2 first round draft picks? Possibly.

[Whatever]

(12-22-2016, 06:17 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Move Dunlap to RDE then and draft Barnett for our LDE...

Dunlap is one of the top 4-3 LDE's in the league.  It's doubtful Barnett will be as good as Dunlap on the left side, and while Dunlap will likely be an upgrade over MJ at RDE, he's not likely to be an elite player at that spot.  That's a lot of robbing Peter to pay Paul to reach for a #16-25 guy at #10.

[SunsetBengal]

(12-14-2016, 10:55 PM)Whatever Wrote: The Rimington Trophy is a poor indicator of NFL success.  Of the past 10 Rimington Award winners, 7 are out of the league(Dan Mozes, Jonathan Luigs, Jake Kirkpatrick, David Molk, Barrett Jones, Bryan Stork, Reese Dismukes).  AQ Shipley has been a journeyman backup his entire career.  Maurkice Pouncey is the only Pro Bowl/All Pro caliber guy, and Ryan Kelly is starting as a rookie.  Picking a C based on the Rimington is like picking a QB because he won the Heisman.  It is purely a measure of what they did in college and by no means an endorsement of NFL worthiness.

Athleticism matters when he's asked to pull, make reach blocks, or block guys at the second level.  Short arms makes it harder to anchor, because longer armed DT's can extend into his chest and get him moving backwards.  They aren't AS important for a C, but they're still weaknesses, and weaknesses that top C prospects don't have.

The guy was also named to 1st team All-American.  Don't forget, this was his only season at the Center position, I'd say that he took that challenge and knocked it out of the park.

(12-15-2016, 03:32 AM)Jpoore Wrote: u forget he was a great pull blocker when he was at rg blocking for Elliot while being a 2 time all American at that position,but he makes up for short arms by having anchors for legs. We will have this debate till draft day bc this is our biggest need, but if he plays very well against Clemson and bama dline, he deserves a very hard look.

Right, I would have zero problems with plugging him right in at RG, should Zeitler and the Bengals not agree to a new deal. Then, when Bodine's deal expires, they can let him kick rocks.

(12-22-2016, 07:05 PM)Whatever Wrote: Dunlap is one of the top 4-3 LDE's in the league.  It's doubtful Barnett will be as good as Dunlap on the left side, and while Dunlap will likely be an upgrade over MJ at RDE, he's not likely to be an elite player at that spot.  That's a lot of robbing Peter to pay Paul to reach for a #16-25 guy at #10.

I agree, don't go messing with what works, and create a situation with two changes where only one is needed.

[t3r3e3]

I would much rather see the bengals nab Ruben Foster, Derek Barnett, Zach Cunningham, or Hooker with their 1st pick. The defense is very weak at the second and 3rd levels. Each player would be a significant upgrade. The second round pick should also be defense.

[Jpoore]

(12-22-2016, 11:34 PM)t3r3e3 Wrote: I would much rather see the bengals nab Ruben Foster, Derek Barnett, Zach Cunningham, or Hooker with their 1st pick.  The defense is very weak at the second and 3rd levels.  Each player would be a significant upgrade.  The second round pick should also be defense.

Hooker has already said he is 100 percent returning

[Hammerstripes]

(12-23-2016, 12:06 AM)Jpoore Wrote: Hooker has already said he is 100 percent returning

I saw that as well, but I also saw this morning that even though he has said that he is going to return, most NFL execs expect him to change his mind and enter the draft - like Billings did last year.

[Jpoore]

(12-23-2016, 12:19 AM)Hammerstripes Wrote: I saw that as well, but I also saw this morning that even though he has said that he is going to return, most NFL execs expect him to change his mind and enter the draft - like Billings did last year.

I highly doubt that will actually happen but if it does I want him. Reminds me of Reggie a ball hawk always Comes up with the pick.

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-22-2016, 05:21 PM)Whatever Wrote: Who would be the 3 RDE's that go in the top of the 1st?  Allen is a perfect LDE with his size and run stuffing ability.  Many are projecting Barnett as a LDE, as well, because he lacks the explosive get off needed to challenge most NFL LT's.

There are more than five that would make me very happy and would be huge upgrades for the BengalsL

Garrett, from Texas A&M- Most likely gone, but things happen
Barnett from Tenn- Very nice fit
Taco Charlton- Younger, faster, stronger MJ
Walker- UCLA, underrated 
Harris- Missouri, amazing spin move...Freeny 2.0

Plus, Jonathon Allen from Bama is listed as a DT in a number of spots, but he could play RDE here and be an immediate starter.  

[Whatever]

(12-23-2016, 09:57 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: There are more than five that would make me very happy and would be huge upgrades for the BengalsL

Garrett, from Texas A&M- Most likely gone, but things happen
Barnett from Tenn- Very nice fit
Taco Charlton- Younger, faster, stronger MJ
Walker- UCLA, underrated 
Harris- Missouri, amazing spin move...Freeny 2.0

Plus, Jonathon Allen from Bama is listed as a DT in a number of spots, but he could play RDE here and be an immediate starter.  

Allen could play almost anywhere on the DL except 3-4 NT, but I think his best position in the 4-3 is LDE.  I do believe he would be an upgrade over Dunlap there, though, and would have no issue moving Carlos to RDE if a miracle happened and he fell to us.

Garrett is a no brainer if he falls.

Barnett isn't going to get moved around to give him matchups here like in college.  I see him as a solid starter and a 5-7 sack guy,  but not a top shelf pass rusher.  Basically,  MJ in his prime.

Charlton and Harris would both be great gets in the 2nd if they fall to us.

Do you mean DeMarcus Walker from Florida State or Takk McKinley from UCLA?  Both would be great pickups in the second, as well.

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-23-2016, 02:41 PM)Whatever Wrote: Allen could play almost anywhere on the DL except 3-4 NT, but I think his best position in the 4-3 is LDE.  I do believe he would be an upgrade over Dunlap there, though, and would have no issue moving Carlos to RDE if a miracle happened and he fell to us.

Garrett is a no brainer if he falls.

Barnett isn't going to get moved around to give him matchups here like in college.  I see him as a solid starter and a 5-7 sack guy,  but not a top shelf pass rusher.  Basically,  MJ in his prime.

Charlton and Harris would both be great gets in the 2nd if they fall to us.

Do you mean DeMarcus Walker from Florida State or Takk McKinley from UCLA?  Both would be great pickups in the second, as well.

I disagree about Barnett being just OK....he was the major talent teams had to game plan against...I think he fits perfectly here.  He will also destroy the combine so I imagine his stock will rise...hopefully not too much.  

Walker was Takkarist Walker, from UCLA.  Although both would be welcome here...DeMarcus would be a very good RDE for us.  Harris might be a second round talent, but I sure love that spin move...our DEs have one basic move...and they never seem to try much else.  

[Whatever]

(12-23-2016, 05:27 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I disagree about Barnett being just OK....he was the major talent teams had to game plan against...I think he fits perfectly here.  He will also destroy the combine so I imagine his stock will rise...hopefully not too much.  

Walker was Takkarist Walker, from UCLA.  Although both would be welcome here...DeMarcus would be a very good RDE for us.  Harris might be a second round talent, but I sure love that spin move...our DEs have one basic move...and they never seem to try much else.  

Looking at Barnett's Alabama tape, he is a mixed bag.  He had one sack where he perfectly timed the snap count and an interception off a deflection.  He also got called off side guessing at the snap count, gave up a long TD when he lost backside contain on a reverse, and got very little pressure despite being singled up most of the game.  He pretty much did one of two things on most downs.  He would either do his Justin Smith-Bengals years impersonation and rush wide and get pushed past the pocket, creating open running lanes, or just stand around the LoS waiting to get blocked.  He did show good wheels on downfield pursuit, but looked bad making open field tackles. So, two big plays, one big negative play, a penalty, and a lot of snaps where he was largely ineffective.

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-23-2016, 06:25 PM)Whatever Wrote: Looking at Barnett's Alabama tape, he is a mixed bag.  He had one sack where he perfectly timed the snap count and an interception off a deflection.  He also got called off side guessing at the snap count, gave up a long TD when he lost backside contain on a reverse, and got very little pressure despite being singled up most of the game.  He pretty much did one of two things on most downs.  He would either do his Justin Smith-Bengals years impersonation and rush wide and get pushed past the pocket, creating open running lanes, or just stand around the LoS waiting to get blocked.  He did show good wheels on downfield pursuit, but looked bad making open field tackles. So, two big plays, one big negative play, a penalty, and a lot of snaps where he was largely ineffective.

If he got a sack and an INT in a game against NFL talent, then he is already well past what we have here.  He isn't going to dominate a team like Bama when they game plan against him.  As far as his negative play, I get that he got caught in overpursuit if he was trying to make a play when they were down.  

He has the length, strength, and athleticism that we need on the right side.  Although some are quick to quote stats about things like "hurries", MJ is the absolute weak link on the defensive line, and needs replaced.  Clarke isn't the every down answer, but he could at least provide some pressure rotating inside.  

[Whatever]

(12-23-2016, 07:12 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: If he got a sack and an INT in a game against NFL talent, then he is already well past what we have here.  He isn't going to dominate a team like Bama when they game plan against him.  As far as his negative play, I get that he got caught in overpursuit if he was trying to make a play when they were down.  

