Who are our best position coaches?

[jfkbengals]

(12-27-2015, 01:08 PM)corpjet Wrote: Not tyring to start an argument but why is everyone so high on him?  I know Kubiak wanted him as their DC so there is def merit in it I guess Im just missing what the rage is all about?

Again not trying to say he isn't, just wondering what has people singing his praise?  

He has been considered as a sure fire, can't miss type of hire from those in the league.


We can only go by word of mouth on this, but when you have guys like Jones come out and say he is the best position coach that he has ever had, it lends credence to the idea.

[StLucieBengal]

Vance Joseph

We also do well on the DL, OL, and LB.

[Shake n Blake]

(12-27-2015, 11:28 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: not at all.. Alexander has done more with less than maybe all the positions on the team.  In his 24 years of coaching, I believe we have only taken 6 offensive lineman in the first two rounds ( all turned out as great or solid players also) during his tenure it has been actually rare to draft very high with offensive line.   He has also received high praise from others in his field.. Finally Marvin has let coaches go in the past.. if Alexander was as terrible as you think he would be long gone by now.  

Trust me I like other coaches also example Joseph but he is also working with like 5 1st or 2nd round picks in the draft.

Meh. Any time he's had a great o-line it featured multiple early draft picks (Willie Anderson, Steinbach, Levi Jones, Whit, Zeitler, Andre Smith, etc). When has PA ever developed a mid-late round pick into a good starter? When has he made an elite group without multiple early draft draft picks?

Jay Hayes can make that claim. Alexander, not so much. 

[jfkbengals]

(12-27-2015, 04:26 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Meh. Any time he's had a great o-line it featured multiple early draft picks (Willie Anderson, Steinbach, Levi Jones, Whit, Zeitler, Andre Smith, etc). When has PA ever developed a mid-late round pick into a good starter? When has he made an elite group without multiple early draft draft picks?

Jay Hayes can make that claim. Alexander, not so much. 

Rich Braham and Bobbie Williams were average at best before Alexander.

Livings, Collins, Andrews, all late round or UFA guys who were given big deals to go elsewhere and not play well.

Kyle Cook, UFA who was considered for a time to be one of the better centers in the league.

Clint Boling, 4th rounder who is a good starter.

[tigerseye]

I think we have alot of good coaches. Alexander is definitely one of them. People always want to bring up the Livings and Mathis decision. Well maybe they know something we didn't. Mathis has moved around and Philly didn't shed any tears when he left. Maybe he's a problem? Since PA has been here we have had alot of quality O lineman and quality line play as a unit. Over the years he has been our line coach ,I would put our line play up against any other teams line in comparison.  There are coaches that were kept to long that might not have produced at a high level but PA is not one of them.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-26-2015, 10:23 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Vance Joseph does a great job with the secondary.

Yup....

(12-26-2015, 10:29 AM)The Real Deal Wrote: Yep I'd say Vance Joseph, hands down. 

.....and doesn't Mark Carrier help with the group as well?

(12-26-2015, 01:40 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I've become a fan of Jay Hayes, considering he's never had a 1st round pick, rarely gets a 2nd rounder, yet his d-line is arguably the biggest strength of the team.

Good point....and I think it is either the biggest strength, or second to the secondary.

(12-26-2015, 09:20 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: You say they're gravy stains.

I bet WychesWarrior would beg to differ.

Thems Mike Brown's booty juice stains.

You know it! 

(12-27-2015, 09:37 AM)Bronxbengal Wrote: Is this April fools......?

(12-27-2015, 02:52 PM)jfkbengals Wrote: He has been considered as a sure fire, can't miss type of hire from those in the league.


We can only go by word of mouth on this, but when you have guys like Jones come out and say he is the best position coach that he has ever had, it lends credence to the idea.

Exactly right.....

(12-27-2015, 04:26 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Meh. Any time he's had a great o-line it featured multiple early draft picks (Willie Anderson, Steinbach, Levi Jones, Whit, Zeitler, Andre Smith, etc). When has PA ever developed a mid-late round pick into a good starter? When has he made an elite group without multiple early draft draft picks?

Jay Hayes can make that claim. Alexander, not so much. 

.....and to add a little to jfk's post, no one has been trying to "steal" Alexander from this staff for almost three decades.  Why is that if he's so great?  No promotions, no one wanting his services......including his ability to tickle the ivories.....I mean, SURELY someone in this league interested in winning Super Bowls would have tried to pluck this genius from our staff by now, right?

[Shake n Blake]

(12-27-2015, 05:02 PM)jfkbengals Wrote: Rich Braham and Bobbie Williams were average at best before Alexander.

Livings, Collins, Andrews, all late round or UFA guys who were given big deals to go elsewhere and not play well.

Kyle Cook, UFA who was considered for a time to be one of the better centers in the league.

Clint Boling, 4th rounder who is a good starter.

I asked for mid-late round picks that PA developed into good starters. Braham (3rd rounder) and Bobbie (2nd rounder) wouldn't qualify. 

Livings, Collins and Andrews were never considered good starters. Heck, they were mostly backups. Just because some teams goofed and paid them big bucks out of desperation doesn't mean they were considered good starting players for the Bengals.

Cook was never one of the best in the league. He was average at best and out of the league after he left. Boling is the only rock solid legit example of that bunch.

[XenoMorph]

(12-27-2015, 04:26 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Meh. Any time he's had a great o-line it featured multiple early draft picks (Willie Anderson, Steinbach, Levi Jones, Whit, Zeitler, Andre Smith, etc). When has PA ever developed a mid-late round pick into a good starter? When has he made an elite group without multiple early draft draft picks?

Jay Hayes can make that claim. Alexander, not so much. 

when was Jay Hayes line that good before Dunlap 2nd and Geno arrived? and the bengals started investing draft picks at the spot.

how about our Linebacker coach.. although currently DC Guenther.

[Shake n Blake]

(12-28-2015, 07:17 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: when was Jay Hayes line that good before Dunlap 2nd  and Geno arrived? and the bengals started investing draft picks at the spot.

How about 2009, when the d-line produced 24 sacks and helped the D finish 7th against the run (in both yards and ypc)?

[Bronxbengal]

(12-27-2015, 11:28 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: not at all.. Alexander has done more with less than maybe all the positions on the team.  In his 24 years of coaching, I believe we have only taken 6 offensive lineman in the first two rounds ( all turned out as great or solid players also) during his tenure it has been actually rare to draft very high with offensive line.   He has also received high praise from others in his field.. Finally Marvin has let coaches go in the past.. if Alexander was as terrible as you think he would be long gone by now.  

Trust me I like other coaches also example Joseph but he is also working with like 5 1st or 2nd round picks in the draft.

What are you smoking?  He has three first round picks and two second round picks?  Are you delusional or taking acid that has a high potency and this is all a halluciantion
?

[Bronxbengal]

(12-28-2015, 03:37 PM)Wyche Wrote: .....and to add a little to jfk's post, no one has been trying to "steal" Alexander from this staff for almost three decades.  Why is that if he's so great?  No promotions, no one wanting his services......including his ability to tickle the ivories.....I mean, SURELY someone in this league interested in winning Super Bowls would have tried to pluck this genius from our staff by now, right?

:nicethread: