Trade Candidates?

[fredtoast]

(07-25-2015, 09:47 PM)kevin Wrote: I write this on Saturday July 25th, not knowing if any trades have been made yet. I'm sure some are coming. Still, I think we have to ask if this is a rebuilding job to have a team above .500 in 2016, or a a rebuilding job of losing teams for a few years and not expecting a team above .500 until 2020. If this franchise expects wins in 2016, then it can not trade off the entire team, only one or two players.

The biggest salaries to dump would be Votto and Bruce, but do any teams in the play-off hunt feel either  could help them to a World Series ????

So Cueto was often mentioned by media before the season started, as was Chapman. I still say Chapman is young and if we intend to be above .500 in 2016 we should not trade the All-Star closer. Chapman is like Rivera or Sutter and way above most closers in baseball history. I would hate to lose Chapman because they paid Votto and Bruce too much.

I could see Votto, Bruce, Phillips, Byrd, Cueto names open for trade and Leake has been mentioned.....I would like to see back in 2016 the names, Frazier, Hamilton and Chapman. The Home Run Derby man, the All-Star closer and the young NL stolen base leader who plays great center field. When in doubt, go with youth. Don't trade the good young players. We can build on these young quality players.

The Reds have broken my heart over the years in trading Frank Robinson, Tony Perez, firing Sparky Anderson. In a week I will see if they have broken my heart again. I hope Chapman, Frazier and Hamilton are still here after the trade deadline, something to build on in 2016 other than fielding the 2015 Louisville Bats and Dayton Dragons in Reds uniforms in 2016.

It would be crazy to trade both Votto and Bruce.  Especially in order to keep a guy who just plays 60-70 innings a year.

Trade Chapman.

[kevin]

(07-25-2015, 10:38 PM)fredtoast Wrote: It would be crazy to trade both Votto and Bruce.  Especially in order to keep a guy who just plays 60-70 innings a year.

Trade Chapman.

That is what closers do. They pitch 60 to 70 innings in the 9th inning to get the win or the save and win the game. Since Chapman has been in the last 3 All-Star Games, Chapman is doing his job......

If you are dumping guys not earning their fat paychecks, Votto and Bruce would have been traded yesterday if not sooner. The problem is probably no teams want them. They are so great, nobody wants them. No way Votto is living up to his contract and no way Bruce is in spite of his good arm in right field. Dumping both of them would free up a ton of payroll. 

This isn't a factory where you base things on the hours worked. Chapman is earning his pay and Votto and Bruce are not.  Mesoraco after his surgery may not be able to squat and catch again per the doctors. The left field experiment failed. That leaves 1st base or traded to AL to DH for Mesoraco.  Mesoraco and Pena can both play 1st base and replace the not so MVP numbers of much injury riddled Votto.  Someone can take over in right and maybe bat better than Bruce at around .250.......but you will not find another closer like Chapman. He is like Rivera or Sutter and one of the best closers in baseball ever. Plus he is still young. 

This is not a factory where you say he only pitches 60 to 70 innings. That is what closers do, and Chapman is the best closer in baseball and is still young.  Oh, he could be pitching more as a starter, but the Reds made the young starter into a closer because they had no closer. If they trade Chapman, they will be back to having no closer. ....You can find another 1st baseman or fight fielder, but Cincinnati will never have a closer like Chapman again, just as there will never be another Johnny Bench at catcher. ...Of the 3, I would want Chapman on the 2016 team, hands down, not even close. ....the problem is, probably no teams want Votto or Bruce, that's how GREAT they are. ....but we sure could dump a ton of payroll if we unloaded Votto and Bruce, and still win more games in 2016 than this awful 2015 season. 

My 3 untouchables would be Frazier, Chapman and Hamilton.....I would want those 3 going into 2016......Frazier for his bat and glove, Hamilton for his youth and defense and Lou Brock like base stealing, and Chapman so if we can win a game in 2016, we bring in Chapman and game over, We Win. ....Unloading Votto and Bruce would free up money to bring in free agents to fill any needs. ....but I bet the ranch on it that Votto and Bruce are here in 2016, because no teams want them at their high priced contracts. So instead of saying we are stuck with them, I guess it's easier to try to say how great they are instead of saying Reds over paid them both. no way they are earning those paychecks. In real business, the highest paid not getting it done are the first to get fired and that opens up a ton of payroll to make improvements. In the real world, you would unload Votto and Bruce before you unload Cueto as the star pitcher, but teams want to trade for Cueto, and not Votto and Bruce. It's a catch 22, and Reds are behind the 8 ball on these 2 high priced contracts of players they can't unload.

Not only would it not be crazy to trade Votto and Bruce, it is the most logical money move to improve the team quick and fast.....since no teams want them, it won't happen.

[fredtoast]

(07-26-2015, 12:34 PM)kevin Wrote: If you are dumping guys not earning their fat paychecks, Votto and Bruce would have been traded yesterday if not sooner. The problem is probably no teams want them. They are so great, nobody wants them. No way Votto is living up to his contract 

Votto is currently 6th in MLB in OPS (slugging % plus on base%).  He is having one of the best offensive seasons of any player in the majors..

Chapman currently has a losing record (3-4) and among pitchers with at least 40 IPs he is 12th in ERA, 20th in opponents OPS, and 116th in WHIP.  He strikes out a lot of guys, but he really is not having that great of a season

Votto is MUCH more valuable than Chapman, and it is insane to suggest that no team would want him.

Jay Bruce is among the top 35 in the majors in Slugging%, OPS, HR, and RBI. He is not playing on Votto's level, but considering there are only 30 MLB teams it is also crazy to suggest that no team wants him.

[Lawless_1]

How about Chapman for Yasiel Puig?

Then trade Bruce for pitching prospects....

Seems like a win/win for the Reds.

[fredtoast]

(07-31-2015, 12:50 AM)Lawless_1 Wrote: How about Chapman for Yasiel Puig?

Then trade Bruce for pitching prospects....

Seems like a win/win for the Reds.

Even though Puig is a head case he has amazing talent.  Plus we would be getting an every day player in exchange for a guy who only pitches 70 innings a year.

[Hoofhearted]

(07-31-2015, 12:50 AM)Lawless_1 Wrote: How about Chapman for Yasiel Puig?

Then trade Bruce for pitching prospects....

Seems like a win/win for the Reds.

They won't trade Chapman. They drastically over-value him.