Moving forward...

[*SHRacerX*]

I'm not going to make a survey. I would rather see specific ideas and solutions. I am curious what everyone perceives as the three biggest areas of weakness on this team. In other words, if you were to try and address three specific position groups, who do you address and why?

For starters, I am going to say let's keep this to the players, and leave coaches out of it. There are more than enough threads on that subject.

Here's mine:

1.) Offensive line can't run block. I think without Ced O at RT, the offensive line began to play pretty well from a pass blocking standpoint. However, it makes me want to vomit seeing three attempts to rush up the middle and get maybe a total of half a yard. I think the biggest weakness here is Center, and it needs to be addressed. Call it a witch hunt if you want, but Bodine needs to be pushed with a new center from the draft and he needs to spend a lot of time in the offseason working on his lower body strength. He may be able to bench press a house, but he can't anchor worth a damn.

2.) Defensive front four get no pressure, and the scheme isn't one to blitz hardly at all. So, if we know this, we can't accept a lack of speed on the outside of the right end. Dunlap is very good, and Geno is among the best, but there needs to be an infusion of strength and speed in the middle (Billings and Hardison should help here) and MOST IMPORTANTLY, the first draft pick should be utilized on one of the very talented RDEs coming out in the draft. I think that is the single greatest need on this team. Pressure out of the front four is an absolute necessity for this defense, and it just isn't there right now, because only half of the line can generate pressure.

3.) Vertical passing threat. I know AJ can get deep, and maybe Cody Core can be this player (I'm sure they will continue to ride Brandon Lafell instead of looking toward the future) but there needs to be a vertical threat that would help open up everything underneath.

Honorable mention: A new bell-cow RB. Hill just doesn't have it.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-19-2016, 10:53 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I'm not going to make a survey.  I would rather see specific ideas and solutions.  I am curious what everyone perceives as the three biggest areas of weakness on this team.  In other words, if you were to try and address three specific position groups, who do you address and why?

For starters, I am going to say let's keep this to the players, and leave coaches out of it.  There are more than enough threads on that subject.

Here's mine:

1.) Offensive line can't run block.  I think without Ced O at RT, the offensive line began to play pretty well from a pass blocking standpoint.  However, it makes me want to vomit seeing three attempts to rush up the middle and get maybe a total of half a yard.  I think the biggest weakness here is Center, and it needs to be addressed.  Call it a witch hunt if you want, but Bodine needs to be pushed with a new center from the draft and he needs to spend a lot of time in the offseason working on his lower body strength.  He may be able to bench press a house, but he can't anchor worth a damn.  

2.) Defensive front four get no pressure, and the scheme isn't one to blitz hardly at all.  So, if we know this, we can't accept a lack of speed on the outside of the right end.  Dunlap is very good, and Geno is among the best, but there needs to be an infusion of strength and speed in the middle (Billings and Hardison should help here) and MOST IMPORTANTLY, the first draft pick should be utilized on one of the very talented RDEs coming out in the draft.  I think that is the single greatest need on this team.  Pressure out of the front four is an absolute necessity for this defense, and it just isn't there right now, because only half of the line can generate pressure.

3.) Vertical passing threat.  I know AJ can get deep, and maybe Cody Core can be this player (I'm sure they will continue to ride Brandon Lafell instead of looking toward the future) but there needs to be a vertical threat that would help open up everything underneath.  

Honorable mention:  A new bell-cow RB.  Hill just doesn't have it.

1.)  Coaching

2.)  Coaching

3.)  Then there's coaching.

4.)  Finally, and last but not least, coaching.

Clean. House.

[Bengalbug]

Head coach
OC
OL coach


The defense has played well enough this year, especially since the bye. Under no circumstance should an NFL team only accumulate 38 yards in a half of football


On a side note, I think Marvin pooped his pants when he threw the challenge flag. The dude looked petrified and scared as hell. I just think he doesn't have the fortitude or make up of an NFL head coach. And before anyone says Bill belichek remains calm.. You are right he does. But he also has insane football IQ. Marv on game day is atrocious. And I hate bashing coaching because they are the NFL head coach and we are fans... But it's terrible. Marvin needs to go

[bengalguy71]

MB
MB
MB

Time to pass the baton.

