Follow this model for rebuild: 49ers

[*SHRacerX*]

Listed below is the last four drafts for the SF 49ers, who are now 7-0.  They have given up 23 points in their last four games, COMBINED.  During that time, they scored 111 points.  Clearly, they are a team on the rise.  Before anyone throws out how they got their QB first, Jimmy G's injury allowed them to tank another season and get Bosa, a clear Defensive MVP candidate.  Their first round picks went DE, T, DE, and DE in the last four drafts.  

Now, in FREE AGENCY, The 49ers have added six new players, including Dee Ford, Kwon Alexander, Tevin Coleman, Jason Verrett, David Mayo, and Jordan Matthews...just in 2019.  They creatively structured the contracts in such a way as they couldn't get hurt too badly if the top dollar investments didn't pan out, but Ford and Alexander have helped to transform this defense.  

First round picks on a T and a Guard helped to solidify their offensive line as well.  The Bengals could have one key position in Jonah Williams, but Billy Price has been a massive disappointment.  As big a whiff as he appears to be, they might have found something in Hopkins.  

If the Bengals could draft a guy like Chase Young to pair opposite Hubbard (and let's face it, Young might sell some tickets and that HAS to be on their minds based on what the stands look like this year), and potentially upgrade the RT position as well in Rd 2,  the team could have the basis of a solid foundation on the offensive line.  The defensive line appears to have a good, young nucleus in the middle but needs help on the outside (much like the 49ers did).  Add some pressure and the back end of the defense doesn't look so awful.  

They could address the LB position and Guard position in Free Agency.  And it would take at least one very good Guard and two very good FA LBs to make a difference, but they could absolutely do it.  

Do these things and THEN address the QB position (my dream would be the big, strong-armed,  fast, and elusive Justin Fields in the 2021 draft.  

2019
1 2 Nick Bosa DE Ohio State
2 36 Deebo Samuel WR South Carolina
3 67 Jalen Hurd WR Baylor
4 110 Mitch Wishnowsky P Utah
5 148 Dre Greenlaw LB Arkansas
6 176 Kaden Smith TE Stanford
6 183 Justin Skule T Vanderbilt
6 198 Tim Harris CB Virginia

2018 - SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 9 Mike McGlinchey T Notre Dame
2 44 Dante Pettis WR Washington
3 70 Fred Warner LB Brigham Young
3 95 Tarvarius Moore SAF Southern Mississippi
4 128 Kentavius Street DE North Carolina State
5 142 D.J. Reed CB Kansas State
6 184 Marcell Harris SAF Florida
7 223 Jullian Taylor DT Temple
7 240 Richie James WR Middle Tennessee State

2017 - SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 3 Solomon Thomas DE Stanford
1 31 Reuben Foster LB Alabama
3 66 Ahkello Witherspoon CB Colorado
3 104 C.J. Beathard QB Iowa
4 121 Joe Williams RB Utah
5 146 George Kittle TE Iowa
5 177 Trent Taylor WR Louisiana Tech
6 202 Pita Taumoepenu LB Utah
6 198 D.J. Jones DT Mississippi
7 229 Adrian Colbert SAF Miami (Fla.)

2016 Draft
1 7 DeForest Buckner DE Oregon
1 28 Joshua Garnett G Stanford
3 68 Will Redmond CB Mississippi State
4 133 Rashard Robinson CB LSU
5 142 Ronald Blair DE Appalachian State
5 145 John Theus T Georgia
5 174 Fahn Cooper T Mississippi
6 207 Jeff Driskel QB Louisiana Tech
6 211 Kelvin Taylor RB Florida
6 213 Aaron Burbridge WR Michigan State
7 249 Prince Charles Iworah CB Western Kentucky

[seahawkscheat]

(10-28-2019, 10:51 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Listed below is the last four drafts for the SF 49ers, who are now 7-0.  They have given up 23 points in their last four games, COMBINED.  During that time, they scored 111 points.  Clearly, they are a team on the rise.  Before anyone throws out how they got their QB first, Jimmy G's injury allowed them to tank another season and get Bosa, a clear Defensive MVP candidate.  Their first round picks went DE, T, DE, and DE in the last four drafts.  

