Report: Burrow pushing for Bengals to draft Chase

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-13-2021, 10:43 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: As a Clemson guy, I'm big on Carman. He isn't a tackle at the NFL level, should be a really good guard. Just not sure he'd still be there in round three. As for Cosmi, I don't think we will see him at 38. 

Safe to say Sewell, Slater and Darrisaw are 1st round locks along with Vera Tucker. I would rank Cosmi as the next guy in line for the OL and he might be the 5th guy in round 1, lots of teams need OL help. 

My fear is we take Walker Little or Teven Jenkins. 

Little is the perfect Bengals pick, a guy who was injured. He might get back to the shape he was at Stanford when he was viewed as maybe the #1 tackle in the class but since the injury... no tape to show how he recovered. That worries me. Then you have Jenkins.... this guy is Ced 2.0. The style of play, the type of offense he was working in, the scouts talking about character concerns. It just would freak me out to draft him.

Yes, also really like Jackson Carman for us at RG and could play RT if we needed him to.

If Cosmi is gone I still think Eichenberg would be there at 38. If Carman is gone by the 3rd I would like Wyatt Davis even
if he is an OSU guy, but Meinerz honestly is who I would really like. Lots of ways to go about it. Also love Spencer Brown 
in the 3rd or 4th to learn behind Reiff.

[Big_Ern]

This headline would've sucked if it were for the 2020 draft

[*psychdoctor*]

(04-13-2021, 10:43 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: As a Clemson guy, I'm big on Carman. He isn't a tackle at the NFL level, should be a really good guard. Just not sure he'd still be there in round three. As for Cosmi, I don't think we will see him at 38. 

Safe to say Sewell, Slater and Darrisaw are 1st round locks along with Vera Tucker. I would rank Cosmi as the next guy in line for the OL and he might be the 5th guy in round 1, lots of teams need OL help. 

My fear is we take Walker Little or Teven Jenkins. 

Little is the perfect Bengals pick, a guy who was injured. He might get back to the shape he was at Stanford when he was viewed as maybe the #1 tackle in the class but since the injury... no tape to show how he recovered. That worries me. Then you have Jenkins.... this guy is Ced 2.0. The style of play, the type of offense he was working in, the scouts talking about character concerns. It just would freak me out to draft him.

Jenkins is no Ced. Jenkins is a junkyard dog that is mean as hell.  He is a nasty brawler.   Place him at guard then move him outside if he improves his feet movements.  Jenkins had a higher RAS compared to Sewell.  

WTS, Leatherwood is similar and probably a better fit for Bengals.  But He has his own issues as well.  I think if the Bengals could get Green at Center and a top guard in Cleveland, Dickerson, or even Leatherwood, they could get OT next year either via FA or draft.  

[Memphis_Bengal]

(04-14-2021, 01:14 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yes, also really like Jackson Carman for us at RG and could play RT if we needed him to.

If Cosmi is gone I still think Eichenberg would be there at 38. If Carman is gone by the 3rd I would like Wyatt Davis even
if he is an OSU guy, but Meinerz honestly is who I would really like. Lots of ways to go about it. Also love Spencer Brown 
in the 3rd or 4th to learn behind Reiff.

Would love Meinerz in 3rd!

[CarolinaBengalFanGuy]

It has to be Sewell

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-14-2021, 05:34 PM)Memphis_Bengal Wrote: Would love Meinerz in 3rd!

Think the Steelers will take him in the 2nd from what I heard, hope they don't and that is the way it falls.

[Big Boss]

(04-14-2021, 01:32 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Jenkins is no Ced. Jenkins is a junkyard dog that is mean as hell.  He is a nasty brawler.   Place him at guard then move him outside if he improves his feet movements.  Jenkins had a higher RAS compared to Sewell.  

WTS, Leatherwood is similar and probably a better fit for Bengals.  But He has his own issues as well.  I think if the Bengals could get Green at Center and a top guard in Cleveland, Dickerson, or even Leatherwood, they could get OT next year either via FA or draft.  

That's kinda my thinking as well.  Reiff shores up RT for at least a season.  We need guard help and potentially center help more than anything.

