Bengals releasing AJ Hawk

[leonardfan40]

(04-26-2016, 07:26 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Green Bay rushing defenses...
2015: 21st (No Hawk)
2014: 23rd (Less Hawk)
2013: 25th (Full Hawk)

Dude lost the starting job and wasn't even wanted on a shit run defense. Never understood the desire to sign him other than I guess the "OMG OSU!" factor that keeps Nugent employed. Was easy to see that was a bad signing that wouldn't work out the second it happened.

Hawk was not the only variable from their D over each of those years, run defense is based on the whole D or at least front 7, so those stats show little to nothing about hawk. He is a solid tackler but was not nearly as good in coverage as many said he was before we signed him. I tried my best to temper peoples expectations for him but it was an impossible battle. Dude got way more hype than he deserved, and now is getting more hate than he deserves. Anyone who knew much about him the last few years should have expected him to be about what he was, and I don't think the FO regrets signing him, I'm sure they didn't think he was going to come in and be a star, and it's not like he hurt the team. 

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-26-2016, 07:42 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Hawk was not the only variable from their D over each of those years, run defense is based on the whole D or at least front 7, so those stats show little to nothing about hawk. He is a solid tackler but was not nearly as good in coverage as many said he was before we signed him. I tried my best to temper peoples expectations for him but it was an impossible battle. Dude got way more hype than he deserved, and now is getting more hate than he deserves. Anyone who knew much about him the last few years should have expected him to be about what he was, and I don't think the FO regrets signing him, I'm sure they didn't think he was going to come in and be a star, and it's not like he hurt the team. 

Never claimed he was the ONLY one, but you're telling me that the middle linebacker on a defense doesn't have a large impact on a team's run defense? They started phasing him out in the final 5 games of 2015 because they were truly terrible against the run.

First 11 games: 136.7 ypg
Final 5 games: 83 ypg

Less Hawk made a big difference. Much like how Maualuga playing 95.8% of the defensive snaps in 2012 made him the worst linebacker in football, but had a decent year in 2014 when he played less than 40% of the defensive snaps.

No hate, he was what I expected him to be, not good. I'm sure he's a good dude, but not a good LB anymore.

[BURROWorBUST]

(04-26-2016, 05:19 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Is there any man you would like to sleep on? 

Two strong men and a van

[leonardfan40]

(04-26-2016, 07:59 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Never claimed he was the ONLY one, but you're telling me that the middle linebacker on a defense doesn't have a large impact on a team's run defense? They started phasing him out in the final 5 games of 2015 because they were truly terrible against the run.

First 11 games: 136.7 ypg
Final 5 games: 83 ypg

Less Hawk made a big difference. Much like how Maualuga playing 95.8% of the defensive snaps in 2012 made him the worst linebacker in football, but had a decent year in 2014 when he played less than 40% of the defensive snaps.

No hate, he was what I expected him to be, not good. I'm sure he's a good dude, but not a good LB anymore.

Yeah lets just blame that all on AJ Hawk. There's not a million different variables that go into rushing yards. Like idk, the opponents they played. Lets look at those last 5 teams they played in 2014 and their rushing rankings that year...

Patriots 18th
Falcons 24th
Bills 25th
Bucs 29th
Lions 28th

Not one of those teams was ranked in the top half of the league in rushing, and not one averaged over 4 ypc. For comparison 8 of their first 11 opponents were in the top 14 of the league in rushing, and all but one averaged over 4 ypc

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-26-2016, 08:29 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Yeah lets just blame that all on AJ Hawk. There's not a million different variables that go into rushing yards. Like idk, the opponents they played. Lets look at those last 5 teams they played in 2014 and their rushing rankings that year...

Patriots 18th
Falcons 24th
Bills 25th
Bucs 29th
Lions 28th

Not one of those teams was ranked in the top half of the league in rushing, and not one averaged over 4 ypc. For comparison 8 of their first 11 opponents were in the top 14 of the league in rushing, and all but one averaged over 4 ypc

...and yet despite all you say, the Packers benched him and wanted nothing to do with him in 2015, cutting him for non-salary cap reasons. Followed by getting cut by another team for non-salary cap reasons one year later after doing pretty much nothing despite that team having one suspended linebacker and another signed away in FA.

It's cool if you're a Buckeye fan or whatnot.



- - - - - - - - -
Sidenote: Another example of why I don't blame players taking the more guaranteed money another team offers over the Bengals' "generally" letting players see the end of their contract.

[Passepartout]

He is not the only one that should be blamed. The whole defense could be playing part of the blame. Give or take.

[leonardfan40]

(04-26-2016, 08:45 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: ...and yet despite all you say, the Packers benched him and wanted nothing to do with him in 2015, cutting him for non-salary cap reasons. Followed by getting cut by another team for non-salary cap reasons one year later after doing pretty much nothing despite that team having one suspended linebacker and another signed away in FA.

It's cool if you're a Buckeye fan or whatnot.

I am a buckeye fan, and i couldn't care less about how Hawk is perceived because he is a former buckeye. I do love how you keep throwing out pointless arguments like that and the packers TEAM rushing stats though, it's quite amusing.

I'm not saying Hawk was great, he played limited snaps because he's decent against the run and bad against the pass. He was played to his strengths in his limited capacity and was a veteran presence for the team. He played just fine for us, just because he wasn't a pro bowler doesn't mean he played poorly. I think he brought exactly what the FO wanted him to bring, then we lucked into Dansby being cut this off season and upgraded. No need to act like Hawk was bad, because he was exactly what we wanted. He was never needed or expected to take over a huge role on this team, he was simply a role player and insurance policy. 

[BengalsRocker]

(04-26-2016, 03:11 PM)TKUHL Wrote: I wouldnt sleep on Dawson.

[fredtoast]

(04-26-2016, 07:26 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Green Bay rushing defenses...
2015: 21st (No Hawk)
2014: 23rd (Less Hawk)
2013: 25th (Full Hawk)

Dude lost the starting job and wasn't even wanted on a shit run defense. Never understood the desire to sign him other than I guess the "OMG OSU!" factor that keeps Nugent employed. Was easy to see that was a bad signing that wouldn't work out the second it happened.

Well at least Hawk is better than Navarro Bowman.  He played for the 29th ranked run defense last year.  He must really suck.

[jowczarski]

I just talked to A.J. yesterday about his career and he didn't sound like a guy ready to hang it up, but he said he wasn't about to hang on just to hang on. He'd be a good fit for a team looking for a veteran backup.

Because, guess what, that's what he was here and why he was brought in last year.

Not sure what the expectation was coming in. He was brought in, really, to be Maualuga's back up in the middle and play in run situations on the strong side. He wasn't going to mess up, be a good locker room guy. Because he played at Ohio St. had nothing to do with anything.

The problem he ran in to now was the Dansby signing. Lamur was a key special teams player, as was Dawson. So, Lamur is out. They expect Dawson to contribute more. Rey's special teams snaps need to go down at least the first three weeks. So now...who's playing special teams? Maualuga doesn't. Dansby doesn't. And Burfict won't. Hawk couldn't. They need a guy to do that. That's specifically why Roach was brought on to the active roster for the playoff game.

As for Flowers -- he was probably going to get cut if he didn't get hurt last year (if you remember, Chris Carter made the linebacking room). Marvin Lewis told us on the final day of cuts that it "Played out about what we expected. I don’t think anything occurred that changed anything we were doing there at all. We are where we expected to be.”
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/nfl/bengals/2015/09/05/bengals-cut-roster--53/71711566/

We'll see if he's ready to take on a bigger role. I wouldn't be surprised if they draft a LB either.

[fredtoast]

(04-26-2016, 08:58 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote:  I think he brought exactly what the FO wanted him to bring, then we lucked into Dansby being cut this off season and upgraded.

Wrong.  Dansby is worse than Hawk because he played for the 30th rank run defense last year, and they released him.

[leonardfan40]

(04-26-2016, 09:31 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Wrong.  Dansby is worse than Hawk because he played for the 30th rank run defense last year, and they released him.

Oh, my bad guys, I'm still struggling to figure that logic out. So simple yet I'm struggling so much! Bear with me, I'll get there 

[TKUHL]

(04-26-2016, 05:05 PM)Benton Wrote: Me either. I bet he's a snorer.

Yea I guess that didnt come out right.

