Blocking for the OTHER Joe

[2MinutesHate]

Last season, we were 0-7-1 when rushing for 100 yards or less and 4-4 when rushing for more than 100 yards.  Joe Burrow  got his only 2 wins when we rushed for over 100 yards.  Just pass more because it's a passing league?  We lost every game we threw it more than 38 times.

The guys up front have to block better for Mixon.  I remember defenders pouring into the backfield last year.  We have to run block better this year or we are in for a big disappointment.  Chase or no Chase.

[Essex Johnson]

Pretty simple math equation for almost all teams for a good running game. opening lanes for RB + a solid RB + an effective play action passing game = solid running attack. Over the last few years, we have not had 2 of those 3 (running lanes and play action passing) for sure

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-03-2021, 08:25 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: In online sports blogs and especially on YouTube I see lots of articles about the Bengals’ potential for having a potent offense in 2021 and most of the commentary is positive. That’s good.  However, all the talk is about Tee Higgins and Ja’Marr Chase.  That’s bad.

Unless Zac Taylor plans to have Joe Burrow throw the ball at least fifty times per game which is an abominably horrible idea, the newly designed offensive line is going to have to perform their run blocking duties far better.  A potent offense, after all, is a balanced offense.  If the Bengals can’t gash a defense on the ground then going to the air all the time will make the offense one dimensional and therefore predictable.

It has been many years since Cincinnati has had a run game which moves the chains, controls the clock, and punches it in successfully on the goal line.  All the best playoff teams in history have this!  

Like the commentators on the blogs, I want to see a breakout year from Joe Burrow, Tee Higgins, and Ja’Marr Chase but don’t forget the “other” Joe: Joe Mixon.

Better balance on offense will absolutely be a key element to this team being successful in 2021.  There is a lot of chatter about Mixon "staying on the field" on 3rd down, and I hope he has more receptions than he did even have targets in 2020.  I think Pollack's arrival, having three solid TEs, and the improvements on the line will absolutely help the rushing attack accomplish this.


There were only a few games where they did run the ball successfully, so I understood that pass-heavy offense, but it needs to be better balanced.  Create misdirection screens to Mixon should also be an "extension of the run game" to get high % passes and keep defenses off balance.  That is one thing I saw a lot of from McVeigh and not so much from ZT.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-03-2021, 09:04 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: The other Joe seems like he either spends too much time deciding where he wants to go, or just runs directly into his blockers.

Was always on the "don't pay RBs unless they're Barry Sanders" team, but it made even less sense to not only pay a RB, but then not pay a OL.

(Maybe just play Jacksonville more often?)

The other Joe also averaged 5 YPC under Pollack.  I would take that in a heart beat.  Add in 50 receptions on high % short passes and I could see Mixon as a legitimate 2,000 all-purpose yard candidate.  They did pay the man.  Now, they need to use the man.  

If the Bengals are able to get the rushing attack going, the sky is the limit for Burrow off that play-action.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-05-2021, 10:42 AM)2MinutesHate Wrote: Last season, we were 0-7-1 when rushing for 100 yards or less and 4-4 when rushing for more than 100 yards.  Joe Burrow  got his only 2 wins when we rushed for over 100 yards.  Just pass more because it's a passing league?  We lost every game we threw it more than 38 times.

The guys up front have to block better for Mixon.  I remember defenders pouring into the backfield last year.  We have to run block better this year or we are in for a big disappointment.  Chase or no Chase.

Facts.

While I believe Burrow could torch a lot of defenses going pass heavy, the elite defenses will need to be attacked with better balance.  It doesn't matter if you think run opens pass or pass opens run, the bottom line is having better balance will help the team.  

A good rushing attack allows for some big plays in the passing game too.  Those safeties need to cheat up, we have some guys that can torch them deep.  

[Fan_in_Kettering]

(07-05-2021, 11:13 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Facts.

While I believe Burrow could torch a lot of defenses going pass heavy, the elite defenses will need to be attacked with better balance.  It doesn't matter if you think run opens pass or pass opens run, the bottom line is having better balance will help the team.  

A good rushing attack allows for some big plays in the passing game too.  Those safeties need to cheat up, we have some guys that can torch them deep.  

