Offensive Line Grades Through 12 Weeks

[THE PISTONS]

Well, our offensive line is terrible. Maybe the worst we've had over the past few years. Even Hopkins has regressed.

Bobby Hart - 54.7 - You can't find these guys at Wal-Mart!
John Miller - 58.8 - Mediocre
Hopkins - 60.6 - He started the year strong, but has been struggling lately. Falling towards the 50's which isn't good.
Billy Price - 39.9 - Terrible - Bust
MJ - 35.1 - Worse than Price somehow...yet he took Price's job.
John Jerry - 57.2
Cordy Glenn - 60.1
Alex Redmond - 50.6

We literally might need 5 new lineman. We're not Jonah Williams away from having a good line.

This likely isn't a 1 year fix either. (We're already 3 years into this and it keeps getting worse.)

[BengalChris]

(12-07-2019, 01:28 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Well, our offensive line is terrible. Maybe the worst we've had over the past few years. Even Hopkins has regressed.

Bobby Hart - 54.7 - You can't find these guys at Wal-Mart!
John Miller - 58.8 - Mediocre
Hopkins -  60.6 - He started the year strong, but has been struggling lately. Falling towards the 50's which isn't good.
Billy Price - 39.9 - Terrible - Bust
MJ - 35.1 - Worse than Price somehow...yet he took Price's job.
John Jerry - 57.2
Cordy Glenn - 60.1
Alex Redmond - 50.6

We literally might need 5 new lineman. We're not Jonah Williams away from having a good line.

This likely isn't a 1 year fix either. (We're already 3 years into this and it keeps getting worse.)

Yet Mike Brown dishes out 3 year contracts to scrubs as if he has money to burn. The scouting of these players has to be bad.

Mr 8 teams in 7 years Webb gets a 3 year deal. WTF?

Worst RT in the league gets a 3 year deal to stay. WTF?

Gio gets top 15 RB money and has the stats of a weak backup. WTF?

It's either sucking by design or just plain one bad front office move after another. And the coaches sure are going along with it, so they suck just as much as the front office does.

 

[Fan_in_Kettering]

This is on the coach. Every offensive linemen on the Bengals’ roster was a stud in college — even Billy Price. When players get to Cincinnati they get worse with sloppy technique.

[*Synric*]

(12-07-2019, 09:14 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: This is on the coach.  Every offensive linemen on the Bengals’ roster was a stud in college — even Billy Price.  When players get to Cincinnati they get worse with sloppy technique.

No offensive line coach in the the world can make Billy Price's arms grow longer length is his biggest issue.

[*pally*]

Only 1 of them has played all 100% of the offensive snaps and that is Trey Hopkins. Bobby Hart missed some snaps in the 1st Baltimore game. Everyone else has missed multiple games.
I would hate to figure out how many OL combinations they have had this season. Putting together a consistent line will help even the worst player because it allows everyone to get into a rhythm. But yeah, Houston we have a problem.
IMO, the coach that MUST be replaced is Turner. Where I can see glimpses of the future in other position groups. I just don't see any flashes whatsoever from the OL.

[BengalsRocker]

(12-07-2019, 09:45 AM)Synric Wrote: No offensive line coach in the the world can make Billy Price's arms grow longer length is his biggest issue.

Gotta get one of these for the workout facility.  And by workout facility...  I mean Mike Brown's friend's basement.

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-07-2019, 09:14 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: This is on the coach.  Every offensive linemen on the Bengals’ roster was a stud in college — even Billy Price.  When players get to Cincinnati they get worse with sloppy technique.

There is a lot of truth here.  I do believe you need to have a super talented spot on your line....say, the right side, where the QB knows 99% of the time pressure will be pushed outside and upfield and the rushing attack can get those short yardage plays executed.  Right now, it comes at every angle to the QB and the rushing attack doesn't drive anyone.  

