Trading Stars to Rebuild: A case study

[*bfine32*]

(11-23-2024, 03:09 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Worked out for KC trading Hill.

That's because KC is the best in the NFL at draft and development. 

Trade good players for picks is not a model this team should follow. Nor is "trade back" to get more picks. 

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(11-20-2024, 11:52 PM)bfine32 Wrote: And if we trade Hendrickson, we still the awesome pass rusher..............

We shouldn't be trading for draft picks, we should nbe trading picks for players

But we have cap issues there. 

I am for clearing the decks on the mediocre overpaid guys (Rankins, Stone, McPherson, Cappa), plus maybe Drew Sample and Moss. 

Pay the guys that can play. Karras and Hubbard are borderline. 

The Lions had a terrible D last year and remade it despite losing Hutchison. All they needed was better DBs, good LB draft, and DJ Reader.

[*Nately120*]

(11-20-2024, 03:38 PM)CKwi88 Wrote: Rams got: Superbowl win
Lions got: Great team

Which would you prefer?

Well, we aren't going to be the team in this example that trades the farm for an established QB so I think our best shot is to be the Lions?

(11-23-2024, 11:46 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: BINGO

We can only hope and pray that happens here. You would think they'd wake up and smell the coffee.

They are awake, sadly.  That's the issue with our front office...they aren't going to suddenly "wake up" and realize what they are doing isn't working, because they are fine doing things the way they are doing them and if the planets align and we are good/great/champs, so much the better.

It'd be nice to trade picks for players, but that might require actually doing something that isn't mandated by the NFL and trading someone like Tee rather than letting him walk for a conditional pick.  Get off yer arse and get a better pick to trade for players.

The main reason we are any good is because we won 6 games over the span of 2 years and were able to draft Burrow and Chase, also known as something that is mandatory and gifted to franchises regardless of how lazy and glued to his recliner an NFL team's owner/GM happens to be.  The two best things about this team right now happened due to zero extra effort on the part of our front office...imagine that.  Hell, even if Mike Brown would have made the "wrong" choice of taking Sewell, it'd have been a great pick.  If the draft were somehow optional, I assume we'd opt out of it for some reason.

I even half joked with people who were locked on Burrow but nervous about us trading down that I knew we'd take Burrow at #1  because trading down for a bunch of picks and taking Herbert would have required the acceptance of "optional work" on Mike Brown's part.  So it goes.

[TecmoBengals]

Take away from this thread: We cannot compare the Bengals to other organizations.

Brown and Blackburn family run the team unlike other teams.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

Keep the foundational guys and make adjustments from there.

We screwed up with Reader big time.

Burrow, Chase, Hendrickson, and Higgins are our elite guys. Pay them. Cut elsewhere if you have to (Rankins, Stone, McPherson, Hubbard, Cappa, D. Sample, Moss, even Pratt/Wilson or let Hilton go).

[C0de_M0nkey]

Your case study doesn't mean much unless the Lions win a Super Bowl. Even if they do, their results are unlikely to be replicated with our coaching staff. Jared Goff is a system quarterback.

It's too late to trade Tee Higgins. There's no chance that we replace Trey or Chase's performance with 2nd or 3rd round picks. You're talking about the number one edge rusher in the NFL and the number one receiver in the NFL. Trading them would be idiotic.

We suck this year because we keep letting good players walk. We're probably the best team in the NFL if we re-sign Bates and Reader. We essentially did trade them for Vonn Bell, Geno Stone, and Sheldon Rankins. It didn't work out.

There's almost no chance that one of second or third round picks we get for Trey lead the NFL in sacks.

Stop being cheap and pay the guys who got you to the Super Bowl.

[2MinutesHate]

(11-24-2024, 06:18 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Take away from this thread: We cannot compare the Bengals to other organizations.

Brown and Blackburn family run the team unlike other teams.

But what do you think will happen when the end comes for MB?
Will the team instantly improve?  God, I would hate to think that Mikey would just simply be reincarnated in the form of Katie.

That would just be so unfair.