This is sound analysis as usual, Racer! Also, I looked at Joe Burrow’s passing statistics at LSU during his final season and his best passer rating came in games when he threw between 25-35 passes per game.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(07-04-2021, 08:07 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: I wanted Dalvin Cook.


Anyway...anyone else realize this is Mixon's 5th year in the league?

Me. Too. In fact, I was pounding the ol proverbial table. Unlike Mixon, as I noted back then,  Cook ran behind an extremely porous line in Tallahassee. He still produced, and produced quite well. 

My fear was Joe was gonna be hampered more behind a trash line than the more "slippery" Cook would.

Five years...time sure flies when you're losing.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(07-05-2021, 11:05 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: The other Joe also averaged 5 YPC under Pollack.  I would take that in a heart beat.  Add in 50 receptions on high % short passes and I could see Mixon as a legitimate 2,000 all-purpose yard candidate.  They did pay the man.  Now, they need to use the man.  

If the Bengals are able to get the rushing attack going, the sky is the limit for Burrow off that play-action.  

It is going to be interesting to see the board reaction when "Pollack" isn't the magical cureall word that solves all the Bengals offensive problems that people have been making it for the last 6 months.

The Jets didn't exactly prosper under Pollack.

Mediocre/bad RBs often have 1 year highs that are just never recreated. We've seen it a ton just in the AFCN even. Cedric Benson in 2009, Peyton Hillis in 2010, Jeremy Hill in 2014, Justin Forsett in 2014, Alex Collins in 2017, James Connor in 2018... that's just off the top of my head in the AFCN.

Also worth noting, Mixon has missed multiple games in 3 of his 4 seasons. He's not exactly durable, so even if he does go back to 2018 form, I highly highly doubt that he's a legitimate 2,000 all-purpose yard candidate. In 2018 he was 536 yards shy of that mark and that was his career best. That's not a small amount away. 

Le'Veon Bell was the last guy to go to 2k in the AFCN (in 2014) and only roughly 1 person per year gets there in all of the NFL, with zero repeats since Ray Rice did it in '09 and '11.

Last time I heard someone talk about 2k yards for a Bengals RB was Jeremy Hill heading into the 2015 season "they should give him the ball 30 times a game!"

[impactplaya]

(07-05-2021, 08:16 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: It is going to be interesting to see the board reaction when "Pollack" isn't the magical cureall word that solves all the Bengals offensive problems that people have been making it for the last 6 months.

The Jets didn't exactly prosper under Pollack.

Mediocre/bad RBs often have 1 year highs that are just never recreated. We've seen it a ton just in the AFCN even. Cedric Benson in 2009, Peyton Hillis in 2010, Jeremy Hill in 2014, Justin Forsett in 2014, Alex Collins in 2017, James Connor in 2018... that's just off the top of my head in the AFCN.

Also worth noting, Mixon has missed multiple games in 3 of his 4 seasons. He's not exactly durable, so even if he does go back to 2018 form, I highly highly doubt that he's a legitimate 2,000 all-purpose yard candidate. In 2018 he was 536 yards shy of that mark and that was his career best. That's not a small amount away. 

Le'Veon Bell was the last guy to go to 2k in the AFCN (in 2014) and only roughly 1 person per year gets there in all of the NFL, with zero repeats since Ray Rice did it in '09 and '11.

Last time I heard someone talk about 2k yards for a Bengals RB was Jeremy Hill heading into the 2015 season "they should give him the ball 30 times a game!"

In this era of the NFL very few RBs produce at a high level
For a long time.funny those RBs you listed peaked at one year
And then soon after those teams quickly moved on from them
Peyton Hillis was the only weapon The Browns had.
Mangini basically ran a high school offense
Then Hillis then mentally checked out

Jeremy Hill was never the same after the fumble.
Then I forgot who the OC was the year after..Zampese?. Somehow thought it was genius
Giving Hill the ball on the 1st drive then.shutting him.down
Hill is out of league now.
Forsett was a journeyman. Collins was meh. But the Ravens
Had good olines.


Bell.got paid and lost his edge and desire to be great.
Mixon can achieve 2000 yards but I dont see it
Too many other weapons in.this offense that can produce
Plus I think Perrine might get some extra touches based
On.how he finished in 2020

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(07-05-2021, 10:13 PM)impactplaya Wrote: Jeremy Hill was never the same after the fumble.

