Just A Simple Question Regarding This Year's FA

[GodFather]

Where the hell are these NFL teams getting all this money to sign multiple players to huge contracts.


I see what the Bengals cap space is and money leftover from last season and other teams going to town that aren't in as good of a position and pulling these crazy high money contracts.

Crazy...

[Murdock2420]

(03-23-2022, 04:13 PM)GodFather Wrote: Where the hell are these NFL teams getting all this money to sign multiple players to huge contracts.


I see what the Bengals cap space is and money leftover from last season and other teams going to town that aren't in as good of a position and pulling these crazy high money contracts.

Crazy...

It's all about the structure of the contract and how much of it actually counts against the cap in any given season.

Contracts can be back-loaded, with big signing bonuses that are spread across the life of the contract, making the first few seasons easy to deal with and then tougher each season after, which leads to kicking the can down the road again with a "re-structuring of the deal." 

Add into that, performance based bonuses that can be added that don't count against the cap at all and well...a team can manipulate a contract if they are willing to put in the work and careful wording and getting the player to agree to certain terms.

[BFritz21]

(03-23-2022, 05:36 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: It's all about the structure of the contract and how much of it actually counts against the cap in any given season.

Contracts can be back-loaded, with big signing bonuses that are spread across the life of the contract, making the first few seasons easy to deal with and then tougher each season after, which leads to kicking the can down the road again with a "re-structuring of the deal." 

Add into that, performance based bonuses that can be added that don't count against the cap at all and well...a team can manipulate a contract if they are willing to put in the work and careful wording and getting the player to agree to certain terms.

They eventually count when they're paid out, don't they?

Otherwise, it would be easy to manipulate the cap by just signing player to a vet minimum and then saying "you get a 10 million dollar bonus if you rush for two yards in a season."

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-23-2022, 05:36 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: It's all about the structure of the contract and how much of it actually counts against the cap in any given season.

Contracts can be back-loaded, with big signing bonuses that are spread across the life of the contract, making the first few seasons easy to deal with and then tougher each season after, which leads to kicking the can down the road again with a "re-structuring of the deal." 

Add into that, performance based bonuses that can be added that don't count against the cap at all and well...a team can manipulate a contract if they are willing to put in the work and careful wording and getting the player to agree to certain terms.

Murdock said it better than I could. This also means there are ways for us to still be in play for a couple good FA's.

I expect Ogunjobi to be back after the Draft once his foot is fully healed on a prove it deal too.

[Luvnit2]

(03-23-2022, 04:13 PM)GodFather Wrote: Where the hell are these NFL teams getting all this money to sign multiple players to huge contracts.


I see what the Bengals cap space is and money leftover from last season and other teams going to town that aren't in as good of a position and pulling these crazy high money contracts.

Crazy...

It is cap gymnastics not only with these guys being signed liked Watson for only 1 million in salary in 2022, but being paid a ton of cash being spread over the contract (Cap hits later), but go to Spotrac NFL and you will see exactly how teams are getting the cap money under the transactions section. 

The teams are having players convert base salary and other bonuses eligible into a bonus, then spread that bonus out life of the contract sometimes adding voidable years reducing their 2022 cap and increasing the cap hit for future years. It also increases the dead money hit if a player does not work out or is injured and cut in some cases. Bengals could do it create another 35 to 50 million in 2022 if they want to, but why do it you don't have to so they can save for later huge contracts coming due.

The transactions page is a one by one look at the players being cut, signing or restructuring deals. It is a long list as you keep hitting more to see more transactions but you will be amazed how many guys and teams have restructured contracts in 2022 to add cap money.

[Luvnit2]

(03-23-2022, 05:40 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: They eventually count when they're paid out, don't they?

Otherwise, it would be easy to manipulate the cap by just signing player to a vet minimum and then saying "you get a 10 million dollar bonus if you rush for two yards in a season.

Add into that, performance based bonuses that can be added that don't count against the cap at all and


I am not certain, but some performance based bonuses do count against the cap, but are just spread out over life of the contract. After a year is over, a team can get a credit if the player did not hit the incentive, if hit then it was already counted so nothing to do.


So no a team can't just throw in a huge performance bonus and it never being accounted for if I read it correctly. I think the only bonuses not count against the cap are things like a workout bonus.

[GodFather]

(03-23-2022, 06:28 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: It is cap gymnastics not only with these guys being signed liked Watson for only 1 million in salary in 2022, but being paid a ton of cash being spread over the contract (Cap hits later), but go to Spotrac NFL and you will see exactly how teams are getting the cap money under the transactions section. 

The teams are having players convert base salary and other bonuses eligible into a bonus, then spread that bonus out life of the contract sometimes adding voidable years reducing their 2022 cap and increasing the cap hit for future years. It also increases the dead money hit if a player does not work out or is injured and cut in some cases. Bengals could do it create another 35 to 50 million in 2022 if they want to, but why do it you don't have to so they can save for later huge contracts coming due.

The transactions page is a one by one look at the players being cut, signing or restructuring deals. It is a long list as you keep hitting more to see more transactions but you will be amazed how many guys and teams have restructured contracts in 2022 to add cap money.

good post!! 

[Murdock2420]

(03-23-2022, 05:40 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: They eventually count when they're paid out, don't they?

Otherwise, it would be easy to manipulate the cap by just signing player to a vet minimum and then saying "you get a 10 million dollar bonus if you rush for two yards in a season.

They do count into the following year depending on the type of incentive.

There are two types of incentives: Likely to be earned and Unlikely to be earned.


Likely to be earned count against the cap. Unlikely to be earned do not. If you achieve an unlikely to be earned bonus, it counts against the cap the following year. If you fail to achieve a likely to be earned bonus, your team gets that money as extra cap space the following year.

What determines "likely" is what you did the previous year. Flat out. So if you had 9 sacks in 2013 a 2014 performance bonus for 10 sacks would be considered "unlikely to be earned" whereas a bonus for 9 sacks would be considered "likely to be earned".

It's all a bit of carefully structured gymnastics to float money down the road to later years.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

The salary cap is a lie.

The Saints had like -$71m in cap space, released nobody, signed a $9.5m/yr safety and were still trying to trade for Deshaun Watson's huge contract before setting on a $14m/yr QB instead.

The Buccaneers had basically no cap space, re-signed a $20m/yr WR, re-signed a $15m/yr CB, a $7m/yr RB, a $13m/yr C.

It's all about how talented your FO is at moving numbers and how much cash your owner is willing to shell out in bonuses. Meanwhile there's already people on this board talking about how the Bengals are going to have to lose both Higgins and Boyd in 2 years to pay Chase despite Chase having 4 years of team control yet even without franchise tags. FO trained them to think in the exact opposite of good FOs.

[GodFather]

(03-23-2022, 08:10 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: It's all about how talented your FO is at moving numbers and how much cash your owner is willing to shell out in bonuses.

Yeah the whole thing seems like a shitshow to me. We are trying to stay in the cap signing this year's players while other teams continue to break the bank and it doesn't effect them at all even down the line. 

[wanga]

This salary cap magic teams are pulling off does my head in trying to work it out. Is my simplistic version of it that teams that go huge and restructure contracts to make cap for huge FA signings just pushing it all down the track for a year or 2 to come and teams like the Bengal generally stick to their ‘yearly budget’ and stay around the cap each year in more ‘genuine’ figures?