What happens?

[grampahol]

(04-25-2020, 06:14 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yeah, I heard the same thing last year when I questioned Zac and his staff.  I was told I was only being critical because I liked Marvin.  I was too stupid to see that our offense would explode and we would be better with our exciting new young head coach.  Dalton's career was going to be rejuvenated.

Remember that?

Wait, are you trying to tell us that Zac did not in fact rejuvinate Andy Dalton's career last year?  I was under the impression that every team was more than willing to trade all the first round picks, the moon, stars and the sun and their first born male children to get Andy..
Obviously something went wrong with that notion.  

[TheCincinnatiKid]

To be fair to ol' Fred here, I'm, also pretty sure we've seen practically the same thread in the past a bunch of times, only for that offence not to go on to break all records.

But... what I will say is I really like the WR group and I think we're giving Burrow a really good chance of succeeding in his rookie year. If AJ and Ross go down injured again though the group is (obviously) a lot less stacked. Still, I'm very excited about our offence.

[impactplaya]

The drafting of Tee Higgins is really Smart insurance this season because of what people have brought up.Ross
And AJ have played less than a full season together
Last year once you get past Ross and AJ ,there is no true home run threat at WR.
If Ross or AJ gets hurt this year then you have Higgins to slide in there and you still have your
Vertical guy.
The great thing about these WRs is that they can be moved around the formation
ZT is simply taking the schematics that made JB ecell at LSU and implementing it at this level

[fredtoast]

(04-25-2020, 06:30 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: And in 2019 Dalton was 2-11 without AJ. Simple

2019 does not count because there is no sample group of Dalton WITH Green to compare results.  Dalton would most likely have been 2-11 even with Green playing.

For example in 2015 Green was 10-3 with Dalton and only 2-1 without him.  Obviously Green is not the one determining who wins.

[TheSweetness]

(04-26-2020, 10:40 AM)TheCincinnatiKid Wrote: To be fair to ol' Fred here, I'm, also pretty sure we've seen practically the same thread in the past a bunch of times, only for that offence not to go on to break all records.

But... what I will say is I really like the WR group and I think we're giving Burrow a really good chance of succeeding in his rookie year. If AJ and Ross go down injured again though the group is (obviously) a lot less stacked. Still, I'm very excited about our offence.

Agreed. This thread happens literally every single year. But it also probzbly happens every single year by every teams message board. The rest of what he's saying is garbage.

[TheSweetness]

(04-26-2020, 10:57 AM)fredtoast Wrote: 2019 does not count because there is no sample of Dalton WITH Green to compare results.  Dalton would most likely have been 2-11 even with Green playing.

For example in 2015 Green was 10-3 with Dalton and only 2-1 without him.  Obviously Green is not the one determining who wins.

The Bengals were the closest to winning a playoff game WITHOUT Dalton playing so what does this all really mean?

You say ONLY 2-1 yet who knows if it would have grown to 5-1 or 2-4. The loss you mention was also to the Superbowl Champs on the road in overtime.

Also, I bet we win at least another game or two with Green last year.

[GreenCornBengal]

(04-26-2020, 11:00 AM)TheSweetness Wrote: The Bengals were the closest to winning a playoff game WITHOUT Dalton playing so what does this all really mean?

You say ONLY 2-1 yet who knows if it would have grown to 5-1 or 2-4. The loss you mention was also to the Superbowl Champs on the road in overtime.

Also, I bet we win at least another game or two with Green last year.

Have to agree with sweetness here, having AJ out there last year would have led to a few more wins.

AJhas always been the clutch finisher for Andy (thinking Falcons a few years ago, battle against Steve Smith SR where he responded immediately each time, the hail marys to take us to OT, etc.)

I guess it was a blessing in disguise for the long-term health of this team. The 1OA picks in each round is something this squad needed unfortunately.

[fredtoast]

It is a shame so many of you decided to make this thread about me instead of the Bengals receiving corps. So let me go back and address that issue.

IF (<--- this is what is called a "big if") Ross and Green are healthy for all 16 games our receivers could be among the best and deepest group in the league.

Green... No need to explain what he can do when healthy.

Boyd... One of the most underrrated WRs in the league. Over the last two seasons he is 6th among WRs in receptions and one of only 8 WRS to have 70 receptions and 1000 yards each of the last two seasons. I have not seen his "3rd down" numbers for 2019, but in 2018 his conversion rate was incredible.

Ross... Despite all the hate from last year he still had over 500 yards in less than half of a season with a very impressive 18.1 average (only 4 receivers with more than 25 catches had a higher average). He has problems with drops and being on the same page with his QB, but that still projects to a 1000 season and if you project his number of catches for 20+ yards (10) and 40+ yards (2) he would have ranked 6th and 12th in the league in those catagories. He may never be a #1 WR, but he could be an amazing asset as a #2 or #3 WR that forces opponenets to play safeties back.