Hill wasn't the same even before the fumble. He ran for 1.5 less yards per carry in 2015 than in 2014. Dropped all the way down to 3.6 YPC and 0 games of 100+ rushing yards.

Admittedly he was still very valuable as a short yardage/goal line guy with 44 carries of 1-3 yards to-go and getting 9 TD and 31 1st Downs on them. That's pretty money, but that's not the monster promise we saw from 2014.

But yeah, there's only a couple RBs in the league right now that are worth being paid big money after their rookie deal. It's just such a short lived position anymore that you're best off just spending a 2nd round pick ever 4 years and using him up as much as you can before getting another.

[Dr.Z]

Running backs thrive when accompanied by a great passing attack. I think If our passing attack is as good as many of us are hoping, then Mixon will have a pretty huge year if healthy. Even with a sort of “throw back” style running back like Derrick Henry; look at the splits with and without Tannehill. 3 of the 3.9 yards of Mixon’s ypc over the past 2 years have been after contact. Pollack’s blocking technique, at least theoretically, should compliment Mixon’s style (patient) better as well.

[Frank Booth]

(07-05-2021, 11:19 PM)Dr.Z Wrote: Running backs thrive when accompanied by a great passing attack. I think If our passing attack is as good as many of us are hoping, then Mixon will have a pretty huge year if healthy. Even with a sort of “throw back” style running back like Derrick Henry; look at the splits with and without Tannehill. 3 of the 3.9 yards of Mixon’s ypc over the past 2 years have been after contact. Pollack’s blocking technique, at least theoretically, should compliment Mixon’s style (patient) better as well.

Don’t get it confused

Henry opens up the passing game in tennessee

They also had a couple winning seasons and a playoff win when Mariota was there

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-05-2021, 02:18 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: This is sound analysis as usual, Racer!  Also, I looked at Joe Burrow’s passing statistics at LSU during his final season and his best passer rating came in games when he threw between 25-35 passes per game.

Thanks!  And, I will add that he also distributes the ball all over.  He doesn't focus in on any one target (although he loves to attack the middle of the field with the slot WR, RB, and TE.  Having a guy like Chase will force defenses to cover every inch of the field as well, as he also loves to take shots down the field with him.

I'm crazy excited about this offense, and crazy curious to see what this defense will be.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-05-2021, 08:16 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: It is going to be interesting to see the board reaction when "Pollack" isn't the magical cureall word that solves all the Bengals offensive problems that people have been making it for the last 6 months.

The Jets didn't exactly prosper under Pollack.

Mediocre/bad RBs often have 1 year highs that are just never recreated. We've seen it a ton just in the AFCN even. Cedric Benson in 2009, Peyton Hillis in 2010, Jeremy Hill in 2014, Justin Forsett in 2014, Alex Collins in 2017, James Connor in 2018... that's just off the top of my head in the AFCN.

Also worth noting, Mixon has missed multiple games in 3 of his 4 seasons. He's not exactly durable, so even if he does go back to 2018 form, I highly highly doubt that he's a legitimate 2,000 all-purpose yard candidate. In 2018 he was 536 yards shy of that mark and that was his career best. That's not a small amount away. 

Le'Veon Bell was the last guy to go to 2k in the AFCN (in 2014) and only roughly 1 person per year gets there in all of the NFL, with zero repeats since Ray Rice did it in '09 and '11.

Last time I heard someone talk about 2k yards for a Bengals RB was Jeremy Hill heading into the 2015 season "they should give him the ball 30 times a game!"

The Jets improved from 94 yards a game in 2019 to 105.2 per game in 2020, which is 22nd in the NFL.  Not exactly earth-shattering, but a significant improvement under Pollack and their top RB was Frank Gore.  