Now, in FREE AGENCY, The 49ers have added six new players, including Dee Ford, Kwon Alexander, Tevin Coleman, Jason Verrett, David Mayo, and Jordan Matthews...just in 2019.  They creatively structured the contracts in such a way as they couldn't get hurt too badly if the top dollar investments didn't pan out, but Ford and Alexander have helped to transform this defense.  

First round picks on a T and a Guard helped to solidify their offensive line as well.  The Bengals could have one key position in Jonah Williams, but Billy Price has been a massive disappointment.  As big a whiff as he appears to be, they might have found something in Hopkins.  

If the Bengals could draft a guy like Chase Young to pair opposite Hubbard (and let's face it, Young might sell some tickets and that HAS to be on their minds based on what the stands look like this year), and potentially upgrade the RT position as well in Rd 2,  the team could have the basis of a solid foundation on the offensive line.  The defensive line appears to have a good, young nucleus in the middle but needs help on the outside (much like the 49ers did).  Add some pressure and the back end of the defense doesn't look so awful.  

They could address the LB position and Guard position in Free Agency.  And it would take at least one very good Guard and two very good FA LBs to make a difference, but they could absolutely do it.  

Do these things and THEN address the QB position (my dream would be the big, strong-armed,  fast, and elusive Justin Fields in the 2021 draft.  

2019
1 2 Nick Bosa DE Ohio State
2 36 Deebo Samuel WR South Carolina
3 67 Jalen Hurd WR Baylor
4 110 Mitch Wishnowsky P Utah
5 148 Dre Greenlaw LB Arkansas
6 176 Kaden Smith TE Stanford
6 183 Justin Skule T Vanderbilt
6 198 Tim Harris CB Virginia

2018 - SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 9 Mike McGlinchey T Notre Dame
2 44 Dante Pettis WR Washington
3 70 Fred Warner LB Brigham Young
3 95 Tarvarius Moore SAF Southern Mississippi
4 128 Kentavius Street DE North Carolina State
5 142 D.J. Reed CB Kansas State
6 184 Marcell Harris SAF Florida
7 223 Jullian Taylor DT Temple
7 240 Richie James WR Middle Tennessee State

2017 - SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 3 Solomon Thomas DE Stanford
1 31 Reuben Foster LB Alabama
3 66 Ahkello Witherspoon CB Colorado
3 104 C.J. Beathard QB Iowa
4 121 Joe Williams RB Utah
5 146 George Kittle TE Iowa
5 177 Trent Taylor WR Louisiana Tech
6 202 Pita Taumoepenu LB Utah
6 198 D.J. Jones DT Mississippi
7 229 Adrian Colbert SAF Miami (Fla.)

2016 Draft
1 7 DeForest Buckner DE Oregon
1 28 Joshua Garnett G Stanford
3 68 Will Redmond CB Mississippi State
4 133 Rashard Robinson CB LSU
5 142 Ronald Blair DE Appalachian State
5 145 John Theus T Georgia
5 174 Fahn Cooper T Mississippi
6 207 Jeff Driskel QB Louisiana Tech
6 211 Kelvin Taylor RB Florida
6 213 Aaron Burbridge WR Michigan State
7 249 Prince Charles Iworah CB Western Kentucky

[seahawkscheat]

What free agent wants to play for the bungles? Where is our GM? Let’s face it this team won’t be Super Bowl contenders for the next 40 years

[*ochocincos*]

(10-28-2019, 10:51 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Listed below is the last four drafts for the SF 49ers, who are now 7-0.  They have given up 23 points in their last four games, COMBINED.  During that time, they scored 111 points.  Clearly, they are a team on the rise.  Before anyone throws out how they got their QB first, Jimmy G's injury allowed them to tank another season and get Bosa, a clear Defensive MVP candidate.  Their first round picks went DE, T, DE, and DE in the last four drafts.  

