Mitch Wilcox and Brandon Allen

[BIGDADDYFROMCINCINNATI]

(05-01-2023, 08:55 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: NFL Network’s Bucky Brooks who I think is one of the best analysts by far just rated our draft class the best of all 32 teams. I guess Zac’s thinking about knocking it out of the park. Several others have said the greatest thing about our draft was not reaching. They liked Kincaid and La Porta but neither were close to them in the draft. I think that they just liked other players better. But you can’t fix everything in FA and the draft. I’m not comfortable with the situation but we fixed a lot of areas.

I read an article where it was saying we drafted players off Bruce Feldman's freak list and Zack Kuntz was the biggest surprise at the combine and was also very high on Feldman's list.   I loved our draft and except for our final pick when this guy was there and we need a TE.  I mean this kid is 6'8 250-lbs and runs a 4.5/40- Kuntz 25-rep bench, and he is there in Round 7 when we have a plethora of DBs!?!?!?

[Soonerpeace]

(05-01-2023, 08:52 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: When at full strength, Sample contributes to the team in ways that don't show up on the stat sheet.  He was drafted because of his blocking ability, you can bet that they are confident that he'll be fully healthy, as they didn't want to see him waste the rest of his career with a team on the rebuild.

Totally agree

[Nepa]

(05-01-2023, 08:55 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: NFL Network’s Bucky Brooks who I think is one of the best analysts by far just rated our draft class the best of all 32 teams. I guess Zac’s thinking about knocking it out of the park. Several others have said the greatest thing about our draft was not reaching. They liked Kincaid and La Porta but neither were close to them in the draft. I think that they just liked other players better. But you can’t fix everything in FA and the draft. I’m not comfortable with the situation but we fixed a lot of areas.

Really? Better than the Eagles, Seahawks, or Steeler's drafts?  Could you give a link for that? I have been googling without success. Most rankings have the Bengals lower in the draft rankings than at least a few teams, but particularly the Eagles.

Here is a list of several draft rankings:  https://www.cleveland.com/bengals/2023/05/bengals-2023-nfl-draft-heres-what-the-experts-are-saying.html
This list for the Bengals has links to the full rankings for each organization or individual.

[007BengalsFan]

(05-01-2023, 09:19 PM)BIGDADDYFROMCINCINNATI Wrote: I read an article where it was saying we drafted players off Bruce Feldman's freak list and Zack Kuntz was the biggest surprise at the combine and was also very high on Feldman's list.   I loved our draft and except for our final pick when this guy was there and we need a TE.  I mean this kid is 6'8 250-lbs and runs a 4.5/40- Kuntz 25-rep bench, and he is there in Round 7 when we have a plethora of DBs!?!?!?

Kuntz was picked #220 in the 7th.  Our 7th round pick was #246.  We took Brad Robbins with the last pick in the 6th round #217  I would have rather took Kuntz with #217 and targeted a kicker at #246.  Kuntz was a 4 star recruit offered by Alabama, Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State.  He had special teams experience and could have been a valuable addition.  I think the coaching staff might have missed on that one.

[Soonerpeace]

(05-01-2023, 09:19 PM)BIGDADDYFROMCINCINNATI Wrote: I read an article where it was saying we drafted players off Bruce Feldman's freak list and Zack Kuntz was the biggest surprise at the combine and was also very high on Feldman's list.   I loved our draft and except for our final pick when this guy was there and we need a TE.  I mean this kid is 6'8 250-lbs and runs a 4.5/40- Kuntz 25-rep bench, and he is there in Round 7 when we have a plethora of DBs!?!?!?

Well I can’t argue that. But this I know they really value blockers and a few weren’t that a lot of people here and in the mocks liked. But they didn’t ever look at Bruce Feldman’s freaks list. They’ve got their own. Of course some were on Bruce’s list. But Duke Tobin and Zac are working together famously. But Duke’s been here a long time and Zac has not. And we are drafting pretty good. Zac has rerouted the scouting department. I didn’t say overhauled. He’s given them guidance on who he wants. They’ve done it fantastically. He wanted team captains, team leaders, players that love ball, players from top programs, and just good people. None of that was more evident than this draft. The team chemistry is no mirage. But Zac has a great eye for talent.