I am not trying to convey that Pollack arrives and all the Bengal's issues with the rushing attack are eliminated, but I do see the potential for significant improvement for the following reasons:

- Jim Turner is gone
- Joe Mixon is back
- Perine is not someone people look forward to tackling at the end of a game
- The Bengals weren't THAT bad in 2020, despite Mixon being out and having Turner:  Ranked 24th in the league, and averaged 4.1 YPC.
- Significant upgrades on the offensive line from the awful unit that started most of the early games

2,000 all-purpose yards is a crazy season for a single RB, but Mixon IS a legitimate candidate.  Always coming off the field for Gio took away a lot of his receiving potential.  I don't think it is unrealistic to think Mixon could have 50 receptions and 500 yards this upcoming season.  If that happens, and the rushing attack is working with good balance on the offense in general, 1500 rushing yards doesn't seem unfathomable.

Plus, I like that Mixon seems very hungry.  I know it is all talk right now, but he is saying he wants to be the #1 RB in the NFL this year.  I love it and think it is time to really unleash him.   

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-05-2021, 05:37 PM)Wyche Wrote: Me. Too. In fact, I was pounding the ol proverbial table. Unlike Mixon, as I noted back then,  Cook ran behind an extremely porous line in Tallahassee. He still produced, and produced quite well. 

My fear was Joe was gonna be hampered more behind a trash line than the more "slippery" Cook would.

Five years...time sure flies when you're losing.

I did as well.  Wanted nothing to do with Mixon, although I have heard that Cook had quite a rap sheet as well, just hidden better than Joe, who did something horrific on video tape. 

Thus far, Mixon has totally proven me wrong.  He isn't the second coming of Walter Peyton or anything, but I think he is poised for a really big season and I love his energy.  

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(07-06-2021, 09:14 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I did as well.  Wanted nothing to do with Mixon, although I have heard that Cook had quite a rap sheet as well, just hidden better than Joe, who did something horrific on video tape. 

Thus far, Mixon has totally proven me wrong.  He isn't the second coming of Walter Peyton or anything, but I think he is poised for a really big season and I love his energy.  

Yes, Dalvin had some growing pains....a lot of immature crap, and letting hangers on remain in his off the field social life. He cleaned it up, there was a BB gun incident, an assault, and an altercation at a bar during his freshman and sophomore years. 

[Dr.Z]

(07-05-2021, 11:47 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: Don’t get it confused

Henry opens up the passing game in tennessee

They also had a couple winning seasons and a playoff win when Mariota was there

Thank you neighbor, but I don't have it confused.   Henry is a good back regardless, and they have complimented each other, along with other variables (AJ Brown / Corey Davis's underrated blocking / Lewan health/ the defense, etc), but if you can't conclude that Tannehill inherently improved Henry's game, then we will just ultimately have to agree to disagree short of the dissection of stats and why the stats are stats. I follow the Titans more than any other team besides the Bengals (not saying I have any extra credibility or anything) and think Tannehill has been pretty underrated among the general consensus ~btw, dig the username and av~ 

[fredtoast]

(07-03-2021, 10:22 PM)jason Wrote: Yep... Maybe after x amount of years of being a blah NFL RB, we can start to realize that maybe Joe Mixon isn't who we thought he was coming outta Oklahoma. He led the AFC in yardage one year. That was the year of injuries, holdouts, and suspensions for a lot of the top backs in the conference.... But he did beat out undrafted Phillip Lindsay... Barely.

Wow.  It takes a special kind of fan to shit on a Bengal for leading the AFC in rushing.

Over the last three seasons, despite playing behind a terrible O-line, Mixon is top 10 in the league in both rushing yards and rushing yards per game. He is one of only 5 RBs to have two 1100-yards seasons since 2018.

He is also 15th among RBs in both receptions and receiving yards.

[SadFaceBengal15]

(07-04-2021, 08:07 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: I wanted Dalvin Cook.


Anyway...anyone else realize this is Mixon's 5th year in the league?

I wanted cook too but mixon imo should be just as good if not better why he isn’t yet pisses me off

[SadFaceBengal15]

(07-03-2021, 10:22 PM)jason Wrote: Yep... Maybe after x amount of years of being a blah NFL RB, we can start to realize that maybe Joe Mixon isn't who we thought he was coming outta Oklahoma. He led the AFC in yardage one year. That was the year of injuries, holdouts, and suspensions for a lot of the top backs in the conference.... But he did beat out undrafted Phillip Lindsay... Barely.

This is dead on. To many homers in here that are too close to be honest but unless mixon breaks out this year Im ok with moving on. But I need to see more out of mixon