[TecmoBengals]

(11-24-2024, 11:59 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: But what do you think will happen when the end comes for MB?
Will the team instantly improve?  God, I would hate to think that Mikey would just simply be reincarnated in the form of Katie.

That would just be so unfair.

Doesn't Katie handle the contracts? I think our best hope is that the Blackburn daughters convince mom to make organizational changes after Brown is gone.

[SunsetBengal]

(11-24-2024, 06:18 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Take away from this thread: We cannot compare the Bengals to other organizations.

Brown and Blackburn family run the team unlike other teams.

They need to study up on how other smaller market teams like Buffalo and Detroit are getting it done. Buffalo gutted half the roster due to cap issues this past offseason, and are actually looking like an improved team after the roster turnover.

[TecmoBengals]

(11-25-2024, 12:40 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: They need to study up on how other smaller market teams like Buffalo and Detroit are getting it done. Buffalo gutted half the roster due to cap issues this past offseason, and are actually looking like an improved team after the roster turnover.

I think the fans who have followed the Bengals closely for decades know the challenge with your statement: Who is they? Is "they" Mike Brown? Is it Duke? is it Duke in conjunction with Mike Brown or even other organizational leaders such as the head coach or other members of the Brown family.

[SunsetBengal]

(11-25-2024, 12:59 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: I think the fans who have followed the Bengals closely for decades know the challenge with your statement: Who is they? Is "they" Mike Brown? Is it Duke? is it Duke in conjunction with Mike Brown or even other organizational leaders such as the head coach or other members of the Brown family.

They = The Bengals Management Team

[TecmoBengals]

(11-25-2024, 01:07 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: They = The Bengals Management Team

Big ask of Mikey. I picture him thumbing through a worn, well-used notebook that has a frayed cover and yellowed pages from the passage of time. The contents are scribbled writings from Paul Brown about running an NFL team such as always pay the QB or never pay too much for the IOL. Whatever else Paul Brown held true to as a coach and owner is in the notebook. I don't see this notebook telling Mike Brown to learn from or model the success of other teams.

I do personally agree with your sentiment. Benchmark organizations experiencing success and see how you can implement their practices.

[SunsetBengal]

(11-25-2024, 01:15 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Big ask of Mikey. I picture him thumbing through a worn, well-used notebook that has a frayed cover and yellowed pages from the passage of time. The contents are scribbled writings from Paul Brown about running an NFL team such as always pay the QB or never pay too much for the IOL. Whatever else Paul Brown held true to as a coach and owner is in the notebook. I don't see this notebook telling Mike Brown to learn from or model the success of other teams.

I do personally agree with your sentiment. Benchmark organizations experiencing success and see how you can implement their practices.

The problem with that theory is that while Paul Brown understood the value of fundamental players and drafted and assembled his teams accordingly, Mike seems to put tremendous value on the perimeter positions.

[TecmoBengals]

(11-25-2024, 01:53 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: The problem with that theory is that while Paul Brown understood the value of fundamental players and drafted and assembled his teams accordingly, Mike seems to put tremendous value on the perimeter positions.

More of a tongue-in-cheek remark than a theory. I have no idea how the Bengals leadership operates.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-25-2024, 01:53 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: The problem with that theory is that while Paul Brown understood the value of fundamental players and drafted and assembled his teams accordingly, Mike seems to put tremendous value on the perimeter positions.

This needs to stop more than anything. Great teams are built from the inside out as we see with the Chiefs, Lions and Eagles this year.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(11-24-2024, 05:26 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Well, we aren't going to be the team in this example that trades the farm for an established QB so I think our best shot is to be the Lions?.

They also traded in the off-season for a 1st Team All-Pro CB and another trade mid-season for a future HoFer pass rusher rental. They also signed a multi-time 2nd Team All-Pro WR instead of rolling with a PS scrub, and they signed an All-Pro safety for the playoffs to address that need. That is just 2021 alone.

CB, Pass Rusher, WR, S... All positions we have needed help at, imagine getting All-Pro caliber help at all four.