[leonardfan40]

(04-26-2016, 09:31 PM)jowczarski Wrote: I just talked to A.J. yesterday about his career and he didn't sound like a guy ready to hang it up, but he said he wasn't about to hang on just to hang on. He'd be a good fit for a team looking for a veteran backup.

Because, guess what, that's what he was here and why he was brought in last year.

Not sure what the expectation was coming in. He was brought in, really, to be Maualuga's back up in the middle and play in run situations on the strong side. He wasn't going to mess up, be a good locker room guy. Because he played at Ohio St. had nothing to do with anything.

The problem he ran in to now was the Dansby signing. Lamur was a key special teams player, as was Dawson. So, Lamur is out. They expect Dawson to contribute more. Rey's special teams snaps need to go down at least the first three weeks. So now...who's playing special teams? Maualuga doesn't. Dansby doesn't. And Burfict won't. Hawk couldn't. They need a guy to do that. That's specifically why Roach was brought on to the active roster for the playoff game.

As for Flowers -- he was probably going to get cut if he didn't get hurt last year (if you remember, Chris Carter made the linebacking room). Marvin Lewis told us on the final day of cuts that it "Played out about what we expected. I don’t think anything occurred that changed anything we were doing there at all. We are where we expected to be.”
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/nfl/bengals/2015/09/05/bengals-cut-roster--53/71711566/

We'll see if he's ready to take on a bigger role. I wouldn't be surprised if they draft a LB either.

Expectations got out of hand fast among Bengals fans. I think people remembered what he once was, that combined with the homerism of many fans in these parts, and things escalated quickly. 

[fredtoast]

(04-26-2016, 05:19 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Is there any man you would like to sleep on? 

Rafa

[leonardfan40]

(04-26-2016, 05:19 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Is there any man you would like to sleep on? 

(04-26-2016, 06:02 PM)Stormborn Wrote: Obama for the power.

I was gonna say he'll only be president for less than a year so you might be better off waiting for the next one if you want it to last...but on second thought i don't think anyone wants to sleep on hillary, even bill 

(04-26-2016, 06:17 PM)Benton Wrote: Christopher Walken.

(04-26-2016, 10:02 PM)TKUHL Wrote: Yea I guess that didnt come out right.

No but you may have helped all of these guys come out 

(04-26-2016, 10:36 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Rafa

Lots of interesting choices here, but none of them are my taste. I'd love to hear the reasoning behind some of them. 

[SFmajor]

(04-26-2016, 02:19 PM)fredtoast Wrote: We have 3 decent LBs Rey, Maualuga, and Dansby.  After that we have a lot of nothing. Isn't DiMache with the Browns?  Luc and Roach are not NFL level players.

I pretty much guarantee we draft a LB.  Maybe not in the first couple of rounds, but we definitely need one.  I have hope Flowers and dawson will step up their games this year, but that still just gives us 5 LBs.  

DiManche signed with the Bengals when Roachbwas activated for the Wild Card Game against Pittsburgh. On your other points, I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. Roach finished 5th in total Tackles in the pre-season in 2015 in the snaps that he played. If he would have been that bad, he would have been waived and sent back home to Nebraska. There was no way he was going to supplant Mau at ILB. So he was stashed away on the PS. Luc might be another story as he did bounce around on 2 other PS until he landed with the Bengals. IMHO, I think we have some solid LB's this season: Dansby, Mau, Burfict, Rey, and Dawson if he shows up at Camp. Flower's and Roach are very Capable backups and DiManche does have experience in the Bengals system. Bringing on another OLB in the Draft (Jaylon Smith) might be a good choice if his knee is okay or a Priority UDFA OLB to develop would work too. But I like what we have in the LB Corp right now. Just Saying!!

[SFmajor]

(04-26-2016, 02:22 PM)Au165 Wrote: Don't forget Taylor Mays. They may be looking at him as the 6th backer while Burffict is out.

Taylor Mays has a 4 game suspension. He'll be back for game 5.

[NATI BENGALS]

Could waiting until after voluntary workouts started have anything to do with it?

Maybe they liked what they saw from some of the other guys and decided it was time to move on.

[fredtoast]

(04-27-2016, 11:43 AM)SFmajor Wrote:  So he was stashed away on the PS.

Which means he was released and no other team in the league was interested in signing him.