Right side of line WILL lose us games

[Luvnit2]

(09-14-2016, 10:46 AM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: I just hope the center does not get our franchise quarterback hurt.

As for Zampese abandoning the run too early, maybe it's time to admit this is not a run first team.  I always used to read that Gruden was not committed to the run, then it was Hue, now it is already Zampese.  It's a pass happy league, and we have a quarterback who has shown he can handle the pressure of the game being on his shoulders.

Have we ever been a mauling type running team? I think our OL is built first to protect the QB and then run block. I think the Steelers are built to run the ball first and then pass block since Ben is elusive and hard to get to the ground.

I don't see a lot of stellar OL's that are equaling great doing both. But also, the Bills were one of the best running teams in 2015 and play the Jets tomorrow, let's see how the number 1 running game in 2015 does against that Jet front seven.

[3wt]

(09-13-2016, 08:38 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: What are you talking about? They ran 5 times in the first half compared to 25 passes. Hill had 4 YPC in the first half. Lanes were definitely there.

Zampese's lack of run game led to sacks. Dalton was certainly rattled in the first half. He threw a poor INT and missed 2 TD passes to Uzomah due to being rattled.

https://twitter.com/RoyleRedlegs/status/775449302143471616

https://twitter.com/RoyleRedlegs/status/775440720362635264

https://twitter.com/RoyleRedlegs/status/775440720362635264

There's 3 of the 9 run plays with Hill. There's certainly running lanes. And he also scored a TD, not in those tweets.

In this video, if Ogubehi stays engaged with the defender, it's 6.

https://twitter.com/RoyleRedlegs/status/775448877965139968

That's 4 running plays where Hill had lanes, and obviously you've seen the TD.

The best way to slow down a pass rush is with the run game. Bengals didn't do that because they abandoned the run early.

Well you're right that they were running better than I thought, though they ran 5 times for 17 yards in the first half for an average of 3.4 yards a carry.   Hill started off with a 1 yard carry and the first possession was derailed by a 5 yard penalty putting them at 3rd and 5 - too long to run, and Dalton got sacked.

After the 2nd possession the passing game started to kick in mixing in Hill.  I couldn't open your twitter links (I don't have an account), but Hill was running well and had to have had lanes.

The second half was a more balanced attack with 13 passes to 11 runs (if you count Wright's disastrous reverse and Andy's 2 yard run).  If you count those we averaged 3 yards a carry.  If you don't count Wright's reverse (a call I hated) we were averaging 4 yards a carry.

I think that there are multiple ways to defeat pressure.  Screens are good and Zampeze used them, and running the ball is also good as long as they are not blitzing (which can defeat both the pass and the run).  Zamp did both in the 2nd half.

Pretty much my major complaint with Zampeze was the ill advised reverse.  The line just wasn't executing and the major culprits were Bodine and Zietler.  In Zietler's defense he had not had a lot of snaps with Bodine and Ogbuehi.  Og did pretty good for a guy who has not had a lot of snaps.  He'll improve.

So I concede the fact that they were running better than I thought - though Hill was looking pretty darn good.   I like the way Zampeze calls a game, and I think he'll get better as the year goes along.  He had a lot of problems to overcome.  The only possessions he didn't run at all in were the 2nd and the 5th.  One was complicated by a penalty and the other - started off with two passes and two consecutive sacks.   I'm thinking that a run might have been the better way to start 

My only surviving point is that I think Zampeze was not the cause of our failures out there today.  No OC is going to call a perfect game and all in all I think he did a good job.

[WeezyBengal]

(09-13-2016, 04:53 PM)3wt Wrote: When the O-line is allowing that kind of penetration the OC doesn't have a lot of choice.  He took what they gave us and we won.  They were stuffing us in the first half.  Couldn't run to save our lives.  If not for Andy and his receivers this game would have been an ugly loss.

We ran the ball 4 times in the first half. Thats not exactly giving it an honest go... 

[WeezyBengal]

(09-14-2016, 10:46 AM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: I just hope the center does not get our franchise quarterback hurt.

As for Zampese abandoning the run too early, maybe it's time to admit this is not a run first team.  I always used to read that Gruden was not committed to the run, then it was Hue, now it is already Zampese.  It's a pass happy league, and we have a quarterback who has shown he can handle the pressure of the game being on his shoulders.

Thats fine, but I wanted them to pass it to Gio out of the backfield more than they did. He didnt get many opportunities. 

[grampahol]

(09-13-2016, 09:03 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Actually the best way to slow down a pass rush are screens, all teams do not run the same schemes every play, down and distance and formations can adjust how a team is going to setup.. if you notice many times during the game, the Jets were really putting men in gaps and covering the center at times, so running between guards was proving difficult... 

You might question the run to pass ratio but in the end, we totalled over 425 yards and 23 points against a very good defense, so we won the war but lost a few battles,  I would rather win the war... 

