Bengals players upset with Coyle

[Trademark]

Word out of Cincinnati is that there’s already friction in the defensive backs meeting room, which he leads.

They might have a point. The Bengals have gotten torched this year in a way they hadn’t under now-Dolphins defensive coordinator Vance Joseph.

The secondary has already allowed nine passing touchdowns, second-most in the league. New Broncos starter Trevor Siemian torched the Bengals Sunday for 312 yards and four scores in Denver’s 29-17 road victory. The Bengals surrendered two touchdown passes over 40 yards Sunday; they gave up just six pass plays of that length in each of Joseph’s last two years in Cincinnati.

Players are particularly upset with some of Coyle’s technique instructions; at least one player believes he’s coaching them not to lose instead of coaching them to win.

If this sounds familiar, it should. Dolphins players privately (and at times, even publicly) were critical of Coyle’s scheme and the way he interacted with him. One Dolphins player who was personally fond of Coyle said Monday that he wasn’t surprised that friction has followed him to a new city.

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2016/9/26/13065006/bengals-players-upset-kevin-coyle-per-report

[wolfkaosaun]

I read the report and didn't see any credible source. It's coming from a writer from Miami who has no affiliation with Cincinnati. Why would someone all the way in Miami know what's going on in the locker room and meeting rooms?

Think it's just a guy trying to get his 15 minutes of fame. Until I see sources other than "Word out of Cincinnati is that there’s already friction in the defensive backs meeting room, which he leads."

He even brings up a player taking about Coyle but never gives a name. Also, why would this guy hear what our players are saying but no one in the actual Cincinnati area?

[The Real Deal]

Who cares about the players! This is all about me and I am upset with coyle!!!! Down with coyle! Start an uprising, secondary! Teach yourselves!

[JumboTron]

Like I always say, if there is ONE person I can trust for the best of inside information on the Bengals it's a writer for the Miami Herald. Hands down.

[SunsetBengal]

(09-26-2016, 07:40 PM)The Real Deal Wrote: Who cares about the players! This is all about me and I am upset with coyle!!!! Down with coyle! Start an uprising, secondary! Teach yourselves!

Exactly, it shouldn't take a "credible source" to see that the secondary is in shambles.  Guenther needs to be questioning Coyle's motives and game plan...

[jj22]

Coyle had his issues as DC with the Dolphins, but he's produced some good cb's here. I'll give him a year. It's been bad, but the secondary did well enough the first two games to justify a longer leash. Emotions are high. Clearly. And with good reason.

[*pally*]

I said in another thread...yesterday...that the coach the team was missing was Vance Joseph

[grampahol]

I never did think Coyle was as good as advertised even before heading to Miami. He had some really great players. Great players can make anyone look like a great coach for awhile.

[jj22]

Stat's say otherwise, but Vance is the one that poisoned this D with the zone. The system was built for man coverage, and I'm hoping Coyle reestablishes man coverage as our dominant coverage.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

(09-26-2016, 07:49 PM)JumboTron Wrote: Like I always say, if there is ONE person I can trust for the best of inside information on the Bengals it's a writer for the Miami Herald.  Hands down.

I don't give out that much rep but had to on this post since it made me chuckle.

[OBX Bengal]

We have only played three games and it is too early to pass judgement.  For example, when Todd Haley replaced Bruce Arians for the Squeelers, Pig Pen hated Haley’s “dink and dunk” system.  Now, the rapist is pretty happy that Todd Haley’s system has kept him upright and healthy.


There  have been a lot of changes for the Bengals from last year to this year.  It is reasonable to expect a learning curve.  I would rather start out slow and finish strong rather than to start out strong and fizzle out at the end.  

[wolfkaosaun]

(09-26-2016, 07:50 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Exactly, it shouldn't take a "credible source" to see that the secondary is in shambles.  Guenther needs to be questioning Coyle's motives and game plan...

