Which is Better?

[KillerGoose]

(04-26-2021, 10:02 AM)JaggedJimmyJay Wrote: Over the course of the season the Bucs' line performed around average, at least in terms of how long Brady had to throw per dropback. And average is certainly better than what the Bengals of 2020 put out there. I believe that the game has changed enough in the present that an average offensive line paired with elite weapons is more likely to generate a Super Bowl victory than an average array of weapons with an elite offensive line. It still feels bizarre to type that, because I'd have never made this argument in the not-so-distant past -- but the game is frankly nonsense now.

I would be fine with Sewell or Chase too. They both address positions of need and, I believe, are great prospects. I think the argument is generally hot air inspired by outdated conventional wisdom.

I do think you have a good point. I don’t agree that the argument is hot air, but finding a middle ground certainly has its merits. TB actually had one of the fastest time to throws in the league at 2.57 seconds, quicker than Burrow. He was pushing the ball further down the field than Burrow, and was actually #3 in the league for air yards on all attempts (Burrow #12).

Do I believe that TB had a line that forced TB to get rid of the ball that quickly? No, of course not. Do I believe that Tampa had good enough receivers to get open so quickly? Yes, I do.

I think that Tampa has the golden goose; strong OL and strong WRs. However, you have a good point in that having strong WRs over a strong OL can still produce results. Picking strong WRs doesn’t mean shit OL. You can have strong WRs and an average OL.

I agree with what you’re saying.

[Beaker]

I take option A....but the Bengals should still draft Chase at #5. Huge difference getting 5 players instead of 1 if youre trying to illustrate OL vs WR.

[Murdock2420]

(04-26-2021, 08:11 AM)Au165 Wrote: Oh, look another WR vs OL thread. Friday is going to be interesting because it feels like half the fan base is going to be melting down.

Yup.. probably the right time to take a little break from the boards. 

Unless they trade down or take someone random, at least then the board would be united again.

Or unless the Falcons trade Julio as the rumors say and then they take Chase. If that happens, the biggest debate is answered for us.

[Au165]

(04-26-2021, 02:23 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Yup.. probably the right time to take a little break from the boards. 

Unless they trade down or take someone random, at least then the board would be united again.

In a weird way if they screwed it up it would actually bring the board harmony. 

[Murdock2420]

(04-26-2021, 02:24 PM)Au165 Wrote: In a weird way if they screwed it up it would actually bring the board harmony. 

Yup, I said to Nico in another thread a part of me wants them to trade down with Denver and take Waddle or Smith or Slater for the simply reason that that board would be all back together and hating on Tobin.

[*ochocincos*]

(04-26-2021, 04:22 AM)Bilbo Saggins Wrote: Here's the deal: the NFL is re-drafting all of its players as if all 32 teams were expansion teams.  Each team is presented with whacky options with which to fill out their rosters.  The Bengals are up first.  With a gun to your head, which option do you choose as the first five players to be on your roster?  

Option A: David Bakhtiari, Quinton Nelson, Corey Linsley, Zack Martin, Tristan Wirfs

Option B: Davante Adams, Stefon Diggs, DeAndre Hopkins, Justin Jefferson, Tyreek Hill  

You probably should have changed Option B to have a stud RB and TE instead of two of the WRs.

Maybe Diggs, Adams, Jefferson (slot), Kelce, Henry

[Bilbo Saggins]

(04-26-2021, 10:16 AM)KillerGoose Wrote: I do think you have a good point. I don’t agree that the argument is hot air, but finding a middle ground certainly has its merits. TB actually had one of the fastest time to throws in the league at 2.57 seconds, quicker than Burrow. He was pushing the ball further down the field than Burrow, and was actually #3 in the league for air yards on all attempts (Burrow #12).

Do I believe that TB had a line that forced TB to get rid of the ball that quickly? No, of course not. Do I believe that Tampa had good enough receivers to get open so quickly? Yes, I do.

I think that Tampa has the golden goose; strong OL and strong WRs. However, you have a good point in that having strong WRs over a strong OL can still produce results. Picking strong WRs doesn’t mean shit OL. You can have strong WRs and an average OL.

I agree with what you’re saying.

When I watched this highlight reel, I didn't see a ton of quick hit passes to speedy receivers. Mike Evans ran a 4.53 in the 40 and had below average measurables for all of the agility drills. Gronkowski ran a 4.68 in the 40 and had a below average three cone drill. This is just a highlight reel, not the whole season, but this is what their haymaker plays looked like:
https://youtu.be/8q56ar5Ezy0

I don't see plays where the TB receivers are zipping downfield and getting open instantaneously. I see great pass protection and throws to pass catchers who move like sloths. 

[SuperBowlBound!]

(04-26-2021, 09:35 AM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: Lol u poor thing.  Look at the last super bowl.  U had the chiefs with all the weapons in the world and then u had the bucs who had a boat load of weapons as well.....who won the game? and most importantly why? The bucs won because they were able to keep Brady clean however on the flip side despite all those cute flashy weapons the chiefs were dominated up front to the point where the chiefs this offseason had to totally revamp their oline.  And they did cuz they have their franchise qb and rule number 1 kids is to protect him.  It’s oline all day.  Now the bengals are gonna take chase cuz their idiots most likely but hey maybe they’ve smartened up...doubtful.

This is partly because the Chiefs lost their tackle in the NFC Championship and the other sat out for Covid reasons. If you checked their Off line when healthy you will find they did a pretty good job for the last 3 years.. They also only had 1 Number one draft pick on that line.

[SuperBowlBound!]

(04-26-2021, 10:07 PM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: This is partly because the Chiefs lost their tackle in the NFC Championship and the other sat out for Covid reasons. If you checked their Off line when healthy you will find they did a pretty good job for the last 3 years.. They also only had 1 Number one draft pick on that line.

Buccaneers
Tristan Wirfs- 2020 / Round: 1 / Pick: 13 
Ali Marpet - 2015 / Round: 2 / Pick: 61
Donovan Smith - 2015 / Round: 2 / Pick: 34 
Alex Cappa - 2018 / Round: 3 / Pick: 94 
Riley Jensen - 2013 / Round: 6 / Pick: 203 


Bengals
Jonah Williams - 2019 / Round: 1 / Pick: 11
Xavier Sua Filo - 2014 / Round: 2 / Pick: 33
Trey Hopkins - 2014 Undrafted
Quinton Spain - 2015 Undrafted
Riley Reiff - 2012 / Round: 1 / Pick: 23


There are no guarantees.

[Bengalbug]

(04-26-2021, 04:22 AM)Bilbo Saggins Wrote: Here's the deal: the NFL is re-drafting all of its players as if all 32 teams were expansion teams.  Each team is presented with whacky options with which to fill out their rosters.  The Bengals are up first.  With a gun to your head, which option do you choose as the first five players to be on your roster?  

Option A: David Bakhtiari, Quinton Nelson, Corey Linsley, Zack Martin, Tristan Wirfs

Option B: Davante Adams, Stefon Diggs, DeAndre Hopkins, Justin Jefferson, Tyreek Hill  

Option B, I can get more in return for the wide receivers. So I’ll have two of the best wr and I can likely flip 3 of them for 3 first round picks, likely a lot more.