Browns Fired Scouts Too Soon

[CageTheBengal]

Way to go Cleveland.

Quote:The Browns arguably fired safety Donte Whitner too late. And they’ve arguably fired six scouts too early.

Per a league source, other teams already have begun to try to pick the brains of the six former scouts in an effort to learn more about Cleveland’s plans for the draft. According to multiple league sources, the six former scouts are Bobby DePaul, Mike Hagen, Matt Holland, Scott Aligo, Harrison Ritcher, and James Kirkland.

DePaul, the Bears former director of pro personnel, Hagen, Kirkland, and Aligo arrived two years ago, along with Charles Bailey and Ron Hill. Bailey and Hill remain with the Browns.

It’s not known whether the six former scouts are telling other teams anything about Cleveland’s plans, whether they are permitted to do so given the terms of their contracts, or whether they even know anything about the team’s plans. It’s possible that the current regime thinks so dimly of their work that the front office has no concerns about anything they may say to another team.

Regardless, it’s also possible they had (and still have) access to certain research and other information; two years ago, former Browns G.M. Mike Lombardi was spotted at the Scouting Combine with documents containing prominent Browns logos while working with the Patriots.

The easier course for the Browns would have been to keep the scouts on the payroll but give them little or nothing to do for the next three weeks, perhaps even telling them to stay home with pay.

It’s yet another example of how the new-age Browns are doing things differently than other teams do things. From Cleveland’s perspective, the organization had a large staff of scouts, the team wanted to streamline the operations going forward, and the Browns wanted to be candid and honest with the departing scouts and give scouts whose contracts were expiring after the draft a chance to pursue new jobs. (Whitner may wonder that mindset didn’t apply to him a month ago.)

Still, it’s the kind of unconventional approach that will make it even more clear that, until the Browns start winning, the jokes won’t stop happening. The overriding goal of the organization remains to start winning.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/04/10/other-teams-already-are-picking-brains-of-fired-browns-scouts/#comments

[XenoMorph]

now a built in excuse to drafting bad

[CageTheBengal]

Now people are suggesting Hue is a bad fit with the Browns existing scouting dept...What exactly did Haslam learned during the failed hiring processes from before?

Quote:The new front office executives hired by the Browns this offseason come from an analytics background, led by new chief strategy officer Paul DePodesta, who was an important figure in Moneyball and a longtime baseball analytics guru.

But the Browns’ new head coach does not come from an analytics background, and a new ESPN Magazine profile of DePodesta suggests that coach Hue Jackson is likely to clash with the analytics people in Cleveland. The profile quotes a former NFL executive describing Jackson as “a very bad fit” for the approach DePodesta wants to take.

That executive also said Jackson’s coaching staff will not be on board with the analytics department’s decision making, and predicted that there will be fireworks in the draft room.

“It’s not just Hue Jackson,” the former executive said. “When data overrides gut, the majority of his coaching staff will all be there screaming, ‘What the f— are these computer guys doing? They don’t understand football, they don’t understand the locker room. They’re killing us.'”

For his part, Jackson has said there’s a process and a plan in Cleveland and he’s on board with it. But if the Browns struggle this season, questions will surely be raised about whether the analytics approach is in fundamental conflict with Jackson’s traditional football approach.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/04/11/report-suggests-hue-jackson-is-a-bad-fit-for-browns-analytics-staff/

[BengalChris]

Don't forget the owner's wife was part of the 4 person committee who selected Hue Jackson to be head coach. Maybe she knows what a statistic is, maybe not.

[SunsetBengal]

(04-11-2016, 02:12 PM)CageTheBengal Wrote: Now people are suggesting Hue is a bad fit with the Browns existing scouting dept...What exactly did Haslam learned during the failed hiring processes from before?




http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/04/11/report-suggests-hue-jackson-is-a-bad-fit-for-browns-analytics-staff/

Umm, according to the "moneyball" approach, I'm sure that Vince Lombardi would be a bad fit, as HC in Cleveland right now..

[Sabretooth]

They cut the scouts to be more like the Bengals.

[magikod]

(04-13-2016, 09:41 AM)Sabretooth Wrote: They cut the scouts to be more like the Bengals.

Didn't we finally get a scouting department a few years ago? 

[fredtoast]

1. Scouts generally don't have any part in the drafting decisions. All they do is provide information on players. So I doubt other teams will find anything new from these fired scouts.

2. "Analytics" is just another tool. If used properly it is a good thing. It has helped in both baseball and basketball. don't know why so many people thinkit is a bad thing when it has been proven to help teams be more effective.

[fredtoast]

(04-11-2016, 10:24 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Umm, according to the "moneyball" approach, I'm sure that Vince Lombardi would be a bad fit, as HC in Cleveland right now..

Why would you say this?  Lombardi seemed to have a very efficient game plan.

Do you have any idea what "analytics" even means?

[GodFather]

(04-17-2016, 08:29 AM)fredtoast Wrote: 1.  Scouts generally don't have any part in the drafting decisions.  All they do is provide information on players.  So I doubt other teams will find anything new from these fired scouts.

2.  "Analytics" is just another tool.  If used properly it is a good thing.  It has helped in both baseball and basketball.  don't know why so many people thinkit is a bad thing when it has been proven to help teams be more effective.

If Cleveland is successful with the the analytics approach in football, your going to see other teams jumping on the "Analytic" train in no time. Its such a copycat league. Right now, its going to be a wait n see approach. With the Browns as bad as they've been...have nothing to lose with this approach.

[fredtoast]

Right now the Browns have a huge decision to make. I say they would be smarter trading the #2 pick for a bunch of picks or players and rolling with RG3 as a starter this year. No rookie QB is going to look good with that team this year. But the fans are probably screaming for them to draft their "savior" QB with the #2 pick.

This is the kind of decision that analytics can't help with. Hue has to be able to look at film and workouts to see what is wrong with RG3 and decide if he can fix it.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

Is there such a thing as firing the people who thought Manziel or Weeden were 1st round talents, too early? I'm pretty positive at that point there's only too late.

Are these the same people who turned Julio Jones into a huge pile of nothing?

[StLucieBengal]

Maybe they should have hired an analytics head coach.

Trestman is big on analytics. Maybe he just needs an analytics heavy front office.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(04-19-2016, 05:08 PM)GodFather Wrote: If Cleveland is successful with the the analytics approach in football, your going to see other teams jumping on the "Analytic" train in no time. Its such a copycat league. Right now, its going to be a wait n see approach. With the Browns as bad as they've been...have nothing to lose with this approach.

Other teams are already getting in to it. It's just not going over well with the current coaches and scouts on what makes a player good.