30,000 foot view of the Bengals and the league in ‘23

[casear2727]

(02-02-2023, 05:54 PM)Synric Wrote: They were talking about it on the Pat Macafee show. Pretty much whenever they bring up Lamar Jackson.

They are wrong, teams cannot make offers randomly on an exclusive tag, permission must be granted by the current team.

[Stewy]

(02-02-2023, 05:43 PM)Synric Wrote: You aren't getting it. The Ravens would have to Non Exclusive Franchise Tag Lamar Jackson the most a team has to give up for Jackson is 2 first round picks.

All a trade would do is trade the no exclusive franchise tag rights which still means any team in the NFL can win Lamar if they are willing to give up the most money and 2 first round picks.

Yeah and you're wrong as others have proven.  Try looking up things yourself instead of relying upon 3rd party sources.

[Sled21]

(02-02-2023, 05:55 PM)casear2727 Wrote: "The Ravens and Jackson would likely need to work together on a trade because an offer sheet is prohibited with the exclusive designation. Written permission would have to be granted by the Ravens for Jackson to legally talk to other teams because Baltimore would hold his exclusive rights.

Jackson would probably be allowed to negotiate a contract with serious suitors while the Ravens figured out the trade compensation with those teams."

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/agents-take-has-lamar-jackson-played-final-game-with-ravens-how-team-can-deal-with-soon-to-be-free-agent-qb/

I don't think the Ravens want Lamar back. He's expensive, and they just cut the OC who designed the offense around Lamar's skillset. If they planned on keeping Lamar, they would have kept Roman. On the flip side, I think Lamar wants to go to the NFC. If he stays in the AFCN, he has to compete against Burrow and Watson and Pickett every year for the division, and the rest of the AFC, including Mahomes, Herbert, Allen, etc., should the Rats make the playoffs.

The NFC South doesn't even have a quarterback in the whole division. Tampa had Brady, he retired. NO has Dalton and Winston, so Dalton basically, and AD is AD. Panthers have Sam Darnold... yawn. And Atlanta has Mariota. Lamar wins that division all by himself. Then when you get to conference play you have Geno smith, Daniel Jones, Jared Goff, Justin Fields, Trey Lance, Carson Wentz (maybe) Hurts, Cousins, Murray (who knows when he will be back, Prescott, Stafford and Rodgers. Not exactly the murderers row the AFC has. Lamar's path back to the Super Bowl is a whole lot easier if he switches to the NFC. 

[casear2727]

(02-03-2023, 10:21 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I don't think the Ravens want Lamar back. He's expensive, and they just cut the OC who designed the offense around Lamar's skillset. If they planned on keeping Lamar, they would have kept Roman. On the flip side, I think Lamar wants to go to the NFC. If he stays in the AFCN, he has to compete against Burrow and Watson and Pickett every year for the division, and the rest of the AFC, including Mahomes, Herbert, Allen, etc., should the Rats make the playoffs.

The NFC South doesn't even have a quarterback in the whole division. Tampa had Brady, he retired. NO has Dalton and Winston, so Dalton basically, and AD is AD. Panthers have Sam Darnold... yawn. And Atlanta has Mariota. Lamar wins that division all by himself. Then when you get to conference play you have Geno smith, Daniel Jones, Jared Goff, Justin Fields, Trey Lance, Carson Wentz (maybe) Hurts, Cousins, Murray (who knows when he will be back, Prescott, Stafford and Rodgers. Not exactly the murderers row the AFC has. Lamar's path back to the Super Bowl is a whole lot easier if he switches to the NFC. 

Or it could be the opposite, and Lamar was not happy with Roman.  I dont disagree that the NFC is an easier path, but I'm not sure. that Jackson is shying away from competition in the AFC (I would).

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(02-01-2023, 03:11 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Call me crazy, but Hurts is not as good of a passer as the top guys in the AFC - Burrow, Mahomes, Allen.
I'd take any of them over Hurts.

Just like I thought with Denver getting Wilson, I don't think the Jets magically improve a ton after a season with double-digit losses by getting a new QB.
They might get 2-3 more wins, but that's not really contender-level.

I'd take Hurts over Allen. I don't trust either of them on a 10 year deal because running QBs will always start to physically break down, but Allen just isn't accurate enough and makes way too many turnovers while Hurts is very good and seems to be getting even better.

I wouldn't overlook the Jets. They were 5-2 with a combination of Zach Wilson and Joe Flacco but really didn't have an answer offensively once they lost both Breece Hall and Alijah Vera-Tucker. I wouldn't go as far as saying SB contender, but with them back they have a run game again, and they had a top-5 scoring defense. You add a good/great QB and they're a playoff team at least.

(02-01-2023, 04:05 PM)Joelist Wrote: I'd actually contend the opposite - Lamar KEEPS THEM from being a real threat. His lack of real touch and general issues operating a passing offense from the pocket have held their offense back for years, as has the need to have an eccentric custom offense modeled around him. 

If the Rats do the right thing, they dump Lamar and reconfigure the offense back into something more rational. Either draft a QB high or use the "Lamar money" to bring in a legit starter as a Free Agent. Then get more receivers. 

Yeah, I am with you. I have been hoping that they'd sign him for a couple years now because I think it would be the only way to be sure that we don't really have to worry about Baltimore for awhile.