How is it in shambles? The secondary isn't the problem. Sure. Adam Jones got beat deep, but other than that the secondary has held their own.

The biggest problem on defense is both Vinny Rey and the defensive line. They aren't finishing plays at all. They'll get pressure and have opportunities but never finish.

[SunsetBengal]

(09-26-2016, 08:59 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: How is it in shambles? The secondary isn't the problem. Sure. Adam Jones got beat deep, but other than that the secondary has held their own.

The biggest problem on defense is both Vinny Rey and the defensive line. They aren't finishing plays at all. They'll get pressure and have opportunities but never finish.

Uhh, Wolf, as much as I respect your general opinion, I have to tell you that you are off the mark here.  The secondary has given up 9 TDs in 3 games. Ranking somewhere close to the bottom of the league.  We're not used to that around here..

[OBX Bengal]

(09-26-2016, 07:29 PM)Trademark Wrote: Word out of Cincinnati is that there’s already friction in the defensive backs meeting room, which he leads.

They might have a point. The Bengals have gotten torched this year in a way they hadn’t under now-Dolphins defensive coordinator Vance Joseph.

The secondary has already allowed nine passing touchdowns, second-most in the league. New Broncos starter Trevor Siemian torched the Bengals Sunday for 312 yards and four scores in Denver’s 29-17 road victory. The Bengals surrendered two touchdown passes over 40 yards Sunday; they gave up just six pass plays of that length in each of Joseph’s last two years in Cincinnati.

Players are particularly upset with some of Coyle’s technique instructions; at least one player believes he’s coaching them not to lose instead of coaching them to win.

If this sounds familiar, it should. Dolphins players privately (and at times, even publicly) were critical of Coyle’s scheme and the way he interacted with him. One Dolphins player who was personally fond of Coyle said Monday that he wasn’t surprised that friction has followed him to a new city.

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2016/9/26/13065006/bengals-players-upset-kevin-coyle-per-report

Lance  just asked Lap about this.  Lap thinks it is a bunch of sour grapes from an ex Miami defensive player.

[wolfkaosaun]

(09-26-2016, 09:15 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Uhh, Wolf, as much as I respect your general opinion, I have to tell you that you are off the mark here.  The secondary has given up 9 TDs in 3 games. Ranking somewhere close to the bottom of the league.  We're not used to that around here..

You realize that more than just a secondary can give up TDs, right?

Adam Jones and Kirkpatrick both have only 1 TD scored against them. Have held Marshall, Decker, and AB in check.

Iloka gave up one passing TD to Grimble. But overall they've done well.

It's the coverage against tight ends and running backs that has hurt them the most. There's been 4 passing TDs to tight ends or running backs.

We're not used to the lack of defensive line play. 4 sacks all year with a healthy Dunlap and Atkins. Will Clarke leads the team with sacks.

The Bengals defense has been thrown at 107 times. But yet they are 4th best in lowest completion percentage allowed.

Now, not only is the defensive line struggling with pass coverage, we all have seen it's woes with the run game. Allowed 109 YPG. Even after only allowed 52 yards last game. But the Jets and Steelers both had over 125 rushing yards.

Also, when it comes to secondary, watch the Broncos game again. Adam Jones struggled, but there was a ton of dink and dunk plays against our LBs. It seems the defense likes to play off and have a very big bend but don't break approach.

Sure. Secondary had some trouble last game. But outside of the deep pass to Jones and seam route to Iloka, the secondary has done well.

However. Dennard has been struggling mightily this season, which comes as a big surprise. Shaw looks light years ahead of him.

[*bengalfan74*]

(09-26-2016, 10:42 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: You realize that more than just a secondary can give up TDs, right?

Adam Jones and Kirkpatrick both have only 1 TD scored against them. Have held Marshall, Decker, and AB in check.

Iloka gave up one passing TD to Grimble. But overall they've done well.