Now, in FREE AGENCY, The 49ers have added six new players, including Dee Ford, Kwon Alexander, Tevin Coleman, Jason Verrett, David Mayo, and Jordan Matthews...just in 2019.  They creatively structured the contracts in such a way as they couldn't get hurt too badly if the top dollar investments didn't pan out, but Ford and Alexander have helped to transform this defense.  

First round picks on a T and a Guard helped to solidify their offensive line as well.  The Bengals could have one key position in Jonah Williams, but Billy Price has been a massive disappointment.  As big a whiff as he appears to be, they might have found something in Hopkins.  

If the Bengals could draft a guy like Chase Young to pair opposite Hubbard (and let's face it, Young might sell some tickets and that HAS to be on their minds based on what the stands look like this year), and potentially upgrade the RT position as well in Rd 2,  the team could have the basis of a solid foundation on the offensive line.  The defensive line appears to have a good, young nucleus in the middle but needs help on the outside (much like the 49ers did).  Add some pressure and the back end of the defense doesn't look so awful.  

They could address the LB position and Guard position in Free Agency.  And it would take at least one very good Guard and two very good FA LBs to make a difference, but they could absolutely do it.  

Do these things and THEN address the QB position (my dream would be the big, strong-armed,  fast, and elusive Justin Fields in the 2021 draft.  

2019
1 2 Nick Bosa DE Ohio State
2 36 Deebo Samuel WR South Carolina
3 67 Jalen Hurd WR Baylor
4 110 Mitch Wishnowsky P Utah
5 148 Dre Greenlaw LB Arkansas
6 176 Kaden Smith TE Stanford
6 183 Justin Skule T Vanderbilt
6 198 Tim Harris CB Virginia

2018 - SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 9 Mike McGlinchey T Notre Dame
2 44 Dante Pettis WR Washington
3 70 Fred Warner LB Brigham Young
3 95 Tarvarius Moore SAF Southern Mississippi
4 128 Kentavius Street DE North Carolina State
5 142 D.J. Reed CB Kansas State
6 184 Marcell Harris SAF Florida
7 223 Jullian Taylor DT Temple
7 240 Richie James WR Middle Tennessee State

2017 - SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 3 Solomon Thomas DE Stanford
1 31 Reuben Foster LB Alabama
3 66 Ahkello Witherspoon CB Colorado
3 104 C.J. Beathard QB Iowa
4 121 Joe Williams RB Utah
5 146 George Kittle TE Iowa
5 177 Trent Taylor WR Louisiana Tech
6 202 Pita Taumoepenu LB Utah
6 198 D.J. Jones DT Mississippi
7 229 Adrian Colbert SAF Miami (Fla.)

2016 Draft
1 7 DeForest Buckner DE Oregon
1 28 Joshua Garnett G Stanford
3 68 Will Redmond CB Mississippi State
4 133 Rashard Robinson CB LSU
5 142 Ronald Blair DE Appalachian State
5 145 John Theus T Georgia
5 174 Fahn Cooper T Mississippi
6 207 Jeff Driskel QB Louisiana Tech
6 211 Kelvin Taylor RB Florida
6 213 Aaron Burbridge WR Michigan State
7 249 Prince Charles Iworah CB Western Kentucky

Packers did similar. 
They were 6-9-1 last year.
They are 6-1 now.
They removed their HC and got a new one.
They were active in FA the way it should be done, by getting 3-4 good starters in Amos, Turner, Preston Smith, and ZaDarius Smith.
They removed a few aging veterans in Cobb, Matthews, and Daniels to allow it to happen.

Bengals haven't done the necessary moves in FA to have a big turnaround.
And regarding the draft, they've missed on a lot of prospects. Whether it's because of the player selected is just bad, they didn't fit the scheme, weren't developed properly, or a mix of all the above. 
If they had hit on at least 50% of Ogbuehi, Fisher, Price, Dawson, Jefferson, Vigil, Willis then this team would be (much) better than it is.

[THE PISTONS]

So under Personnel & Scouting...the 49ers have 21 people listed. That doesn't count John Lynch who is their GM. And they have a football analytics department in addition that has a salary cap specialist. Another 8 employees. So 29 total!

