Should have 2 wins now

[*PhilHos*]

Think about this. The last 2 weeks the defense played well enough to win. The last 3 weeks the running game has been more than existent; it's been good. All that we needed to win the last 2 weeks was competent QB play. Didn't need elite level QB; or a great QB; or even good QB play. Just competent QB play and we'd be sitting here moaning about how we might not get the first pick in the draft.

I'm all for moving on from Dalton - I'm on the Draft Burrow train right now - but man, even with him playing like he was earlier this year I think we win the last 2 games.

Here's to hoping Dolegala gets his shot and never becomes a backup QB ever again.

Sent from my LG-Q710AL using Tapatalk

[CJD]

I know right?

Thank God they didn't play Dalton in these last two games, otherwise we may have lost the #1 pick.

Finley is a gift to us all.

[THE PISTONS]

With competent coaching...we could have 4-5 wins this year. I know it's hard to see in the statistical mess we're in...

A coaching staff that doesn't throw a 1 yard pass on 3rd and long constantly.

There is a funny trend:
-People wanted Marvin out. Zac's hired and terrible. People realize how good Marvin was.
-People blamed Andy. He's out. Finley is terrible. Now people realize how good Andy was.

I think losing to the worst Steelers roster they've had in the past 20 years does that though.

[*ochocincos*]

The defense might be starting to come around. At least somewhat. They still desperately need LBs.

The offense, on the other hand, is still terrible, especially given this is supposed to be an offense-minded HC who thought it best for him to call the offensive plays.

Now, maybe with Green, Ross, and Dalton, this offense would run better, but not by much. Ross will be eligible to return Dec 2. It'd be great to actually see AJ Green play this season. With the Bengals having room to win 1 game and still have the top pick, perhaps we will see everyone play maybe against the Jets or Dolphins.

[*Nately120*]

(11-25-2019, 11:00 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: With competent coaching...we could have 4-5 wins this year. I know it's hard to see in the statistical mess we're in...

A coaching staff that doesn't throw a 1 yard pass on 3rd and long constantly.

There is a funny trend:
-People wanted Marvin out. Zac's hired and terrible. People realize how good Marvin was.
-People blamed Andy. He's out. Finley is terrible. Now people realize how good Andy was.

I think losing to the worst Steelers roster they've had in the past 20 years does that though.

Moving on from Hue and Dalton is like leaving your boring but steady office job and moving to LA to try to make it big in show biz.  We're currently sitting on the corner with a cup asking for change, at the moment...we aren't even out there waiting tables and pitching our demo tape and headshots to people...or whatever.

Side note, what do you think the odds are that 40 years from now a fan of a team with a rookie HC who is 0-11 says "Hey, in 2019 Zac Taylor was 0-11 and he ended up being a HOF head coach, so we can't give up hope!"  I mean, are we done talking about how bad Tom Landry and Sam Wyche started out, now?

[CJD]

(11-25-2019, 11:00 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: With competent coaching...we could have 4-5 wins this year. I know it's hard to see in the statistical mess we're in...

A coaching staff that doesn't throw a 1 yard pass on 3rd and long constantly.

There is a funny trend:
-People wanted Marvin out. Zac's hired and terrible. People realize how good Marvin was.
-People blamed Andy. He's out. Finley is terrible. Now people realize how good Andy was.

I think losing to the worst Steelers roster they've had in the past 20 years does that though.

I don't think many people are realizing how "good" Andy or Marvin was. You can realize what you have is bad without wishing you could go back to something else that was slightly less bad.


The truth is we need a brand new QB and coach that are qualified for their positions in the NFL.

Zac was a reach when he was hired. How many coaches go straight from position coach to head coach without a single full season as a coordinator? I can think of 2 who have, admittedly, worked out in Reid and Coughlin. But it almost never happens and the reasoning seems pretty obvious.

I don't know who should be our coach next year, but I hope it isn't Zac and I wouldn't take Marvin (or Andy) back in 2020 either.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-25-2019, 11:12 AM)ochocincos Wrote: The defense might be starting to come around. At least somewhat. They still desperately need LBs.

The offense, on the other hand, is still terrible, especially given this is supposed to be an offense-minded HC who thought it best for him to call the offensive plays.

Now, maybe with Green, Ross, and Dalton, this offense would run better, but not by much. Ross will be eligible to return Dec 2. It'd be great to actually see AJ Green play this season. With the Bengals having room to win 1 game and still have the top pick, perhaps we will see everyone play maybe against the Jets or Dolphins.

It's hard to really evaluate the defense.

The Raiders offense scored 3 points against the Jets this week and Carr got benched.

And the Steelers had their 4th string QB, with no Juju, Conner, and Pouncey...and they still drove it 90 yards for a TD against us where 2 of our defenders looked like the Keystone Cops. They still ran the ball very effectively against us.

One worry I have is that we play 5 weak teams in our last 6 games...that this team will show some statistical improvement and that management will stand pat.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-25-2019, 11:18 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Moving on from Hue and Dalton is like leaving your boring but steady office job and moving to LA to try to make it big in show biz.  We're currently sitting on the corner with a cup asking for change, at the moment...we aren't even out there waiting tables and pitching our demo tape and headshots to people...or whatever.

