Good info into the Dunlap saga

[Yojimbo]

(10-30-2020, 12:29 PM)TJHoushmandzadehs Shiny Shoes Wrote: For the DC's first year the marquee free agency signings were BW Webb and Kerry Wynn and out of 11 picks the D co-ordinator got a 3rd round pick, a 4th round compensatory, a 6th round compensatory and the 7th round pick. How many DC are going to sign up for that to improve the 31st or 32nd ranked D?

It's likely DC candidates looked at that 31st or 32nd ranked D, looked at the void at linebacker, looked at the fact that Cincy had just appointed a Head Coach who was going to call plays on Offense and realized that the next couple of drafts would be offense heavy. They'd have then looked at the rest of talent on D (since 2014 the D has had just one first round pick and one second round pick) and Mike Brown's aversion to paying in free agency and run a mile.

Frankly I don't blame them and for my money that's on the front office and not Zac.

They should be in a much stronger position to attract a good DC this off-season with the acquisition of Reader and the emergence of Bates and a probable top 10 pick to spend on D to dangle in front of candidates.

I see this argument made a lot for coaches. They don’t want to go where there isn’t already a winning team in place. I think it’s the exact opposite for most coaches. They love a challenge and their egos tell them they are the ones that can fix things. The only coaches that want a premade winner are older coaches that have already won championships in their career.

[WeezyBengal]

All I have to say is... I'm not sure how anyone could give this front office the benefit of the doubt over Dunlap. That is all.

[TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes]

(10-30-2020, 01:12 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: I see this argument made a lot for coaches. They don’t want to go where there isn’t already a winning team in place. I think it’s the exact opposite for most coaches. They love a challenge and their egos tell them they are the ones that can fix things. The only coaches that want a premade winner are older coaches that have already won championships in their career.

Coaches want to go somewhere where they think they can win. Turning around a bad team isn't necessarily an issue but they will want the tools to do it. This wasn't on offer in early 2019. No high draft picks, no big FA acquisitions on a really bad D with big holes and an ownership unwilling to move on from veterans who don't buy in.

It's why we ended up with our 8th choice (or whatever it was) DC. Anyone with options gave it a wide berth.

[Yojimbo]

(10-30-2020, 02:20 PM)TJHoushmandzadehs Shiny Shoes Wrote: Coaches want to go somewhere where they think they can win. Turning around a bad team isn't necessarily an issue but they will want the tools to do it. This wasn't on offer in early 2019. No high draft picks, no big FA acquisitions on a really bad D with big holes and an ownership unwilling to move on from veterans who don't buy in.

It's why we ended up with our 8th choice (or whatever it was) DC. Anyone with options gave it a wide berth.

But we have no idea why. Could be nobody wanted to work with ZT. I bet there are a ton of coaches that would love to work with Dunlap, Atkins, Lawson, Hubbard, Jackson and Bates.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 12:38 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: He absolutely does; I feel bad for Brennan because he's had a really good season on the whole, but now with the torn muscle, who know if he even plays another down this year? (he can play through the injury, but should he?).

Anyways, I was beyond-stunned after that opening loss; Pelini is trash.

If I were Brennan, I'd shut it down.

To be honest, with Mike Leach in Starkville, I wasn't that shocked. After watching MSU since, however, I am now.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 02:27 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: But we have no idea why. Could be nobody wanted to work with ZT. I bet there are a ton of coaches that would love to work with Dunlap, Atkins, Lawson, Hubbard, Jackson and Bates.

All of those cats were part of that bad defense....one that even Marvin couldn't turn totally around. There is something to be said about a bad situation....Hue Jackson sure has buyer's remorse now according to a recent interview. He wishes he had just stayed in Cincy now. Cleveland ruined him. 

[Yojimbo]

(10-30-2020, 02:45 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: All of those cats were part of that bad defense....one that even Marvin couldn't turn totally around. There is something to be said about a bad situation....Hue Jackson sure has buyer's remorse now according to a recent interview. He wishes he had just stayed in Cincy now. Cleveland ruined him. 

I wouldn’t put all the bad defense on them. The linebacking corps was terrible, the corners were terrible due to Jackson injuries, outside of a great second season, and Hubbard/Lawson were young and still learning. Coaches see talent and think they have the scheme or coaching knowledge to fix things or develop guys to their best.

[fredtoast]

(10-30-2020, 02:20 PM)TJHoushmandzadeh Wrote: Coaches want to go somewhere where they think they can win. Turning around a bad team isn't necessarily an issue but they will want the tools to do it. This wasn't on offer in early 2019. No high draft picks, no big FA acquisitions on a really bad D with big holes and an ownership unwilling to move on from veterans who don't buy in.

2018 was the first time our defense had not finished in the top half of the league in 9 years.  Our D had been top ten in 5 of the previous 8 years.  That is a sign of a front office that knows how to build a defense.

And what vets had refused to "buy in" in 2018?

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-30-2020, 11:07 AM)thillan Wrote: I wonder how much this will impact FA next year. Seems like Dunlap is a well respected guy in the league, and he aired a bunch of dirty laundry on the team.

Burrow will draw some heads, but has Dunlap steered that same amount away?

No

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 03:05 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: I wouldn’t put all the bad defense on them. The linebacking corps was terrible, the corners were terrible due to Jackson injuries, outside of a great second season, and Hubbard/Lawson were young and still learning. Coaches see talent and think they have the scheme or coaching knowledge to fix things or develop guys to their best.

Big ego in that profession. That's for sure. 

I wouldn't out those cats as a reason, but when you look at them being on the squad, and it's that bad.... there's a chance you come out with egg on your face. That's ego too. They had some big names, it'd be rough to hit 28th-32nd. That's a ball buster. Then you add in Son of Paul and these other guys coaching.....well, ya ain't gotta be Jethro Bodean to figure that one out.

[Yojimbo]

(10-30-2020, 07:54 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: Big ego in that profession. That's for sure. 

I wouldn't out those cats as a reason, but when you look at them being on the squad, and it's that bad.... there's a chance you come out with egg on your face. That's ego too. They had some big names, it'd be rough to hit 28th-32nd. That's a ball buster. Then you add in Son of Paul and these other guys coaching.....well, ya ain't gotta be Jethro Bodean to figure that one out.

We saw what a good coach, Zimmer, was able to get out of some of them. Of course that was a couple years earlier in some of their careers.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 08:03 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: We saw what a good coach, Zimmer, was able to get out of some of them. Of course that was a couple years earlier in some of their careers.

Indeed....and Zimmer was looking for redemption after the Atlanta fiasco, and so so in Dallas. JJo, Leon, old man Newman, a decent Maualuga, others I'm sure I'm forgetting from way back then...then a resurgent Pac-Man, a Burfict under some semblance of control, Leon still there, Reggie Nelson, and then Dunlap, Atkins and such....he had some good pieces...and he was no Sweet Lou....lol.

[Yojimbo]

(10-30-2020, 08:17 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: Indeed....and Zimmer was looking for redemption after the Atlanta fiasco, and so so in Dallas. JJo, Leon, old man Newman, a decent Maualuga, others I'm sure I'm forgetting from way back then...then a resurgent Pac-Man, a Burfict under some semblance of control, Leon still there, Reggie Nelson, and then Dunlap, Atkins and such....he had some good pieces...and he was no Sweet Lou....lol.

Man, those were some good times.