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(02-24-2024, 10:35 PM)bfine32 Wrote: You get one year of Tee in return; plus a comp pick.
Why do folks want to get rid of our good players?
Ima bet Pittman is tagged very soon and he won't be traded either; because with the Cap bump and being able to keep a great starter based on last year's contract numbers is something no team should pass up.
Because people want players that will be here for the long term not just a one year rental. I think most people will be fine if they find away to keep Tee longterm. (Longterm 3 to 5 years)
Also Pittman is a 100% the #1 in Indy while Tee is the number 2 here. Albeit he would be a #1 elsewhere!
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(02-24-2024, 10:35 PM)bfine32 Wrote: You get one year of Tee in return; plus a comp pick.
Why do folks want to get rid of our good players?
Ima bet Pittman is tagged very soon and he won't be traded either; because with the Cap bump and being able to keep a great starter based on last year's contract numbers is something no team should pass up.
If the colts had Justin Jefferson on their team they would be in the same boat as us and would tag and trade Pittman....just because the salary cap goes up doesnt mean you can afford two top level WR's when you have a ton of holes to fill and you have 2 OL whose gonna need extended or replaced in the next year or two...LOTS of teams have won SB's without 2 top level WR's.
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What happened to my thread ???
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(02-24-2024, 10:55 PM)J24 Wrote: Because people want players that will be here for the long term not just a one year rental. I think most people will be fine if they find away to keep Tee longterm. (Longterm 3 to 5 years)
Also Pittman is a 100% the #1 in Indy while Tee is the number 2 here. Albeit he would be a #1 elsewhere!
Maybe we can sign Trent Irwin long-term. Tee is not a one-year rental this will be his 5th year on the team.
Then Indy will sign Pittman to a long-term deal?
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(02-24-2024, 11:09 PM)pulses Wrote: If the colts had Justin Jefferson on their team they would be in the same boat as us and would tag and trade Pittman....just because the salary cap goes up doesnt mean you can afford to top level WR's when you have a ton of holes to fill and you have 2 OL whose gonna need extended or replaced in the next year or two...LOTS of teams have won SB's without 2 top level WR's.
Perhaps folks don't understand the Cap went up for everyone.
You "Tag and Trade" Tee; who are you getting in FA; now that every other team in the NFL got $30 Mil extra dollars?
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I see an argument for both sides so idc what we do
My heart does want Tee and Chase together but i do see issues with 3 players making 60M(Burrow) 30M(Chase) and 25M(Tee).
Thats over 100M on 3 guys.
In their defense all 3 could easily be all pro next year
-Housh
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(02-24-2024, 11:06 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Good breakdown here.
Jesse James analysis was, indeed, insightful. I do have some skepticism about his first point: " If the Tag is official, this allows for possible, fruitful trade discussions at the combine. Remember, teams cannot discuss trades involving players that are not on their roster. Until officially tagged or signed, Tee cannot “legally” be discussed regarding trades. Realistically, this would be the main reason Tee was tagged at this time. Otherwise, teams wait and see if an extension can be worked out due to the negative stigmas players and agents have of the tag.) "
The reason I'm uncertain, is that to be official Tee would have to sign the tag and who knows if he would do that before the combine. I suspect not.
His third point, however, is something I hadn't considered and is intriguing: "The double tag scenario is very much at play here. The tag next year would be roughly $26,160,000 (120% of Tee’s contract in ‘24) or whatever the tag amount is next year, whichever is higher. This is still less than I imagine DM (Tee’s Agent) is asking for. Between ‘24 & ‘25, Tee would be getting almost $48 million (also guaranteed). This # is less than the $25m aav I have seen is being tossed around (not verified). Considered a win for the Bengals."
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(02-25-2024, 12:00 AM)Nepa Wrote: Jesse James analysis was, indeed, insightful. I do have some skepticism about his first point: "If the Tag is official, this allows for possible, fruitful trade discussions at the combine. Remember, teams cannot discuss trades involving players that are not on their roster. Until officially tagged or signed, Tee cannot “legally” be discussed regarding trades. Realistically, this would be the main reason Tee was tagged at this time. Otherwise, teams wait and see if an extension can be worked out due to the negative stigmas players and agents have of the tag.) "
The reason I'm uncertain, is that to be official Tee would have to sign the tag and who knows if he would do that before the combine. I suspect not.
His third point, however, is something I hadn't considered and is intriguing: "The double tag scenario is very much at play here. The tag next year would be roughly $26,160,000 (120% of Tee’s contract in ‘24) or whatever the tag amount is next year, whichever is higher. This is still less than I imagine DM (Tee’s Agent) is asking for. Between ‘24 & ‘25, Tee would be getting almost $48 million (also guaranteed). This # is less than the $25m aav I have seen is being tossed around (not verified). Considered a win for the Bengals."
Yeah I hadn't even considered the 2nd tag number either. Talks could get really messy, but that's a great chip to have. They can tag OR tag and trade next year, that's a lot better than waiting another calander year for a possible 3rd from a comp pick.