I am hoping they draft an OT to play the right side, which might allow Hart to move insider or just be relegated to a backup role.  They really need to sign a FA G that is not past his prime and help solidify the inside of the line. I have no interest in relying on the passive Cordy Glenn to move inside.  He seems like he is just drawing a paycheck.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-07-2019, 09:45 AM)Synric Wrote: No offensive line coach in the the world can make Billy Price's arms grow longer length is his biggest issue.

Joe Thomas had relatively short arms.  Technique is everything.  And I though Price was one of the strongest centers to ever come out of the draft?  

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-07-2019, 10:33 AM)pally Wrote: Only 1 of them has played all 100% of the offensive snaps and that is Trey Hopkins.  Bobby Hart missed some snaps in the 1st Baltimore game.  Everyone else has missed multiple games.  
I would hate to figure out how many OL combinations they have had this season.  Putting together a consistent line will help even the worst player because it allows everyone to get into a rhythm.  But yeah, Houston we have a problem.
IMO, the coach that MUST be replaced is Turner.  Where I can see glimpses of the future in other position groups.  I just don't see any flashes whatsoever from the OL.

I forget exactly what the tweet said now, but some media guy said "Interesting first year for coach Taylor":  and listed such things as Boling, Westerman, and Taylor retiring, Glenn not playing and having some issue with the team, and a few other things.  Trouble seems to follow this guy.  I would rather he be gone.  

[*Synric*]

(12-07-2019, 10:41 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Joe Thomas had relatively short arms.  Technique is everything.  And I though Price was one of the strongest centers to ever come out of the draft?  

Price is struggling with his length big time. He's been trying to make up for his lack of length by lunging alot. When he does use proper technique the defensive linemen are creating space with their longer arms so he cant even reach them.

Edit: Also Joe Thomas had shorter arms for a tackle at 33.75 inches less than the prototypical 34 inches. Jonah William's has 33.5....Billy Price has 32 inch arms. Bodine struggles with similar issues he was at 32.5

[Nicomo Cosca]

Disappointed to see Hopkins has fallen off a bit. I still don’t think center is a big need with how capable he’s looked at times. We should definitely re-sign him.

If Jonah Williams is as good as advertised that’s at least two spots locked down.

[*bengalfan74*]

(12-07-2019, 10:39 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: There is a lot of truth here.  I do believe you need to have a super talented spot on your line....say, the right side, where the QB knows 99% of the time pressure will be pushed outside and upfield and the rushing attack can get those short yardage plays executed.  Right now, it comes at every angle to the QB and the rushing attack doesn't drive anyone.  

I am hoping they draft an OT to play the right side, which might allow Hart to move insider or just be relegated to a backup role.  They really need to sign a FA G that is not past his prime and help solidify the inside of the line. I have no interest in relying on the passive Cordy Glenn to move inside.  He seems like he is just drawing a paycheck.  

Yep,

They just have to go out and get a top shelf free agent Olineman this off season to pair with Williams, Hopkins, and whoever they draft. And get rid of Turner.

[I_C_DeadPeople]

We just need 4 or 5 new OL, a better OL coach and better scouts and we will be fine. Mikey is all over this because he really wants to win. He mumbles that every day in the corner office in between naps.

[SuperBowlBound!]

(12-07-2019, 10:50 AM)Synric Wrote: Price is struggling with his length big time. He's been trying to make up for his lack of length by lunging alot. When he does use proper technique the defensive linemen are creating space with their longer arms so he cant even reach them.

Edit: Also Joe Thomas had shorter arms for a tackle at 33.75 inches less than the prototypical 34 inches. Jonah William's has 33.5....Billy Price has 32 inch arms. Bodine struggles with similar issues he was at 32.5

In comparison David DeCastro arm length is 32.375" & Frank Ragnow has a 33.13" arm length.

Geno Atkins and Aaron Darnold arm lengths are 32"

Unless you are talking 30" arm length I am not sure it matters as much as technique.

