Let's take a minute and acknowledge this

[*SHRacerX*]

I will say what I said to the Rams fan who sat next to us at the last home game. He asked: "what does your city think of Dalton"? I said that I can't speak for the city, but I love him. He's a very talented and cerebral QB. Beyond that, I love that he is a humble, team-first guy. He is exactly what this team needed.

[XenoMorph]

(12-06-2015, 08:20 PM)jfkbengals Wrote: He also now has the most road victories by an NFL QB in his first 5 seasons.

4 more passing TDs and he will be 3rd behind only peyton and marino for most TDs in first 5 seasons as well.

[OrlandoBengal]

(12-07-2015, 09:20 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: It should measure "first five years starting" not in the league.

Because there are multiple great QBs who did not start a full season in their rookie years, including Rodgers, Palmer, Brady, Brees, Rivers and Eli Manning. And that's just talking about QBs off the top of my head that are playing today. I'm sure several of the all time greats did not play in their rookie years either.

Would it still be so exclusive if they did expand it to first 5 years starting, rather than first 5 years in the league?

I actually think that is part of what makes it exclusive.  The fact that he did not get a chance to sit and learn the pro game, that he was forced into action immediately.

For anyone talking about the playoff losses being "team losses", only the head coach and the quarterback get judged on wins.  Fair or not, that is how it is and how it will continue to be.  You can't talk about "the most road wins through five seasons" as a positive and then not give criticism for the playoff failures.  Let's be fair, Andy has not exactly lit it up in any of the playoff losses... yes, there were a number of injuries last year, but none of the games have been good. 

He is playing great this year, and is getting a lot of love in the national media.  He seems much more mature and confident this year, so there is no reason to believe it won't carry through to the playoffs.

[fredtoast]

(12-07-2015, 11:54 AM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: For anyone talking about the playoff losses being "team losses", only the head coach and the quarterback get judged on wins.  Fair or not, that is how it is and how it will continue to be.  You can't talk about "the most road wins through five seasons" as a positive and then not give criticism for the playoff failures.  Let's be fair, Andy has not exactly lit it up in any of the playoff losses... yes, there were a number of injuries last year, but none of the games have been good. 

I agree that if you give Andty credit for wins then you alos have to ive him some blame for losses.

The problem I have with his post-season criticism is that some people claim it is better for a QB to not make the playoffs than it is to make it to the playoffs and lose.  

As crazy as it sounds, Dalton would probably be getting a lot more love from the national media right now if he had actually missed the playoffs his first two seasons.

[Luvnit2]

(12-07-2015, 11:54 AM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: I actually think that is part of what makes it exclusive.  The fact that he did not get a chance to sit and learn the pro game, that he was forced into action immediately.

For anyone talking about the playoff losses being "team losses", only the head coach and the quarterback get judged on wins.  Fair or not, that is how it is and how it will continue to be.  You can't talk about "the most road wins through five seasons" as a positive and then not give criticism for the playoff failures.  Let's be fair, Andy has not exactly lit it up in any of the playoff losses... yes, there were a number of injuries last year, but none of the games have been good. 

He is playing great this year, and is getting a lot of love in the national media.  He seems much more mature and confident this year, so there is no reason to believe it won't carry through to the playoffs.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Well said

It is a huge advantage to sit a year, 2 or 3 learning on the job versus being thrown into the fire day 1. I would add year one was a strike so he got his playbook late and had no rookie camp and training camp was late as well due to the strike (no OTA's in 2011 due to the CBA agreement not being approved until the summer)

[XenoMorph]

(12-07-2015, 11:54 AM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: I actually think that is part of what makes it exclusive.  The fact that he did not get a chance to sit and learn the pro game, that he was forced into action immediately.

For anyone talking about the playoff losses being "team losses", only the head coach and the quarterback get judged on wins.  Fair or not, that is how it is and how it will continue to be.  You can't talk about "the most road wins through five seasons" as a positive and then not give criticism for the playoff failures.  Let's be fair, Andy has not exactly lit it up in any of the playoff losses... yes, there were a number of injuries last year, but none of the games have been good. 