The Bengals have 8 people listed for Player Personnel...which appears to include their Analytics Dept...

49ers Personnel & Scouting
Adam Peters Vice President of Player Personnel
Martin Mayhew Vice President of Player Personnel
Keena Turner Vice President and Senior Advisor to the General Manager
Ran Carthon Director, Pro Personnel
Ethan Waugh Director, College Scouting
R.J. Gillen Pro Personnel Scout
Justin Chabot National Scout
Chip Flanagan National Scout
Tariq Ahmad Area Scout
Dominic DeCicco Area Scout
Ryan Kessenich Area Scout
Steve Rubio Area Scout
John Stevenson Area Scout
Joshua Williams Area Scout
Salli Clavelle Pro Personnel Analyst
Fred Gammage III Pro Personnel Analyst
Crowley Hanlon Pro Personnel Coordinator
Travis Dauro College Scouting Coordinator
Thomas Tupa Scouting Assistant
Warren Ball Scouting Assistant
Steve Slowik Scouting Assistant

49ers Football Operations
Brian Hampton Director, Football Administration & Analytics
Kwesi Adofo-Mensah Director, Football R&D
Steve Wagner Manager, Football Systems
Demitrius Washington Manager, Football R&D
Neil Mayfield Software Developer
Dyng Au Software Developer
Richard Buffum Contract Administrator
Jeffrey Diamond Salary Cap Analyst

Bengals Player Personnel
Duke Tobin Director of Player Personnel
Mike Potts Scouting Director (College)
Steven Radicevic Scouting Director (Pro)
Bill Tobin Personnel Executive
Andrew Johnson Scout
Christian Sarkisian Scout
Geoff Smith Scouting Technology Consultant
Debbie LaRocco Personnel Assistant

[THE PISTONS]

(10-28-2019, 10:57 AM)seahawkscheat Wrote: What free agent wants to play for the bungles? Where is our GM? Let’s face it this team won’t be Super Bowl contenders for the next 40 years

Yes - Basically the 49ers have 29 people handling the draft and free agency. The Bengals have 8.

We hired a QB Coach as our HC and a bunch of coaches from terrible teams and gave them massive promotions.

Our team is notoriously cheap. Our coaching is bad. Our staffing is small. Our drafting has been bad. We don't like to sign free agents.

[MEBengalsFan]

(10-28-2019, 10:51 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Listed below is the last four drafts for the SF 49ers, who are now 7-0.  They have given up 23 points in their last four games, COMBINED.  During that time, they scored 111 points.  Clearly, they are a team on the rise.  Before anyone throws out how they got their QB first, Jimmy G's injury allowed them to tank another season and get Bosa, a clear Defensive MVP candidate.  Their first round picks went DE, T, DE, and DE in the last four drafts.  

Now, in FREE AGENCY, The 49ers have added six new players, including Dee Ford, Kwon Alexander, Tevin Coleman, Jason Verrett, David Mayo, and Jordan Matthews...just in 2019.  They creatively structured the contracts in such a way as they couldn't get hurt too badly if the top dollar investments didn't pan out, but Ford and Alexander have helped to transform this defense.  

First round picks on a T and a Guard helped to solidify their offensive line as well.  The Bengals could have one key position in Jonah Williams, but Billy Price has been a massive disappointment.  As big a whiff as he appears to be, they might have found something in Hopkins.  

If the Bengals could draft a guy like Chase Young to pair opposite Hubbard (and let's face it, Young might sell some tickets and that HAS to be on their minds based on what the stands look like this year), and potentially upgrade the RT position as well in Rd 2,  the team could have the basis of a solid foundation on the offensive line.  The defensive line appears to have a good, young nucleus in the middle but needs help on the outside (much like the 49ers did).  Add some pressure and the back end of the defense doesn't look so awful.  

They could address the LB position and Guard position in Free Agency.  And it would take at least one very good Guard and two very good FA LBs to make a difference, but they could absolutely do it.  

Do these things and THEN address the QB position (my dream would be the big, strong-armed,  fast, and elusive Justin Fields in the 2021 draft.  