He has the length, strength, and athleticism that we need on the right side.  Although some are quick to quote stats about things like "hurries", MJ is the absolute weak link on the defensive line, and needs replaced.  Clarke isn't the every down answer, but he could at least provide some pressure rotating inside.  

Thing is, it didn't appear that Alabama did much to game plan for him.  He wasn't drawing double teams or getting chipped by a back or TE.  He just couldn't do anything with his man.  He guessed at the snap count to get one sack, but QB's that are good with the hard count, like Roethlisberger, will take advantage of that.  He can't rely on that at the NFL level.  The pick was a heads up play, but a teammate batted a screen pass in the air and it came right to him.  

The reverse came early in the game.  His constantly rushing to the outside created a lot of holes between the RE and DT that bama was able to exploit.  He didn't look good against the run, at all.  He had a good downfield pursuit play, but struggled with outside containment and open field tackling.  

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-22-2016, 07:05 PM)Whatever Wrote: Dunlap is one of the top 4-3 LDE's in the league.  It's doubtful Barnett will be as good as Dunlap on the left side, and while Dunlap will likely be an upgrade over MJ at RDE, he's not likely to be an elite player at that spot.  That's a lot of robbing Peter to pay Paul to reach for a #16-25 guy at #10.

Dunlap has played RDE a bit this year and done well.

You could be correct though and probably are about keeping him where he already plays great at LDE.

I like Barnett's athleticism and like SHRacer says he pry will blow up the combine. He will be an improvement over MJ
wherever we put him. Also am liking Taco Charlton or Demarcus Walker in the 2nd round if one of them are there.

I also like Harris as SHR says here with that spin move.

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-28-2016, 03:00 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Dunlap has played RDE a bit this year and done well.

You could be correct though and probably are about keeping him where he already plays great at LDE.

I like Barnett's athleticism and like SHRacer says he pry will blow up the combine. He will be an improvement over MJ
wherever we put him. Also am liking Taco Charlton or Demarcus Walker in the 2nd round if one of them are there.

I also like Harris as SHR says here with that spin move.

I like Charlton because of the inevitable promotion for free Tacos with each sack that would be sure to accompany him.  Seriously, though, he is a talent and this draft class is probably one of the top it has been for DE in some time.  QB and WR, not so much.  

[3wt]

(12-14-2016, 05:27 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: No, I'm pretty sure that this is the year that we don't take a corner in the first round.

All of the draft sites that I have looked at have Elflien as a mid-2nd rounder.  

And, no, there probably isn't a team that is going to give up those picks to move up to #8.  

I'd rather stay put, take an elite defender or even move up a few spots and insure that we get the guy that we want.

Agree with doing that this year.   Guys that really seem like pretty sure bets are going to go in the top 4-7.  I'm thinking Reuben Foster and Jamal Adams who would be high percentage difference makers on this team.  We need one of those guys or guys that are a little less sure things like Mike Williams, John Ross, Zach Cunningham and Derek Barnett.

Likewise Eiflien is someone worth trading up for in the 2nd round.   We need a difference maker on both sides of the ball.  Let's do what it takes to land a couple.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-29-2016, 11:29 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I like Charlton because of the inevitable promotion for free Tacos with each sack that would be sure to accompany him.  Seriously, though, he is a talent and this draft class is probably one of the top it has been for DE in some time.  QB and WR, not so much.  

I love Tacos. :andy:

Also, TE is very deep as well. Could get a very talented TE in the mid rounds this year.

[TKUHL]

(12-14-2016, 01:45 PM)Whatever Wrote: They can trade comp picks starting this year, but it wasn't allowed previously.

Really! Hell Yea...

[Jpoore]

(12-29-2016, 02:24 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I love Tacos. :andy:

Also, TE is very deep as well. Could get a very talented TE in the mid rounds this year.

unless but falls due to his injury I doubt we take a te whether they are good or not we already have 4 on our roster. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-31-2016, 07:39 AM)Jpoore Wrote: unless but falls due to his injury I doubt we take a te whether they are good or not we already have 4 on our roster. 

Eh, Eifert may never be the same, is always injured, Uzomah has bad hands, Kroft had a bad year, Hewitt is a H-back.

Grab a TE in the mid rounds with this deep of a draft.

Similar to last year with DT's when we got Billings in the 4th.

[Jpoore]

(12-31-2016, 04:35 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Eh, Eifert may never be the same, is always injured, Uzomah has bad hands, Kroft had a bad year, Hewitt is a H-back.

Grab a TE in the mid rounds with this deep of a draft.

Similar to last year with DT's when we got Billings in the 4th.

I'm just saying the Bengals are not gonna carry 5 on their roster and u know they're not gonna drop any of them. So the point is moot bc in their eyes te is their deepest position and they just need to have another year under their belt