Higgens... WRs are hard to project from college to NFL, but Higgens is obviously a top prospect who would have been a first round pick in an average season when there were not 6 WRs taken in the first round.

Burrow flourished in college when they spread the field with 4 or 5 WR sets. If these guys are healthy he will certainly have the receivers to do it here.

[fredtoast]

(04-26-2020, 11:00 AM)TheSweetness Wrote: The Bengals were the closest to winning a playoff game WITHOUT Dalton playing so what does this all really mean?

Since the team was so much better with Dalton at QB it means we probably would have won that playoff game with him starting.

(04-26-2020, 11:00 AM)TheSweetness Wrote: You say ONLY 2-1 yet who knows if it would have grown to 5-1 or 2-4. 

Considering that they could not beat a team that finished better than 5-11 without Dalton I would say that was unlikely.

[BoomerFan]

Not to mention you've got the sure-handed Tate for depth and Uzo is no slouch at TE. I'm pretty hyped for seeing these guys play together. It feels like a great time to be a fan!

[phil413]

(04-25-2020, 02:09 PM)Tony Wrote: I have a gut feeling that Jonah William's is gonna be phenomenal..

I hope so, but we are banking on that and a youngster stabalizing to be an average OL. 

[BonnieBengal]

(04-25-2020, 01:57 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Ya but the important thing is we changed the name of the QB.

YEP!! 

[fredtoast]

(04-26-2020, 11:00 AM)TheSweetness Wrote: Also, I bet we win at least another game or two with Green last year.

(04-26-2020, 11:15 AM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: Have to agree with sweetness here, having AJ out there last year would have led to a few more wins.

I agree 100%.  EVERY team in the league is better when they have their best players healthy.  But that is not what we are discussing.  We can play make believe all we want about what Greens impact would have been, but the fact is I can show you seasons when the Bengals were more successful without Green than with him, but there has never been a season when the Bengals were better without Dalton than with him.

[Joelist]

What we are much more likely to see is a 3 WR set with AJ, Boyd and Higgins. TE stays in to help block mostly and single back. Assuming everyone is healthy that is a productive setup.

[Ravage]

(04-25-2020, 01:43 PM)spazz70 Wrote: When you line up AJ, Boyd, Higgins and Ross and have Mixon in the flat out of the backfield?  How do you cover that?  Seriously, how?

Well, for Ross you just wait 3-4 plays and he'll pull something or get injured.

For everyone else, yes, it should be fun to watch (Ross too if he's actually healthy).

Side note: unless there's major improvement on both ends of the line, having a TE on the field as an extra blocker might be a necessity. I expect Williams to improve the left, but I'm not confident in Bobby Hart suddenly figuring it all out.

[*Nately120*]

(04-25-2020, 01:50 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Is there a "cut and paste" version of this post that you guys have all been using for the last ten years where you can just change the names of the receivers?

You beat me to it.  I'll admit I have more faith in this group than before, but I can't remember the last time we went into a season without people having absolutely no idea how any NFL defense is EVER going to be able to stop all of our offensive weapons, particularly our WR corps.

(04-25-2020, 01:57 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Ya but the important thing is we changed the name of the QB.

(04-25-2020, 02:05 PM)Schmitbuck Wrote: (and Head Coach)

Wait...we fired ZT?  That changes everything!

[*Nately120*]

(04-25-2020, 06:14 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yeah, I heard the same thing last year when I questioned Zac and his staff.  I was told I was only being critical because I liked Marvin.  I was too stupid to see that our offense would explode and we would be better with our exciting new young head coach.  Dalton's career was going to be rejuvenated.

Remember that?

I will say it is interesting seeing the optimistic takes going from "ZT will be great, his resume doesn't matter" to "Burrow will be great, have you seen his amazing resume?"

[TheCincinnatiKid]

(04-26-2020, 10:58 AM)TheSweetness Wrote: Agreed. This thread happens literally every single year. But it also probzbly happens every single year by every teams message board. The rest of what he's saying is garbage.

Yeah that's probably true.

In the same way, it's why I laugh at draft grades. Nothing wrong with people being pumped about their teams and analysts being pumped about digging through the draft, but 25 of the 32 teams get an A every year. The Draft just bleeds blind optimism, but hey I guess people being happy and excited is hardly a bad thing.

[Gdale_Bengal]

What will happen first is Joe hangs onto the ball too long ang gets a lot of pressures before he adjusts to nfl speed.

Then we will see how rough the O line is when he adjusts but still gets pressured too early and he starts making errant or early throws.

Browns and Ravens are working on there D. Calais Campbell and Madubuike are good young/old inside pass rushers. They are preparing for our offense.

It’s going to be fun to watch this team play, but don’t think we are playoff bound right away. Still at least one O line player away unless we get lucky with Fred Johnson and Jordan take big leaps

[Joelist]

I still think we are going to see a lot of sets where a TE is kept in to block and we go single back. At least until they feel the OL can be trusted to hold up in 5 man blocking scenarios.