2019
1 2 Nick Bosa DE Ohio State
2 36 Deebo Samuel WR South Carolina
3 67 Jalen Hurd WR Baylor
4 110 Mitch Wishnowsky P Utah
5 148 Dre Greenlaw LB Arkansas
6 176 Kaden Smith TE Stanford
6 183 Justin Skule T Vanderbilt
6 198 Tim Harris CB Virginia

2018 - SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 9 Mike McGlinchey T Notre Dame
2 44 Dante Pettis WR Washington
3 70 Fred Warner LB Brigham Young
3 95 Tarvarius Moore SAF Southern Mississippi
4 128 Kentavius Street DE North Carolina State
5 142 D.J. Reed CB Kansas State
6 184 Marcell Harris SAF Florida
7 223 Jullian Taylor DT Temple
7 240 Richie James WR Middle Tennessee State

2017 - SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 3 Solomon Thomas DE Stanford
1 31 Reuben Foster LB Alabama
3 66 Ahkello Witherspoon CB Colorado
3 104 C.J. Beathard QB Iowa
4 121 Joe Williams RB Utah
5 146 George Kittle TE Iowa
5 177 Trent Taylor WR Louisiana Tech
6 202 Pita Taumoepenu LB Utah
6 198 D.J. Jones DT Mississippi
7 229 Adrian Colbert SAF Miami (Fla.)

2016 Draft
1 7 DeForest Buckner DE Oregon
1 28 Joshua Garnett G Stanford
3 68 Will Redmond CB Mississippi State
4 133 Rashard Robinson CB LSU
5 142 Ronald Blair DE Appalachian State
5 145 John Theus T Georgia
5 174 Fahn Cooper T Mississippi
6 207 Jeff Driskel QB Louisiana Tech
6 211 Kelvin Taylor RB Florida
6 213 Aaron Burbridge WR Michigan State
7 249 Prince Charles Iworah CB Western Kentucky

The issue is as of late the Bengals have been failing at drafting players. If the Bengals had successful drafts the last 3 years they wouldn't be 0-8 and we still would have ML around here. The thing is though the Bengals made bad drafting decisions and it is showing. Its like the Browns ended up making the picks for the Bengals or something the last few years. 

[THE PISTONS]

(10-28-2019, 11:14 AM)MEBengalsFan Wrote: The issue is as of late the Bengals have been failing at drafting players. If the Bengals had successful drafts the last 3 years they wouldn't be 0-8 and we still would have ML around here. The thing is though the Bengals made bad drafting decisions and it is showing. Its like the Browns ended up making the picks for the Bengals or something the last few years. 

Right...and one wonders why teams like the 49ers, Patriots, and Steelers have 2 to 3 times the personnel in the areas that handle draft and scouting.

[Big Boss]

We aren't as active in free agency or in trades as the 49ers are, so this model doesn't apply to us.

[*bengalfan74*]

(10-28-2019, 11:14 AM)MEBengalsFan Wrote: The issue is as of late the Bengals have been failing at drafting players. If the Bengals had successful drafts the last 3 years they wouldn't be 0-8 and we still would have ML around here. The thing is though the Bengals made bad drafting decisions and it is showing. Its like the Browns ended up making the picks for the Bengals or something the last few years. 

Bingo  

It's been said hundreds of times but anyways, this team is still reeling from the giant whiff of the 2015 draft. Of those 9 picks 1 is still on the team - Uzomah. For a team that relies so heavily on the draft a FUBAR like that resonates for years after.

Then take the 2017 draft into consideration. #1 Ross he can't stay on the field. #2 Mixon umm ok #3 Willis - gone #4 Lawson - see Ross #4A Malone - gone #4B Glasgow ok.

Then 2018 #1 Price, serious questions #2 Bates still hope I guess ? #3A Hubbard - good one #3B Jefferson - gone #4 Walton - gone.

2015 - 6 picks in first four rounds - none still on team

2017 - again 6 picks in first four rounds - 2 are gone, 2 can't stay on the field

2018 - 5 picks in first four rounds - 2 are gone, and 1 is regressing badly
 
You simply can't miss on that many of your picks in the first 4 rounds of three drafts !