[Hoofhearted]

(12-19-2016, 12:02 PM)bengalguy71 Wrote: MB
MB
MB

Time to pass the baton.

This. The owners lack of competitive spirit and vision is why this franchise will probably never win a Super Bowl. 

[Hoofhearted]

(12-19-2016, 10:57 AM)Wyche Wrote: 1.)  Coaching

2.)  Coaching

3.)  Then there's coaching.

4.)  Finally, and last but not least, coaching.

Clean. House.

At this point and time, I am done blaming the coaching. This falls 1,000% on the FO if they keep this staff together another year. 

[Hoofhearted]

Mine:

1) Pass rush is just awful, awful awful. This most certainly has to be addressed in the draft. At first I voted LB to addressed first, now it 100% has to be a pass rush specialist.
2) Speed at LB. This team is very slow at the LB position. They desperately need to add some youth/talent there.
3) WR. They need another WR to fill out the top part of the roster. I am fine with Green, player X and Boyd rounding out our WR corps at the top, with erickson, Wright rounding out the bottom.

[3wt]

I think it's really hard to eliminate coaching from the equation.

The reason we failed in the 4th quarter is either a failure of our receivers - of any kind - to get open, the failure of Andy to get them the ball or bad play calling.

I would say it's all three, but the emphasis from my perspective was the play calling.  The Steelers' half time adjustment appeared to be pack the box, squash their running game and make Andy beat us.

They stuffed the run and short pass options and Andy (and the receivers - I'll have to watch to know how much responsibility to assign the two groups) was unable to beat them.   From what I can recall Andy was just throwing garbage in the 2nd half.

But Zampeze seemed to call a lot of runs and short passes in the flats, playing right into the Pittsburgh adjustment.  We never adjusted to that.  So I blame it most squarely on Zampeze, then on Andy, then on the receivers - in about that order.

It looked to me like Fisher had a good game yesterday.  I was highly encouraged.   Hopefully Oghuehi turns it around with a full OTA/ training camp schedule.  But I'll be frank.  I think the guy is a bust and will not improve.

If a big part of the problem was that the receivers couldn't get separation then that has to be an emphasis.  But I don't think that was the problem.

And they're going to have to replace Whit soon and Og doesn't appear to be that guy, though I think Whit's got another year and Og has at least a chance to turn it around.  So OL is a target.

We could definitely use an upgrade in our D-Line - especially in Johnson's spot.  He just doesn't get pressure enough.  And though Peko had a good game yesterday we don't really have a good enough person to team with Geno.  All they have to do in the middle is double or triple Geno and there is no significant interior pressure.   So DL is a target

And we could use an upgrade for Maualuga and/ or Dansby - though Dansby's been a little better of late.

I think we go BPA.   And I don't share the high opinion of the DEs in the draft.  They all could be good - and Barnett should be there when we pick.  But the road to Shanghai is littered with failures at the DE spot.  I think that Reuben Foster, Jamal Adams and maybe the WR Williams are the safest bets where we will probably be picking.   I'm not sold on the OL from Alabama, but he's also a candidate - but mostly for right tackle.

But if we call a better game in the 2nd half and adjust to the Steelers stacking the box I think we win the game yesterday.  And that's a coaching problem.  I think Zamp does a good job with scripted plays but cannot adjust on the fly.  He needs to be upgraded.

[Nicomo Cosca]

1. HC

2. Oline

3. Dline 

We certainly have other needs (especially LB), but those are the biggest, imo. The lack of pressure we got on Ben yesterday made me sick. This year's draft is loaded with top Dline prospects too. 

[bengals67]

(12-19-2016, 12:10 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: At this point and time, I am done blaming the coaching. This falls 1,000% on the FO if they keep this staff together another year. 

Truth, truth and more truth

How anyone could renew season tickets if Marvin and staff return is beyond me.

Marvin's time was finished after the meltdown in the playoff game last year.