He is playing great this year, and is getting a lot of love in the national media.  He seems much more mature and confident this year, so there is no reason to believe it won't carry through to the playoffs.

hopefully our Secondary gets healthy before then

[OrlandoBengal]

(12-07-2015, 11:59 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I agree that if you give Andty credit for wins then you alos have to ive him some blame for losses.

The problem I have with his post-season criticism is that some people claim it is better for a QB to not make the playoffs than it is to make it to the playoffs and lose.  

As crazy as it sounds, Dalton would probably be getting a lot more love from the national media right now if he had actually missed the playoffs his first two seasons.

Gruden brought this up in the Monday night game.  He said that making the playoffs those first two years brought a great amount of expectations.  I think some people just see "four straight playoff losses" and focus solely on that.

I will be the first person to admit I have had doubts about Dalton in the past.  I give him a great amount of credit though.  I think the continued work with House has paid huge dividends in his delivery.  I don't know if he sought out some advice about the mental aspect of the game, but I think he has made enormous strides in that part of the game.  It is a good time to be a Bengals fan, and I am extremely glad that they chose Dalton over Kaepernick...

[CincyProduct]

(12-06-2015, 08:25 PM)The Real Deal Wrote: Yes sir.... Where is  "toast jones"  and "corner blitz"  now?

They'll only resurface IF we lose in the playoffs, I'm sure. 

They are trolls that pop up when they feel as though the team is in disarray to fan the flames of malcontent. But it is more than those two look at the game day threads those people live there.

[XenoMorph]

(12-07-2015, 01:19 PM)CincyProduct Wrote: They are trolls that pop up when they feel as though the team is in disarray to fan the flames of malcontent. But it is more than those two look at the game day threads those people live there.

lol yep waiting for anything just one misque or bad play to harp on

[Rhinocero23]

(12-06-2015, 08:18 PM)The Real Deal Wrote: Respect must be given. It's real folks, he's a player.

http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/25403188/more-proof-that-andy-dalton-is-one-of-the-nfls-best-quarterbacks

Andy is having a awesome year and is proving a lot of "homers" correct so far this year. I am happy to eat crow and say I did not see this coming from him...this year or ever. I hope to be eating crow for a long time!

[Shake n Blake]

(12-07-2015, 04:28 AM)CornerBlitz Wrote: Dalton is having a spectacular year. I certainly have enjoyed every game in which we've won. This team in general is a joy to watch...but and yes there is a BUT we have to win in the playoffs for all this to actually be meaningful. You have a year like this and the Bengals lose in the playoffs and the thing we will remember most about this season is that we choked yet again in the playoffs.

I don't want to think about the playoffs at this point but since others brought it up I thought I'd throw my 2 cents.

As far as being wrong about the dude.....yes I was wrong about him entirely if he continues to play like this. I have no issue admitting that.

I totally agree with you. This season will still be a disappointment if the team goes one-n-done again. All I'm saying is that Dalton is having a special season that proves he should be in the discussion with the best QB's in the game.

If Dalton fails in the playoffs, then so be it. He's a top QB who struggles (for whatever reason) in the playoffs.  He shouldn't need playoff success to be acknowledged as a top QB though. Not when that status has been bestowed upon the likes of Palmer, Romo, Peyton (before he won a ring), Matt Ryan and others in the past.

It seems as if the media is refusing to take Dalton seriously until he wins a playoff game, yet no such thing is said about Palmer, who has gone much longer without a win. It makes no sense.

[Shake n Blake]

(12-07-2015, 03:49 PM)Rhinocero23 Wrote: Andy is having a awesome year and is proving a lot of "homers" correct so far this year.

I'm no homer and I've always backed Dalton. The overwhelming hate for the guy just never made sense to me. Obviously he had some down moments in previous years, but he had a ton of success for a young QB. He showed potential and progress every year.

[Daddy-O]

(12-07-2015, 12:11 AM)Utts Wrote: Andy is having a great season, and playing better than I ever thought he was capable of. However, I'd argue that much of the past criticism was warranted, and if he tanks in the playoffs the spectacular regular season will be largely meaningless.

