to the 2009 Pro Bowl as a starting wide receiver and a kick returner, the first time in Pro Bowl history that a player was selected at two different positions.[43][44] At the Pro Bowl, Jackson caught six passes for a team-high 101 yards and two touchdowns, including a 58-yard catch-and-run touchdown pass from McNabb. He was selected to the Sporting News' All-Pro team as a punt returner for the 2009 season, averaging 15.2 yards per punt return in 2009 as the league leader."



John Ross can't carry Desean Jackson's jock strap.  His comparison is almost identical to Laquon Treadwell who is a massive bust and sucks.


"Despite having high hopes following the draft, Treadwell's rookie year was limited as he only appeared in nine games and finished the season with only one reception for 15 yards."



"In the 2017 season, he recorded 20 receptions for 200 receiving yards.[14]"


I would love for John Ross to turn the corner, history and trends say that's not going to happen.  Hopefully we can get some return by trading him.

I remember someone saying that we got a steal with Cody Core because he played in Treadwell's shadow... Lord have mercy ...

In fairness I think most of us thought Treadwell would be pretty good.

[*jason*]

(05-31-2019, 01:27 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Agree on Lou, my biggest question on the team. We will see if he sees what was blatantly obvious last season with our Defense. We suck in the zone with the players we have, we are good man to man, we need to tackle better in the Secondary namely Kirkpatrick. The Linebackers need to recognize dump offs and shut them down and tackle better. With Pratt and Davis added and Preston and Vigil healthy we should be much better under Tem.

Tem Lukabu coached Von Miller and has a great resume. Don't have it in front of me but him and Nick Eason were the two Defensive coaches i really liked that we brought in. I think that Lukabu will definately be better than Haslett, how much better is the question.

Hell... Just watching Tem I like him. He's a teacher, and is enthusiastic as all get out.

[HarleyDog]

(06-01-2019, 01:21 PM)jason Wrote: Hell... Just watching Tem I like him. He's a teacher, and is enthusiastic as all get out.

Definitely fits the bill of where this team is going.