It's the coverage against tight ends and running backs that has hurt them the most. There's been 4 passing TDs to tight ends or running backs.

We're not used to the lack of defensive line play. 4 sacks all year with a healthy Dunlap and Atkins. Will Clarke leads the team with sacks.

The Bengals defense has been thrown at 107 times. But yet they are 4th best in lowest completion percentage allowed.

Now, not only is the defensive line struggling with pass coverage, we all have seen it's woes with the run game. Allowed 109 YPG. Even after only allowed 52 yards last game. But the Jets and Steelers both had over 125 rushing yards.

Also, when it comes to secondary, watch the Broncos game again. Adam Jones struggled, but there was a ton of dink and dunk plays against our LBs. It seems the defense likes to play off and have a very big bend but don't break approach.

Sure. Secondary had some trouble last game. But outside of the deep pass to Jones and seam route to Iloka, the secondary has done well.

However. Dennard has been struggling mightily this season, which comes as a big surprise. Shaw looks light years ahead of him.

You do realize in both 2014 and 15 we gave up 6 plays of 40+ yards. Already this season we've given 4 of 40+ which is basically a pace to give up twenty plays of 40+ yards this season.

Just bad luck or whatever ? Perhaps, but I'm not so sure this team isn't heading down the toilet ?

[wolfkaosaun]

(09-26-2016, 10:48 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: You do realize in both 2014 and 15 we gave up 6 plays of 40+ yards. Already this season we've given 4 of 40+ which is basically a pace to give up twenty plays of 40+ yards this season.

Just bad luck or whatever ? Perhaps, but I'm not so sure this team isn't heading down the toilet ?

You do realize that in 2014 we only had 20 sacks, correct? So why, with the same group, would we believe in 2015 that it would more than double?

Also, if that's the case, then Dalton will have over 4,600 yards and not even 15 passing TDs.

You can't go by stats early on. Give it time. They've gone against tough teams. It would be different if they went against the Browns and Cowboys and gave up those kinds of numbers. They're not playing against scrubs.

They've gone against Sanders, Thomas, AB, Marshall, and Decker. Done well in the first 2 games. Not so much against Sanders. Thomas did nothing until Lewis-Harris came in. But no one talks about that. Or that the defense was waiting on a play with their hands in the air.

Let's relax. Come talk about this team heading down the toilet if they lose to a team that hasn't made the playoffs last year.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(09-26-2016, 08:03 PM)jj22 Wrote: Coyle had his issues as DC with the Dolphins, but he's produced some good cb's here. I'll give him a year. It's been bad, but the secondary did well enough the first two games to justify a longer leash. Emotions are high. Clearly. And with good reason.

Did he?

I don't recall the Bengals having great DB play until Zimmer arrived. Same Zimmer who got good play out of other team's castoff DBs like Newman, Nelson, Crocker, Clements. Hall was 2nd team All-Pro under Zimmer. Got Jones to revive his career as a CB.

(The same Zimmer who's D right now is 1st in sacks and 2nd in INT up there in Minnesota with arguably lesser players.)

[J24]

(09-26-2016, 11:13 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Did he?

I don't recall the Bengals having great DB play until Zimmer arrived. Same Zimmer who got good play out of other team's castoff DBs like Newman, Nelson, Crocker, Clements. Hall was 2nd team All-Pro under Zimmer. Got Jones to revive his career as a CB.

(The same Zimmer who's D right now is 1st in sacks and 2nd in INT up there in Minnesota with arguably lesser players.)

Both Tory James and Deltha O'Neal made pro bowls during the pre zimmer era. Also Joeseph and Hall both had good rookie seasons pre zimmer.

[Bengal Dude]

I saw this and wondered why a Miami Herald writer decided to report this. Coyle is a position coach in Cincinnati. Why do you still care about him?

Also, Coyle was hear for Pacman's first two seasons. With Pacman being the leader in the secondary, I'm sure he vouched for Coyle to the rest of the secondary players.