[Hammerstripes]

(04-13-2021, 10:20 PM)impactplaya Wrote: Defenses will.have to figure how to.scheme vs Chase
Defenses don't have scheme against Sewell

How so?  He's a great prospect, but they will just put a corner on him and maybe offer some safety help.  He isn't someone that will require special treatment like Pitts.

[coachmcneil71]

Not sure why the oline guys are overlooking Trey Smith out of Tennessee? I haven't really noticed anyone mentioning him. He's a beast. Can play inside or OT in a pinch.

[Hammerstripes]

(04-17-2021, 02:14 PM)coachmcneil71 Wrote: Not sure why the oline guys are overlooking Trey Smith out of Tennessee? I haven't really noticed anyone mentioning him. He's a beast. Can play inside or OT in a pinch.

100%.  I don't know why there is so much talk about going OT in round 2 if we take Chase or Pitts in round 1.  IF we go that way, we almost have to take an interior linemen in round 2.

[impactplaya]

(04-17-2021, 02:01 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: How so?  He's a great prospect, but they will just put a corner on him and maybe offer some safety help.  He isn't someone that will require special treatment like Pitts.

I want them.to draft Kyle Pitts. Hes a very unique weapon.
But in regards to Chase vs Sewell I was just saying there
Is more prep and gameplanning when you talk about a WR 
Vs a OT. 
Look at it this way. When the Browns had Joe Thomas at LT
 if he didnt give up a sack or QB hurry it didnt matter cause  The Browns still lost.  
If the Bengals draft Chase, then if the other team puts their 
#1 cover corner on him then Boyd and Higgins get 
Maybe a favorable matchup.
Or maybe Chase faces the other teams 2nd or 3rd CB

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-14-2021, 01:32 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Jenkins had a higher RAS compared to Sewell.  

When did RAS suddenly become some ubiquitous term? I have seen it thrown around a ton this offseason, and don't recall it ever really being such a thing in past offseasons.

Also worth noting, I looked this RAS stat up, and WR UDFA (and guy who has already been on 2 teams) Kristian Wilkerson had a higher RAS compared to Justin Jefferson. Cleveland and Becton both has higher RAS compared to Wirfs.

[*psychdoctor*]

(04-17-2021, 03:51 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: When did RAS suddenly become some ubiquitous term? I have seen it thrown around a ton this offseason, and don't recall it ever really being such a thing in past offseasons.

Also worth noting, I looked this RAS stat up, and WR UDFA (and guy who has already been on 2 teams) Kristian Wilkerson had a higher RAS compared to Justin Jefferson. Cleveland and Becton both has higher RAS compared to Wirfs.

Metric data is not predictive of performance, I view RAS as indicative of potential performance.  It is concrete and some people in sports like concrete data especially in baseball.  It is data to add to talent evaluators arsenal but should not replace other factors.  Sort of like Combine or pro day data.  Someone can be athletic and not be good at football, i.e., John Ross.  

In addition, metric data may indicate innate athletic talent but does not account for scheme fit and coaching variables.  An interesting side note is how polarizing arm length has become with regard to OL players.  the 34" crowd varies but some believe for OT 34" is necessary or the player compensates using hands placement, holding, posture.  Not sure I agree with that assessment but it is one I look at along with feet movement.  

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-19-2021, 05:54 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Metric data is not predictive of performance, I view RAS as indicative of potential performance.  It is concrete and some people in sports like concrete data especially in baseball.  It is data to add to talent evaluators arsenal but should not replace other factors.  Sort of like Combine or pro day data.  Someone can be athletic and not be good at football, i.e., John Ross.  

In addition, metric data may indicate innate athletic talent but does not account for scheme fit and coaching variables.  An interesting side note is how polarizing arm length has become with regard to OL players.  the 34" crowd varies but some believe for OT 34" is necessary or the player compensates using hands placement, holding, posture.  Not sure I agree with that assessment but it is one I look at along with feet movement.  

Yeah, absolutely. I was more questioning why it suddenly went from seemingly 1% usage to 75% usage in just one year's time. 