Side note, what do you think the odds are that 40 years from now a fan of a team with a rookie HC who is 0-11 says "Hey, in 2019 Zac Taylor was 0-11 and he ended up being a HOF head coach, so we can't give up hope!"  I mean, are we done talking about how bad Tom Landry and Sam Wyche started out, now?

Haha! Nice!

I think the only way Zac Taylor turns out great is if Joe Burrow comes in and is a HOF QB from the beginning of his career and somehow doesn't need coaching to be great.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-25-2019, 11:20 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: I don't think many people are realizing how "good" Andy or Marvin was. You can realize what you have is bad without wishing you could go back to something else that was slightly less bad.


The truth is we need a brand new QB and coach that are qualified for their positions in the NFL.

Zac was a reach when he was hired. How many coaches go straight from position coach to head coach without a single full season as a coordinator? I can think of 2 who have, admittedly, worked out in Reid and Coughlin. But it almost never happens and the reasoning seems pretty obvious.

I don't know who should be our coach next year, but I hope it isn't Zac and I wouldn't take Marvin (or Andy) back in 2020 either.

NFL coaching carousel: Ex-Bengals coach Marvin Lewis drawing buzz for 2020 openings

Lewis had a record of success coaching a Bengals team that is winless since his departure

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-coaching-carousel-ex-bengals-coach-marvin-lewis-drawing-buzz-for-2020-openings/

[CJD]

(11-25-2019, 11:26 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: NFL coaching carousel: Ex-Bengals coach Marvin Lewis drawing buzz for 2020 openings

Lewis had a record of success coaching a Bengals team that is winless since his departure

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-coaching-carousel-ex-bengals-coach-marvin-lewis-drawing-buzz-for-2020-openings/

If anyone wants him, they can have him.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-25-2019, 11:27 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: If anyone wants him, they can have him.

IF he went to an organization with a good Front Office...he likely could have success.

It's hard to be good at coaching, scouting, game-planning, PR, etc. It's A LOT to ask.

Look...we have a new coach that we plopped into the same situation...with a similar roster, and a year of draft picks, and some new free agents...and he can't win 1 single game.

[CJD]

(11-25-2019, 11:36 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: IF he went to an organization with a good Front Office...he likely could have success.

It's hard to be good at coaching, scouting, game-planning, PR, etc. It's A LOT to ask.

Look...we have a new coach that we plopped into the same situation...with a similar roster, and a year of draft picks, and some new free agents...and he can't win 1 single game.

Oh don't get me wrong. If my only 2 choices were Zac or Marvin, I'd begrudgingly take Marvin. But that doesn't mean I think he'd make this team good. I was hoping we could get an actual offensive mind to lead this team, not a fake one like Zac. It's a shame that we wasted this year when Dunlap, Green and Atkins are nearing the end of their careers.

But you're justified in your cynicism regarding this front office. It does make me wonder if its even possible to successful in Cincinnati given how many road blocks there are for anyone who works here.

[*bfine32*]

Just look how Andy carved up the Steeler's D earlier in the year.

[*psychdoctor*]

(11-25-2019, 11:00 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: With competent coaching...we could have 4-5 wins this year. I know it's hard to see in the statistical mess we're in...

A coaching staff that doesn't throw a 1 yard pass on 3rd and long constantly.

There is a funny trend:
-People wanted Marvin out. Zac's hired and terrible. People realize how good Marvin was.
-People blamed Andy. He's out. Finley is terrible. Now people realize how good Andy was.

I think losing to the worst Steelers roster they've had in the past 20 years does that though.

But with 4-5 wins, the Bengals would not be in great position to fix some bigger problems.  I know people are tired of losing but this is necessary to fix some roster positions and to change over the roster.  

I know you do not like Taylor but he will be the Bengals coach for the next two years at least.  

[THE PISTONS]

(11-25-2019, 02:17 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: But with 4-5 wins, the Bengals would not be in great position to fix some bigger problems.  I know people are tired of losing but this is necessary to fix some roster positions and to change over the roster.  

I know you do not like Taylor but he will be the Bengals coach for the next two years at least.  

Say we finish 4-12...would we be less likely to fix the roster?

Well, we could select possibly Chase Young, Jerry Jeudy at WR, or a big time Tackle. Let's say we add Jeudy at WR.

Then you let AJ Green go. Tag and trade him IF you can. He's likely to have missed his last 25 games while practicing 1 official practice.

Sign a Tackle like Conklin. A Guard like Scherff. Waive Glenn. (Then you basically used Green and Glenn's salaries to upgrade the line!) But, this is where it falls apart. The Bengals don't sign big names like this.

Sign a TE like Hunter Henry.

Then, in the 2nd Round select Jordan Love. He has an absolute canon. Start Dalton next year.

This would be a young offense...capable of a 5+ year run together.