[*pally*]

The vast majority of offensive linemen coming out of college these days are projects. The dearth of quality starters plagues the league. Even teams with good lines often have zero depth. It is essential that the OL coach be able to coach technique and adjust on the fly

[spazz70]

(12-07-2019, 02:03 AM)BengalChris Wrote: Yet Mike Brown dishes out 3 year contracts to scrubs as if he has money to burn. The scouting of these players has to be bad.

Mr 8 teams in 7 years Webb gets a 3 year deal. WTF?

Worst RT in the league gets a 3 year deal to stay. WTF?

Gio gets top 15 RB money and has the stats of a weak backup. WTF?

It's either sucking by design or just plain one bad front office move after another. And the coaches sure are going along with it, so they suck just as much as the front office does.

 

I do not know why people do not get this...The new CBA REQUIRED teams to spend 85% of their cap space every year and a 4 year average totaling 89% over 4 years....The Bengals were against the wall...They HAD TO SPEND THE MONEY this year as not to get in trouble with the league thus all of these stupid contracts like Hart and GIO being absurdly overpaid....The are not going to admit it though...they were way below the required amount and no FAs wanted to come here except people like Webb.

[Luvnit2]

(12-07-2019, 11:43 AM)spazz70 Wrote: I do not know why people do not get this...The new CBA REQUIRED teams to spend 85% of their cap space every year and a 4 year average totaling 89% over 4 years....The Bengals were against the wall...They HAD TO SPEND THE MONEY this year as not to get in trouble with the league thus all of these stupid contracts like Hart and GIO being absurdly overpaid....The are not going to admit it though...they were way below the required amount and no FAs wanted to come here except people like Webb.

Could you supply facts to back up your cap space claims? How does a team carry over cap money every year (to eventually spend to the max) and have nor spent enough when teams like Browns had 100 million left over in one year (you can only carry over a certain amount and not full 100 million) and not have spend issues?

Please show us the Bengals spend versus the other 31 NFL teams the past 4 years.

[SunsetBengal]

(12-07-2019, 09:45 AM)Synric Wrote: No offensive line coach in the the world can make Billy Price's arms grow longer length is his biggest issue.

That is a true statement.  However, Price's biggest asset was his ability to get up field, and deliver aggressive blocks at the second level.  I don't see why the Bengal coaches don't adjust their play calling and blocking schemes to work toward their players' strengths, rather than asking them to get better at things they're not so good at.

[spazz70]

(12-07-2019, 11:56 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Could you supply facts to back up your cap space claims? How does a team carry over cap money every year (to eventually spend to the max) and have nor spent enough when teams like Browns had 100 million left over in one year (you can only carry over a certain amount and not full 100 million) and not have spend issues?

Please show us the Bengals spend versus the other 31 NFL teams the past 4 years.

You have to spend 85% of your cap space by a certain date on your roster and 89% over a four year period according to the last CBA in 2011...You can have 100 million in cap space but you have to spend it before the season starts...there is a certain date, I forget, that your roster has to be at this number or you are penalized   I am not comparing what people spend,....I am comparing WHAT they spend it on....The Browns went out and traded for OBJ and added his salary making their salary cap number smaller.....We signed GIO to a crappy/overpaid contract and our salary cap got smaller...See how that works?  It is because the Brown family are incompetent in these areas and no FAs want to come here unless they are on their last option with no other place to go or a 3rd stringer with some tie to a new coach or a hometown boy coming back to play that is average or past his prime.......This organization sucks at handling these situations......

[*pally*]

(12-07-2019, 12:03 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That is a true statement.  However, Price's biggest asset was his ability to get up field, and deliver aggressive blocks at the second level.  I don't see why the Bengal coaches don't adjust their play calling and blocking schemes to work toward their players' strengths, rather than asking them to get better at things they're not so good at.

I suspect its because of the inconsistency of strengths among the group.  For instance, you can't scheme to get Price downfield if the others can't support that.  I saw an article this year, that said Zac had to throw out half the playbook, because of the inabilities of the OL