[*psychdoctor*]

(04-19-2021, 06:11 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Yeah, absolutely. I was more questioning why it suddenly went from seemingly 1% usage to 75% usage in just one year's time. 

The RAS along with Next Gen data is very helpful for perspective and they now have enough data over the last few years to compare metrics with a 3-5 year performance of similar athletes.  This is why you will see more and more of comparable athlete data.  For example, Chase is compared now with Torry Holt and his data.  

[PDub80]

(04-17-2021, 02:01 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: How so?  He's a great prospect, but they will just put a corner on him and maybe offer some safety help.  He isn't someone that will require special treatment like Pitts.

Is this a joke? Chase TORCHED every DB the SEC had. 2 or 3 of them first round picks. 1 a top 10 pick, if I recall, and they both did well in the League as rookies. Chase absolutely lit a gasoline fire on them.

[PDub80]

(04-17-2021, 01:44 PM)Big Boss Wrote: That's kinda my thinking as well.  Reiff shores up RT for at least a season.  We need guard help and potentially center help more than anything.

Dickerson, the C out of AL solves this problem. Hopkins can then go back to his natural RG spot. Hopkins was only forced to play C because Price sucks and got injured.

If the Bengals go Chase they have way more flexibility throughout the draft. They can go center, OT or G in the 2nd and then grab another Olineman in the 3rd or 4th.

There will be starter quality linemen in the 3rd and more than likely 4th round of this draft. 

[*ochocincos*]

(04-17-2021, 03:51 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: When did RAS suddenly become some ubiquitous term? I have seen it thrown around a ton this offseason, and don't recall it ever really being such a thing in past offseasons.

Also worth noting, I looked this RAS stat up, and WR UDFA (and guy who has already been on 2 teams) Kristian Wilkerson had a higher RAS compared to Justin Jefferson. Cleveland and Becton both has higher RAS compared to Wirfs.

It's just a composite score of their size, speed, athleticism, and explosion.
It's meant for those who prefer to see a single evaluation letter/number vs a bunch of separate things.
Think of it kind of like getting a single compiled PFF rating vs the individual breakdowns of, for example, pass block, run block, and receiving grade for TEs.

[*ochocincos*]

(04-19-2021, 06:25 PM)PDub80 Wrote: Dickerson, the C out of AL solves this problem. Hopkins can then go back to his natural RG spot. Hopkins was only forced to play C because Price sucks and got injured.

If the Bengals go Chase they have way more flexibility throughout the draft. They can go center, OT or G in the 2nd and then grab another Olineman in the 3rd or 4th.

There will be starter quality linemen in the 3rd and more than likely 4th round of this draft. 

If we think of positions in more traditional terms, Hopkins is more of a traditional LG instead of RG.
Many people think RG (traditionally) is more the road grader vs LG being the more athletic mover.

Hopkins was a very good pass blocker at RG btw, but he was terrible at run blocking.
I guess he's still the same type of player at C, but it's less noticeable at C compared to when he was at RG.

[PDub80]

(04-19-2021, 07:00 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If we think of positions in more traditional terms, Hopkins is more of a traditional LG instead of RG.
Many people think RG (traditionally) is more the road grader vs LG being the more athletic mover.

Hopkins was a very good pass blocker at RG btw, but he was terrible at run blocking.
I guess he's still the same type of player at C, but it's less noticeable at C compared to when he was at RG.

I thought he came to the Bengals as a RG from TX? I did not look any of that up previously.

EDIT: Looing it up, you kind of nailed it. He bounced around the line at TX, but primarily played at LG. Bengals bring him in as a RG.

Dickerson is an outstanding player and can play G (he did in college). I would be A ok with the BEngals taking high value linemen at 2 & 3. Or 2 & 4 if the linemen fall.

I LOVE Ben Cleveland as a RG for the Bengals. Same with the kid from Wisconsin White Water.

I know I will be lit on fire for this, but I don't love the RB depth behind Mixon. If Harris is there in the 2nd, I would not be upset if the Bengals took him and then grabbed linemen in 3 & 4. The offense needs most of these draft picks and the linemen depth is there to get 2 guys that will contribute/start in those rounds.