I'm more concerned about the defense tanking than Dalton.  They are #1 and should shut down the opponent.  We'll see what happens.  Their playoff history is suspect also.

[corpjet]

While never a hater, I have been a doubter.

This season has done nothing but solidify our beloved "Red Rifle" as one of the leagues Top QB's and someone we all should be thankful to have lead our team!

[3wt]

(12-07-2015, 04:52 PM)Daddy-O Wrote: I'm more concerned about the defense tanking than Dalton.  They are #1 and should shut down the opponent.  We'll see what happens.  Their playoff history is suspect also.

That will depend on how healthy we get at defensive back - and how well the linebackers not named Burfict play.

Especially against an offense like Pittsburgh with Ben improving week by week.   Our DBs were healthy when we played them at their house. And Ben was just coming back and was pretty gimpy looking.

And I would be concerned about our offense.  It's not like we rolled over them the last game. 

[*Nately120*]

(12-07-2015, 04:27 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: It seems as if the media is refusing to take Dalton seriously until he wins a playoff game, yet no such thing is said about Palmer, who has gone much longer without a win. It makes no sense.

I'm not sure if that's necessarily true.  I recall on PTI Tony Kornheiser was gushing about Palmer's borderline MVP season and that the Cardinals can be a Super Bowl favorite and Mike Wilbon just said "How many playoff games has he won?" knowing the answer was zero.  The whole playoff wins stat is worth acknowledging, but we also have to realize that Rex Grossman, Mark Sanchez, and Tim Tebow all have playoff wins. Hell, Sanchez might have more than the Bengals had in 46 years.

Like Fred pointed out, when you get to a certain level and fail then getting to that level each time becomes less of a recognized accomplishment and more of a joke in the eyes of outsiders.  I think of the Bills in the 90s.  Many football fans would be thrilled with their team making the Super Bowl, but when lose 4 in a row even teams that never won the thing start jabbing at you.

Additionally, I have to admit the bias involved. When the Bengals make the playoffs and lose in the first round we try to cheer the accomplishment, can't win if you aren't in, and so on. When the Steelers go one-n-done we don't applaud them, we laugh because they got Tebowed right out of the playoffs. One 'n' done. Suck it! NYEAH NYEAH and so on. Admit it, if the Steelers went one 'n' done 4 times in a row we'd all be in stitches and wonder why they'd be stupid enough to not fire Tomlin and hire anyone else. Meh, perspective.

[Derrick]

(12-07-2015, 03:46 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: It seems kinda unfair that the playoffs are an excuse not to give proper credit to Dalton for the year he is having. Palmer sports an 0-2 playoff record in his 13th season and the media is slobbering on him.

If you want to slam Dalton for choking in the playoffs (when we get to that point), I'd get it. But the season Dalton is having is f'ing epic and worthy of praise. Using the playoffs as excuse not to acknowledge his possible ascension to elite status is just a lame way for people to keep from admitting they were probably wrong about the dude.

I totally agree. He deserves credit for what he is accomplishing this season.

[Fresno B]

What pisses me off about Dalton is that he's capable of playing with the best, like he's proving so far this season.

It's those games like the one against the browns last season on tnf and the playoff games where he has me scratching my head

We will have to wait for the playoffs to see if he's really turned a corner.

Lol at you guys calling out others for having their own opinions.

[XenoMorph]

(12-07-2015, 09:30 PM)Fresno B Wrote: What pisses me off about Dalton is that he's capable of playing with the best, like he's proving so far this season.

It's those games like the one against the browns last season on tnf and the playoff games where he has me scratching my head

We will have to wait for the playoffs to see if he's really turned a corner.

Lol at you guys calling out others for having their own opinions.

your not getting called out for having an opinion your getting called out for your poor trolling efforts.

You wanna know the difference between this year and last its plan as day. Look at the receiving cast available for those games vs now.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-08-2015, 12:51 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: You wanna know the difference between this year and last its plan as day.  Look at the receiving cast available for those games vs now.

That would require seeing the forest AND the trees.....