I think one thing that doesn't get talked about enough (probably because comp pick is a trigger phrase). For Cincy to recoup a 3rd from losing Tee, they'd have to navigate next offseason around not signing a similar FA. Even if they dont care about the comp pick, it may be wise to offer thia year's FA's a significantly bigger 2nd year number to get closer to the limit knowing they'll be off the books in 26 for Burrow and Chase's big hits. That may work well for bridge FAs at RT since they'll probably draft one at some point due to the class depth. The same could go for a stopgap NT or even older TE since you may not ger a plug and play rookie at those positions I'd rather overpay a guy in yr 2 than hope a lower pick contributes.
I know that is more of an offseason comment, but what they do with Tee is a critical decision and every step should be considered including that 2nd tag.
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(02-24-2024, 11:09 PM)pulses Wrote: If the colts had Justin Jefferson on their team they would be in the same boat as us and would tag and trade Pittman....just because the salary cap goes up doesnt mean you can afford to top level WR's when you have a ton of holes to fill and you have 2 OL whose gonna need extended or replaced in the next year or two...LOTS of teams have won SB's without 2 top level WR's.
Hate to tell you this...but in 2021 if the Bengals don't
Have Chase and Higgins they don't go to the SB.
Hypothetically if JBs starting WRs in 2024 was Irwin and Jones, there is no way the Bengals are reaching
The SB
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How different is this thread if we just stop Kupp behind the line on the 4th down run? The debate over not resigning the only SB MVP in history.
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(02-25-2024, 01:11 AM)impactplaya Wrote: Hate to tell you this...but in 2021 if the Bengals don't
Have Chase and Higgins they don't go to the SB.
Hypothetically if JBs starting WRs in 2024 was Irwin and Jones, there is no way the Bengals are reaching
The SB
Hate to tell you this but not every team who wins a SB every year has 2 elite WR's some don't even have 1 ( this years Chiefs) And I disagree about 2021 our D was badass that year and its the ONLY REASON we made it to the SB.Most everyone has Higgins on some pedastal around here.....got news for ya he's good but he's not 20 or 25/yr good and probably never will be with his injury problems. Better off to move and get some value for him and fix other areas.
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(02-24-2024, 11:41 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Perhaps folks don't understand the Cap went up for everyone.
You "Tag and Trade" Tee; who are you getting in FA; now that every other team in the NFL got $30 Mil extra dollars?
That's why they do have a CAP SPACE...just because they added 30 million doesn't actually mean some team
s will have that much extra some are in the hole and others barely have any....it helps us more than it does most because we had a lot to begin with....and we get assets for Tee as well.
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(02-24-2024, 11:41 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Perhaps folks don't understand the Cap went up for everyone.
You "Tag and Trade" Tee; who are you getting in FA; now that every other team in the NFL got $30 Mil extra dollars?
Bengals are an attractive landing spot for players seeking a chance at a ring still. This is not the old Bengals thanks to Burrow, Chase, Zac, and Katie. Take the extra 30 added, the 20 that Tee would get, plus the money already having to spend and the Bengals could fix that D-line quickly with elite talent and get a RT as well and still have the extra draft picks from Tee left to spend. Think the young safeties and CB's as is would be fine (pun intended))with an elite D-line.
Take extra draft pick received from Tee trade, couple it with the Bengals 18th pick and move up and get Harrison on a rookie deal.
If Tee is willing to sign a 4 year $20 million deal then sign him, if not move on immediately. Don't let an often injured player break the bank because we all like him so much.
KC moved on from Hill with not much consequence, going to 3 straight AFC Championship games and winning two SB's in 3 years. So it obviously can be done with a good QB which is the most important ingredient to possess.
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(02-25-2024, 09:41 AM)Go Cards Wrote: Bengals are an attractive landing spot for players seeking a chance at a ring still. This is not the old Bengals thanks to Burrow, Chase, Zac, and Katie. Take the extra 30 added, the 20 that Tee would get, plus the money already having to spend and the Bengals could fix that D-line quickly with elite talent and get a RT as well and still have the extra draft picks from Tee left to spend. Think the young safeties and CB's as is would be fine (pun intended))with an elite D-line.
Take extra draft pick received from Tee trade, couple it with the Bengals 18th pick and move up and get Harrison on a rookie deal.
If Tee is willing to sign a 4 year $20 million deal then sign him, if not move on immediately. Don't let an often injured player break the bank because we all like him so much.
KC moved on from Hill with not much consequence, going to 3 straight AFC Championship games and winning two SB's in 3 years. So it obviously can be done with a good QB which is the most important ingredient to possess.
Marvin Harrison projected by many to go in the top 5. To get someone to trade you are going to have to offer a hell of a lot more than swapping picks and Tee. The reason why I think trading Tee is not promising. We can’t get a good deal. KC struggled at WR this year. Their defense saved them this year.
Romo “ so impressed with Zac ...1 of the best in the NFL… they are just fundamentally sound. Taylor the best winning % in the Playoffs of current coaches. Joe Burrow” Zac is the best head coach in the NFL & that gives me a lot of confidence." Taylor led the Bengals to their first playoff win since 1990, ending the longest active drought in the four major North American sports, en and appeared in Super Bowl LVI, the first since 1988.