QB: Dalton/Love/Finley
RB: Mixon/Bernard
WR: Boyd/Jeudy/Ross/Tate/Erickson
TE: Henry/Uzomah/Sample
Line: Conklin/Scherff/Hopkins/Miller/Williams

Let's say we get a 2nd and 4th for Green. Draft a LB in the 2nd Round like Shaq Quarterman. Sign another in free agency. (I've yet to look through the list, but must have speed and coverage ability.)

[*psychdoctor*]

(11-25-2019, 02:25 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Say we finish 4-12...would we be less likely to fix the roster?

Well, we could select possibly Chase Young, Jerry Jeudy at WR, or a big time Tackle. Let's say we add Jeudy at WR.

Then you let AJ Green go. Tag and trade him IF you can. He's likely to have missed his last 25 games while practicing 1 official practice.

Sign a Tackle like Conklin. A Guard like Scherff. Waive Glenn. (Then you basically used Green and Glenn's salaries to upgrade the line!) But, this is where it falls apart. The Bengals don't sign big names like this.

Sign a TE like Hunter Henry.

Then, in the 2nd Round select Jordan Love. He has an absolute canon. Start Dalton next year.

This would be a young offense...capable of a 5+ year run together.

QB: Dalton/Love/Finley
RB: Mixon/Bernard
WR: Boyd/Jeudy/Ross/Tate/Erickson
TE: Henry/Uzomah/Sample
Line: Conklin/Scherff/Hopkins/Miller/Williams

Let's say we get a 2nd and 4th for Green. Draft a LB in the 2nd Round like Shaq Quarterman. Sign another in free agency. (I've yet to look through the list, but must have speed and coverage ability.)

5 wins would place the bengals outside the chance to get an elite player IMO.  Bengals will trade Dalton for sure.  Dalton is gone.  Green should have been traded for a 3rd rounder but now the Bengals will extend his contract for another 4 years at 15 mil per.  Or, they will franchise him, create animosity which Mike Brown does with former first rounders.  

This roster needs complete tear down and build.  The Front Office needs to change.  Tobin needs to be fired.  Mike Brown must leave the organization and forsake his leadership status.  

Bengals have a tough sell coming up in the negotiating of the contract lease.  City will not put up with this senile old fart who has failed to win a single playoff game in over 30 years by that time.  Brown must go.  

[THE PISTONS]

(11-25-2019, 02:31 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: 5 wins would place the bengals outside the chance to get an elite player IMO.  Bengals will trade Dalton for sure.  Dalton is gone.  Green should have been traded for a 3rd rounder but now the Bengals will extend his contract for another 4 years at 15 mil per.  Or, they will franchise him, create animosity which Mike Brown does with former first rounders.  

This roster needs complete tear down and build.  The Front Office needs to change.  Tobin needs to be fired.  Mike Brown must leave the organization and forsake his leadership status.  

Bengals have a tough sell coming up in the negotiating of the contract lease.  City will not put up with this senile old fart who has failed to win a single playoff game in over 30 years by that time.  Brown must go.  

There are elite players all through the draft. We just miss. Or don't develop them.

Any plan we have should center around signing Conklin at Tackle and Scherff at Guard. Pay them whatever it takes!

You get those 2 guys, you have a good line then.

re: QB - And Fred has posted this...but most elite QB's aren't Top 3 picks.

[THE PISTONS]

This guy is projected to go #7 for instance:

Detroit Lions: Isaiah Simmons
School: Clemson
Position: LB
Notes: Matt Patricia comes from New England where they love versatile defenders. I love what Simmons can do on the field.
He’s an undersized LB but perfect for what today’s NFL is. He has a nose for the ball and makes plays all over the field.

[Catmandude123]

(11-25-2019, 11:00 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: With competent coaching...we could have 4-5 wins this year. I know it's hard to see in the statistical mess we're in...

A coaching staff that doesn't throw a 1 yard pass on 3rd and long constantly.

There is a funny trend:
-People wanted Marvin out. Zac's hired and terrible. People realize how good Marvin was.
-People blamed Andy. He's out. Finley is terrible. Now people realize how good Andy was.

I think losing to the worst Steelers roster they've had in the past 20 years does that though.

So 4-6 wins with nothing to look forward to in the draft is better than having the #1 pick? I believe the same posters would be crying even if we had four wins. Some people wouldn't be happy even if they were hung with a new rope. BTW Dalton is 3-13 against the Steelers. Finley is 0-1. No matter how many offensive players they are missing the defense is the same.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-25-2019, 02:35 PM)Catmandude123 Wrote: So 4-6 wins with nothing to look forward to in the draft is better than having the #1 pick? I believe the same posters would be crying even if we had four wins. Some people wouldn't be happy even if they were hung with a new rope. BTW Dalton is 3-13 against the Steelers. Finley is 0-1. No matter how many offensive players they are missing the defense is the same.

It's a complex question. Yes - I like having the number 1 pick...but it's hard to look past the fact that this staff can't get a single win. They're inept.

I do not trust them to develop a #1 pick.