[THE PISTONS]

Let's face it, the Bengals probably feel the 49ers are following our model (Model Model).

[*bengalfan74*]

(10-28-2019, 11:20 AM)Big Boss Wrote: We aren't as active in free agency or in trades as the 49ers are, so this model doesn't apply to us.

Right, we aren't active at all in free agency other than bargain bin type players.

[THE PISTONS]

(10-28-2019, 11:45 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Right, we aren't active at all in free agency other than bargain bin type players.

Oh...we were interested in Kwon Alexander (probably because he was injured)...until they saw the price tag.

[Au165]

The free agents are the last piece of the rebuild. We are 2-3 years away from finishing it off with FA's we need a couple solid drafts first, but we also need to admit we are rebuilding before any of that can start.

[THE PISTONS]

(10-28-2019, 12:36 PM)Au165 Wrote: The free agents are the last piece of the rebuild. We are 2-3 years away from finishing it off with FA's we need a couple solid drafts first, but we also need to admit we are rebuilding before any of that can start.

Easier said than done. EVERY TEAM needs solid drafts. We have an extremely small scouting staff.

With all the cap space we have...we need to sign 2-3 impact free agents.

This whole 'Draft, draft, draft...then finish the team off with 1-2 free agents isn't realistic.' Look at teams like the 49ers, Packers, and Bills. The Bills added 22 free agents! 22!

[*psychdoctor*]

I think the Bengals should draft Young at #1 pick if he is there, even though I think Burrow is a special QB. Young may be the best college player at this time. Bengals could still get QB round 2 or 3. If they wait until round 3 and grabb Eason or Hurts, the team could snag Kindley at guard in round 2.

Young DE
Kindley Guard
Eason/Hurts QB

[THE PISTONS]

(10-28-2019, 12:59 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: I think the Bengals should draft Young at #1 pick if he is there, even though I think Burrow is a special QB.  Young may be the best college player at this time.  Bengals could still get QB round 2 or 3.  If they wait until round 3 and grabb Eason or Hurts, the team could snag Kindley at guard in round 2.  

Young DE
Kindley Guard
Eason/Hurts QB

I'm pretty skeptical that we'll end up with the 1st pick in the draft.

I do kind of like Hurts.

One thing on a DE that plays in is IF he pans out...you have to be willing to give him $15-20 million a year in 5 years. I don't know if the Bengals would do that.

[Big Boss]

Chase Young in the first and Jacob Eason in the second sounds like a solid plan. I just don't know if Eason gets to the second round (assuming he even declares). Plus, he strikes me as a pure pocket passer, which is entirely predicated on having a great offensive line - which we do not currently have.

[Au165]

(10-28-2019, 12:47 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Easier said than done. EVERY TEAM needs solid drafts. We have an extremely small scouting staff.

With all the cap space we have...we need to sign 2-3 impact free agents.

This whole 'Draft, draft, draft...then finish the team off with 1-2 free agents isn't realistic.' Look at teams like the 49ers, Packers, and Bills. The Bills added 22 free agents! 22!

The Bills were a playoff team two years ago with basically the same defense, they finished off the team adding some offensive weapons. The Packers just finished off draft,draft,draft with a couple FA's on defense. The 49'ers just spent a couple seasons drafting and building and finished off with a couple FA's.

The context of this whole thread is draft and then finish off with FA's. You are literally highlighting why that is the actual model to follow, you simply have to do it correctly. The Browns are showing what happens when you don't finish it off correctly with the right pieces instead you choose the flashy pieces. 

[J24]

(10-28-2019, 12:36 PM)Au165 Wrote: The free agents are the last piece of the rebuild. We are 2-3 years away from finishing it off with FA's we need a couple solid drafts first, but we also need to admit we are rebuilding before any of that can start.

We're one of the youngest teams in the NFL the rebuilding has begun. What we need to do is actually address the needs on this team to improve. There is no reason this rebuild should take that long.