Absolutely..I'd much rather lose a few battles and win the game than win a lot of battles, but lose the game. That's exactly what happened to the Jets.

[wolfkaosaun]

(09-14-2016, 02:53 PM)3wt Wrote: Well you're right that they were running better than I thought, though they ran 5 times for 17 yards in the first half for an average of 3.4 yards a carry.   Hill started off with a 1 yard carry and the first possession was derailed by a 5 yard penalty putting them at 3rd and 5 - too long to run, and Dalton got sacked.

After the 2nd possession the passing game started to kick in mixing in Hill.  I couldn't open your twitter links (I don't have an account), but Hill was running well and had to have had lanes.

The second half was a more balanced attack with 13 passes to 11 runs (if you count Wright's disastrous reverse and Andy's 2 yard run).  If you count those we averaged 3 yards a carry.  If you don't count Wright's reverse (a call I hated) we were averaging 4 yards a carry.

I think that there are multiple ways to defeat pressure.  Screens are good and Zampeze used them, and running the ball is also good as long as they are not blitzing (which can defeat both the pass and the run).  Zamp did both in the 2nd half.

Pretty much my major complaint with Zampeze was the ill advised reverse.  The line just wasn't executing and the major culprits were Bodine and Zietler.  In Zietler's defense he had not had a lot of snaps with Bodine and Ogbuehi.  Og did pretty good for a guy who has not had a lot of snaps.  He'll improve.

So I concede the fact that they were running better than I thought - though Hill was looking pretty darn good.   I like the way Zampeze calls a game, and I think he'll get better as the year goes along.  He had a lot of problems to overcome.  The only possessions he didn't run at all in were the 2nd and the 5th.  One was complicated by a penalty and the other - started off with two passes and two consecutive sacks.   I'm thinking that a run might have been the better way to start 

My only surviving point is that I think Zampeze was not the cause of our failures out there today.  No OC is going to call a perfect game and all in all I think he did a good job.

The second half the game calling was definitely a bit more balanced, but I also disagreed with that reverse to Wright. Also didn't like the wildcat snapwith Wright at QB, but it got a first down so can't be mad.

There's going to be growing pains with Zampese, it's just a fact. But the Bengals HAVE to have a more balanced attack, especially with teams like the Steelers. Keep the offense off the field. They have the ball for only 25 minutes last game. You have to control the tempo against teams like this.

I just wasn't overly impressed with Zampese. But, it's going to take time for him to implement his game plan anyway. It's just a first impression. Can only hope he gets better and better as time goes on.

[3wt]

(09-14-2016, 04:36 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: The second half the game calling was definitely a bit more balanced, but I also disagreed with that reverse to Wright. Also didn't like the wildcat snapwith Wright at QB, but it got a first down so can't be mad.

There's going to be growing pains with Zampese, it's just a fact. But the Bengals HAVE to have a more balanced attack, especially with teams like the Steelers. Keep the offense off the field. They have the ball for only 25 minutes last game. You have to control the tempo against teams like this.

I just wasn't overly impressed with Zampese. But, it's going to take time for him to implement his game plan anyway. It's just a first impression. Can only hope he gets better and better as time goes on.

I'm with you on this one.  Part of the problem is that we have over used these plays.  Everyone sees it coming - well most teams do.  They have to be rare, and Hue used us up on those plays.  If I'm Zamp I'm saving those things for an occasion rare enough to not be on the opponent's radar.

We'll see with Zampese.  I think he'll be good if he doesn't try to be Hue.  I like the fact that he adjusted in the 2nd half.  If the O-line performs better he'd look better.  The sacks made everyone look bad.

[zygrot24]

I actually though OG did alright. The kid was making his first start, on the road, against a top 5 defensive front of the jets. Think this kid is going to be a stud, he's just getting use to the pace. Not a lot of teams have a D-line like the jets, so it'll get better.

[*SHRacerX*]

(09-13-2016, 04:25 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: I also blame Zampese for lack of run game. There were lanes, just chose to air it out a lot.

It worked...and if Hill goes off against the crapbags from PA, then we will realize that he is creating a gameplan week to week just as he should. 

[GreenCornBengal]

(09-13-2016, 04:57 PM)Bengal Dude Wrote: Zeitler definitely had some problems on Sunday, but it reminded me of Bobbie Williams in 2008 a little bit. We had always known Bobbie to be a great guard for us. However he struggled in 08 and a lot of people put that on him as his age getting to him. Then you realize that he was playing in between Ghiaciuc and Stacy Andrews. Two guys who were ranked near the bottom in their position rankings, according to PFF. Suddenly he plays in between a better center and RT in 09 and looks like his old self.

Then Bobby left and won a superbowl with the Ravens. Oh how I loved Bobby, and then like an ex-gf, all love lost.