[Soonerpeace]

(05-01-2023, 09:28 PM)Nepa Wrote: Really? Better than the Eagles, Seahawks, or Steeler's drafts?  Could you give a link for that? I have been googling without success. Most rankings have the Bengals lower in the draft rankings than at least a few teams, but particularly the Eagles.

Here is a list of several draft rankings:  https://www.cleveland.com/bengals/2023/05/bengals-2023-nfl-draft-heres-what-the-experts-are-saying.html
This list for the Bengals has links to the full rankings for each organization or individual.

It was on TV tonight. I rewound it about 3 times and listened I was so giddy.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-01-2023, 09:28 PM)Nepa Wrote: Really? Better than the Eagles, Seahawks, or Steeler's drafts?  Could you give a link for that? I have been googling without success. Most rankings have the Bengals lower in the draft rankings than at least a few teams, but particularly the Eagles.

Here is a list of several draft rankings:  https://www.cleveland.com/bengals/2023/05/bengals-2023-nfl-draft-heres-what-the-experts-are-saying.html
This list for the Bengals has links to the full rankings for each organization or individual.

Umm, that article doesn't have "rankings" per se, but only "grades" from various sources.  And, as has been discussed ad nauseum on here, the fact remains that you really cannot determine the quality of a particular draft until years after the event.  ALL of these "ratings and grades" are just bloviating from a sports media forced to make content out of simple things.  

Sure, it's fun to be excited about the draft, but keep in mind that everyone directly involved knows much more about what's going on than any sports writer could possibly portray.  With that said, I feel pretty damned good about the Bengals draft, the coaching and management has the team heading in a good direction.  At age 54 I finally believe in this organization again, 20 years ago I used to doubt weather I would see the Bengals be an NFL force in my lifetime again or not.

[Soonerpeace]

(05-01-2023, 09:54 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Umm, that article doesn't have "rankings" per se, but only "grades" from various sources.  And, as has been discussed ad nauseum on here, the fact remains that you really cannot determine the quality of a particular draft until years after the event.  ALL of these "ratings and grades" are just bloviating from a sports media forced to make content out of simple things.  

Sure, it's fun to be excited about the draft, but keep in mind that everyone directly involved knows much more about what's going on than any sports writer could possibly portray.  With that said, I feel pretty damned good about the Bengals draft, the coaching and management has the team heading in a good direction.  At age 54 I finally believe in this organization again, 20 years ago I used to doubt weather I would see the Bengals be an NFL force in my lifetime again or not.

It’s not easy drafting so late. But you are right KC nailed it last year. They had 8 (count'm) contribute and 6 heavily this year. I seriously doubt anybody was predicting that last year or ranked theirs the best lol.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-01-2023, 10:06 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: It’s not easy drafting so late. But you are right KC nailed it last year. They had 8 (count'm) contribute and 6 heavily this year. I seriously doubt anybody was predicting that last year or ranked theirs the best lol.

It's not by accident that things have changed positively for the Bengals.  When they hired Zac Taylor commitments to the way of doing business were likely key in him accepting the position.  I believe that he and Duke communicate extremely well, and that is leading to much more productive drafts.  Obviously, everything cannot be fixed in a single offseason, but when you already have a solid roster, great strides can still be made at shoring up specific areas while still improving the team as a whole.

[Soonerpeace]

(05-01-2023, 10:22 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: It's not by accident that things have changed positively for the Bengals.  When they hired Zac Taylor commitments to the way of doing business were likely key in him accepting the position.  I believe that he and Duke communicate extremely well, and that is leading to much more productive drafts.  Obviously, everything cannot be fixed in a single offseason, but when you already have a solid roster, great strides can still be made at shoring up specific areas while still improving the team as a whole.

I think there was an urgency after the first season that they all had to dig in. I mean social media team you name it. It was rock bottom. Zac Taylor wasn’t wunderkind. He was inexperienced got a slow start because of his late hiring. He was far from having all the answers. Neither did Bill Belichick who wasn’t an immediate success. Andy Reid got fired at Philly. But Zac had a vision and he dramatically changed the entire culture in the building not just the team. But the Blackburns deserve a lot of credit too for stepping up to the plate.