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(02-24-2024, 09:18 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Would you give up the Bengals 1st round draft pick for a 1 year rental of Tee Higgins at 22 million?
Because that is what the Bengals will be doing. They will be losing a 1st round draft pick by not trading Tee and letting him walk after the season. It will cost them a 1st round draft pick to keep Tee Higgns for this one year.
How is it going to feel when Tee pulls his hamstring again this year and doesnt play down the stretch knowing you gave up a 1st round draft pick to have this happen?
I love the opportunity cost angle. I agree it’s a mistake to tag and let
Him walk. Tag and trade is best option, followed by sign a long term deal. But our opportunity cost isn’t pick 18. It’s more likely a high round 2 pick, in the 30’s
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(02-25-2024, 12:00 AM)Nepa Wrote: Jesse James analysis was, indeed, insightful. I do have some skepticism about his first point: "If the Tag is official, this allows for possible, fruitful trade discussions at the combine. Remember, teams cannot discuss trades involving players that are not on their roster. Until officially tagged or signed, Tee cannot “legally” be discussed regarding trades. Realistically, this would be the main reason Tee was tagged at this time. Otherwise, teams wait and see if an extension can be worked out due to the negative stigmas players and agents have of the tag.) "
The reason I'm uncertain, is that to be official Tee would have to sign the tag and who knows if he would do that before the combine. I suspect not.
His third point, however, is something I hadn't considered and is intriguing: "The double tag scenario is very much at play here. The tag next year would be roughly $26,160,000 (120% of Tee’s contract in ‘24) or whatever the tag amount is next year, whichever is higher. This is still less than I imagine DM (Tee’s Agent) is asking for. Between ‘24 & ‘25, Tee would be getting almost $48 million (also guaranteed). This # is less than the $25m aav I have seen is being tossed around (not verified). Considered a win for the Bengals."
If the Bengals file the franchise tag paperwork with the NFL they have control of Tee for another season even if he doesn't sign the tag meaning they can negotiate a trade.
This happens every year.
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(02-25-2024, 09:41 AM)Go Cards Wrote: Bengals are an attractive landing spot for players seeking a chance at a ring still. This is not the old Bengals thanks to Burrow, Chase, Zac, and Katie. Take the extra 30 added, the 20 that Tee would get, plus the money already having to spend and the Bengals could fix that D-line quickly with elite talent and get a RT as well and still have the extra draft picks from Tee left to spend. Think the young safeties and CB's as is would be fine (pun intended))with an elite D-line.
Take extra draft pick received from Tee trade, couple it with the Bengals 18th pick and move up and get Harrison on a rookie deal.
If Tee is willing to sign a 4 year $20 million deal then sign him, if not move on immediately. Don't let an often injured player break the bank because we all like him so much.
KC moved on from Hill with not much consequence, going to 3 straight AFC Championship games and winning two SB's in 3 years. So it obviously can be done with a good QB which is the most important ingredient to possess.
Why would anyone ever trade a top 5 pick, Marvin Harrison in this scenario, for Tee Higgins and 18. They’re trading a better (most likely) talent at dirt cheap pricing for 5 years, for a player that needs to sign a $100M contract.
Draft picks are the most important thing in the NFL, due to the cap. The only universal competitive advantage in the nfl is finding more all pro talents on rookie deals than your competition can find. I also believe trading picks for a player who is on a big deal or needs a big deal is the worst idea any franchise can make. You have to give up cap space and give up cheap talent (draft picks). Look at cheifs and dolphins. It didn’t work for the dolphins and they traded for the #1 receiver in the nfl. The cheifs still won that trade.
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(02-24-2024, 02:43 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Good stuff Synric. Keon Coleman is intriguing though, he is a good Returner and is faster than Tee but I could see the high bust potential.
Need to watch some AD Mitchell now.
Coleman might be slightly faster than Tee but Tee is a much much better route runner. Tee doesn't get enough credit for being the dude that makes tough catches in traffic. Coleman might be Higgins level in 2025 or 2026... maybe but in 2024 not a chance.
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(02-25-2024, 10:24 AM)Ell Prez Wrote: Why would anyone ever trade a top 5 pick, Marvin Harrison in this scenario, for Tee Higgins and 18. They’re trading a better (most likely) talent at dirt cheap pricing for 5 years, for a player that needs to sign a $100M contract.
Draft picks are the most important thing in the NFL, due to the cap. The only universal competitive advantage in the nfl is finding more all pro talents on rookie deals than your competition can find. I also believe trading picks for a player who is on a big deal or needs a big deal is the worst idea any franchise can make. You have to give up cap space and give up cheap talent (draft picks). Look at cheifs and dolphins. It didn’t work for the dolphins and they traded for the #1 receiver in the nfl. The cheifs still won that trade.
How did the trade not work out for the Dolphins again? Hill as played great for him these past two seasons and they have made the playoffs 2 years in a row!
Also what about Philly trading for AJ Brown? Who won that trade between them and the Titans?
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