(02-01-2023, 04:30 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Well threat I’d disagree elite I would agree. Having a great QB is pretty important. SF seems the outlier. Philly may not have an elite passer in Hurts but his running makes up for it so he’s pretty elite. If they dump Lamar it’s not a given by any means they fare better. JMO but I’m a lot less concerned about Baltimore than I was last year at this time. It all depends what happens at QB.

Hurts had two WRs both 4 yards away from being a 1,500 yard receiver and a 1,200 yard receiver. His rushing actually got a little worse this year than '21. It was his evolution as a passer that allowed the Eagles to be a wagon. All of his passing stats are improving immensely each year.

Jackson has only gotten 1 WR to ever reach 800 yards in his career, and the guy requested a trade the next season. He has also never thrown for even 3,200 yards in a season before.

[BillsGuy1986]

This is a good 30,000 foot view and fun to prognosticate as fans (groundhog's day was yesterday, some people with get that reference).

One thing i've learned is that I know nothing. The NFL can be so random you are lucky if you get anything not blatantly obvious right.

I will say though that the teams with the top QBs will probably be good and those without top QBs won't. I'm smart! But who will be top QBs next year? I'd bet Burrow, Mahomes, Allen, Herbert and Lawrence. I think Lamaar won't be here but there will be some big signing or trade where the AFC pilfers a good NFC QB or maybe Russell Wilson or Deshaun Watson will come back to relevancy.

Aside from free agent signings or trade talk, I completely ignore the NFC aside for this one game that happens next week Sunday.

[Hammerstripes]

(02-02-2023, 05:46 PM)Synric Wrote: They can be traded under the non exclusive not the exclusive which is what makes the Lamar Jackson situation so weird.

They can be traded under both tags.

The only difference is that the player cannot negotiate a contract with another team under the exclusive tag.

ONCE he signs the tag, he can then be traded, not before.

[Soonerpeace]

(02-03-2023, 12:04 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I'd take Hurts over Allen. I don't trust either of them on a 10 year deal because running QBs will always start to physically break down, but Allen just isn't accurate enough and makes way too many turnovers while Hurts is very good and seems to be getting even better.

I wouldn't overlook the Jets. They were 5-2 with a combination of Zach Wilson and Joe Flacco but really didn't have an answer offensively once they lost both Breece Hall and Alijah Vera-Tucker. I wouldn't go as far as saying SB contender, but with them back they have a run game again, and they had a top-5 scoring defense. You add a good/great QB and they're a playoff team at least.


Yeah, I am with you. I have been hoping that they'd sign him for a couple years now because I think it would be the only way to be sure that we don't really have to worry about Baltimore for awhile.


Hurts had two WRs both 4 yards away from being a 1,500 yard receiver and a 1,200 yard receiver. His rushing actually got a little worse this year than '21. It was his evolution as a passer that allowed the Eagles to be a wagon. All of his passing stats are improving immensely each year.

Jackson has only gotten 1 WR to ever reach 800 yards in his career, and the guy requested a trade the next season. He has also never thrown for even 3,200 yards in a season before.

Hurts is an elite QB only because of his dual threat. He has improved immensely as I’m readily familiar with him as I’ve seen him in person more than anybody likely on this board. I also know he goes through rigorous off season work to improve. Doubt any QB or any player works harder. Reminiscent of Jerry Rice. It’s clearly paid off. As far as Jackson grading him on just his WR performance is short sighted. His rushing and hook up with Mark Andrews is a big factor in their offensive success. But I don’t think Lamar is elite. Now he’s still a top 10 QB but fringe. Baltimore won’t be as good without him.

[Graphicguy]

(02-01-2023, 06:06 PM)Rubekahn29 Wrote: Wouldn’t be surprised if they draft a RB and TE as well.

Was just saying this to a colleague a few days ago. Set aside the recent Mixon news, Bengals could pick up a RB in the draft without seeing much drop off to free up money. As much as I like Hurst, I always felt he was a short term fix. Draft a TE and save some money there, too.

If Hurst gives the Bengals a discount given what he’s said regarding how much he likes it here, maybe bring him back on another one year deal.

Would not be surprised to see Boyd become a casualty. The other “what if”, what if Collins gets an injury settlement and is cut? I think Apple is all but gone.

Given all the above, now you have some real money to play with to improve through Free Agency!

[*psychdoctor*]

The Cincinnati Bengals lost the super bowl on the last play against a great defense tackle. They lost the AFC championship game against Kansas City against a great tackle. I know they're losing some free agents, but if the Bengals can fix the o line I think they could win both of those games. It probably will come down to Kansas City Chiefs Buffalo bills or the Cincinnati Bengals next year.

[casear2727]

(02-03-2023, 02:25 PM)Graphicguy Wrote: Was just saying this to a colleague a few days ago.  Set aside the recent Mixon news, Bengals could pick up a RB in the draft without seeing much drop off to free up money.  As much as I like Hurst, I always felt he was a short term fix.  Draft a TE and save some money there, too.

If Hurst gives the Bengals a discount given what he’s said regarding how much he likes it here, maybe bring him back on another one year deal.

Would not be surprised to see Boyd become a casualty.  The other “what if”, what if Collins gets an injury settlement and is cut?  I think Apple is all but gone.

Given all the above, now you have some real money to play with to improve through Free Agency!

TE is a position that takes a very long time to be a solid NFL player.  Trusting a rookie without a quality vet is risky.  Sign Hurst, or someone, reasonably and draft one.