[Soonerpeace]

(05-01-2023, 09:28 PM)Nepa Wrote: Really? Better than the Eagles, Seahawks, or Steeler's drafts?  Could you give a link for that? I have been googling without success. Most rankings have the Bengals lower in the draft rankings than at least a few teams, but particularly the Eagles.

Here is a list of several draft rankings:  https://www.cleveland.com/bengals/2023/05/bengals-2023-nfl-draft-heres-what-the-experts-are-saying.html
This list for the Bengals has links to the full rankings for each organization or individual.

Watched the repeat just now

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(05-01-2023, 09:37 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Kuntz was picked #220 in the 7th.  Our 7th round pick was #246.  We took Brad Robbins with the last pick in the 6th round #217  I would have rather took Kuntz with #217 and targeted a kicker at #246.  Kuntz was a 4 star recruit offered by Alabama, Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State.  He had special teams experience and could have been a valuable addition.  I think the coaching staff might have missed on that one.

I think that conundrum was what we wrestled with with that second 6th rounder: take the pick of the litter at punter (Baringer had been picked already) or gamble the punter would be available in the 7th and take the best available field player (for me, Trice, Kuntz, or Vorhees). 

Though waiting on P till 7th is probably best case if it works (or waiting to UDFA), the fact is the starting punter will likely have more impact on the season than TE3 or CB6 or an OG who is out this year,  And I think last punt really chapped the coaches' asses. You are getting a starter if you take the P. 

[BIGDADDYFROMCINCINNATI]

(05-01-2023, 09:37 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Well I can’t argue that. But this I know they really value blockers and a few weren’t that a lot of people here and in the mocks liked. But they didn’t ever look at Bruce Feldman’s freaks list. They’ve got their own. Of course some were on Bruce’s list. But Duke Tobin and Zac are working together famously. But Duke’s been here a long time and Zac has not. And we are drafting pretty good. Zac has rerouted the scouting department. I didn’t say overhauled. He’s given them guidance on who he wants. They’ve done it fantastically. He wanted team captains, team leaders, players that love ball, players from top programs, and just good people. None of that was more evident than this draft. The team chemistry is no mirage. But Zac has a great eye for talent.

I agree with the above poster and we whiffed on this one big time.  We could have got the punter in 7th and this Zack Kuntz kid in the 6th.  You say we were looking for strength and blocking ability, I think he has the strength, and the blocking can be taught.  Here is Feldman's report with him listed at # 11 on the list.

Penn State has had a bunch of gifted tight ends and a few who ended up leaving to flourish at other programs. [Zack] Kuntz, a former high school track star who was a state champion in hurdles, has blossomed at Old Dominion. In 2021, he won first-team All-Conference USA honors and was second in the country among tight ends with 73 receptions to go with 692 yards. At 6-8 1/4, 251 pounds, Kuntz is an eye-popping blend of great size and athleticism. This offseason he clocked a 4.57 40 to go with his 40-inch vertical and 10-8 broad jump. His explosiveness is also reflected in a 365-pound clean (and a 23-rep bench.) 

https://theathletic.com/3488797/2022/08/10/college-football-freaks-list-2022/

https://www.nfldraftbuzz.com/Player/Zack-Kuntz-TE-PennState

[Redsbengalsbucks]

Yes i want them to sign both Wilcox and Allen back

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(05-02-2023, 10:58 AM)Redsbengalsbucks Wrote: Yes i want them to sign both Wilcox and Allen back

Both very possible. Neither moves the needle on the cap much. 

I will say that if we don't get one of the extensions done, we may have a bit of $$$ to sign a slightly more expensive vet to a 1 year deal at a spot. Or more than one spot. QB & TE (along with RB & CB) seem like the most obvious ones. 

[Bengal Dude]

I wouldn't mind Wilcox back. 

[*pally*]

Per Tom Peliserro....Brandon Allen is signing with the 49ers

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