[bengals67]

bodine is awful

Malaluga way below average

No other NFL team would continue starting Bodine and Malaluga

why did it take 11 games to bench Og???

For 13 years we have never covered tight ends.

For 13 years we almost always get outcoached/killed in second half.

This mentality and ineptness translates into gross losing record against Steelers who get a ninth home game every year at Paul Brown, 0-7 in playoffs, awful record in prime time, below 500 record against playoff level teams.

Truly is beyond ridiculous that Marvin was not fired at the end of last season.

[grampahol]

I'm going with the assumption that Marvin will be here next year as well because nothing leads me to believe MB will part ways with him despite the wishes of so many so that leads me to wonder if he'll make position coaching changes..a few perhaps, but not wholesale changes. I doubt he gets rid of PA nor Zampese.. 
That leaves mostly player changes. A lot will depend on the draft and what they value in April. Center? PA seems stuck with Bodine despite what we all witness week in, week out..Pass protection seemed ok, but they just can't seem to run for doodly squat when they have to. They definitely need someone to take the heat off AJ ..
They almost always select DEs based on on how tall  they are instead of actual talent for the position but they really don't have the luxury of picking a project to develop which they probably will. 
I sometimes wish I could be a fair weather fan, but I just can't so I will probably suffer through another season of UHHHHHG!

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-19-2016, 12:31 PM)3wt Wrote: It looked to me like Fisher had a good game yesterday.  I was highly encouraged.   Hopefully Oghuehi turns it around with a full OTA/ training camp schedule.  But I'll be frank.  I think the guy is a bust and will not improve.

I fear you are right, but honestly, if Fisher pans out we would be batting .500 and there have been a TON of early round complete busts from the OT position of late.  I think the advent of the spread throughout college football really hurts their preparation for the NFL.  

[Speedy Thomas]

In order:

1. We can't run the ball. I don't care how well you throw it, at some point in every game you have to be able to run it. Need an infusion of talent on the O-line and at the RB position. BTW, did anyone read Fisher's comment about how our O-line was really getting after it on the goal line? Our "stud" RB gets stacked up 3 times from the 1, and Andy has to sneak it in on 4th down. Way to get after it.

2. We can't stop the run. Yeah, we "limited" Bell to 93 yards. But every time they needed to run it effectively, they did. Billings should help but we definitely need better LB's. Thank God for 55.

3. We don't pressure the QB. Was our pass-rushing DE (you know, the one whose goal is to lead the league in sacks) even on the field yesterday? I didn't hear his name very often. Let the annual quest for an edge rusher begin.

[wolverine515151]

We also need another tight end in case Eifert gets injured. Kroft and Uzomah are spare tires. We need a good pass catching tight end in case eifert gets injured.

Also, we have trouble scoring. Eifert and another tight end would improve our scoring efficiency. We would just go to two tight end sets when we get in scoring position.

We have a vertical threat in core, we just don't use him enough.

If we sign whitworth and extend zeitler we'll have a need at right tackle. Whitworth and Fischer will be the starters. Ogabuegi backs up whitworth and the 3rd round draft pick backs up Fischer. It looks like Winston is shot. He's like old yeller at this point.

These picks would shore up the defensive line and offensive line as well as deal with the inability to score at a high rate when we get in scoring position.So the first three picks would be .

1.DE
2.TE
3. OT

After the first three issues are addressed, the next would be corner because we probably won't extend Kirkpatrick. We have Dennard and WJ3 to take over for him. After that RB. Bernard is coming off a serious leg injury and we don't know if he'll be 100%. Plus Burkhead and Peerman are both free agents. You can add a cover linebacker to the equation because we don't know if vigil flowers or Dawson will be any good. I'm going to assume a third round comp fourth round comp and two fifth round comp picks.

3. CB
4. RB
4. OLB
5. S
5. K
5. C

[Fan_in_Kettering]

The three big weaknesses in Cincinnati are as follows:

1. Offense
2. Defense
3. Special Teams
   

In all seriousness, the Bengals have all the pieces in place with the wrong glue being applied. It's like having an orchestra filled with the world's best musicians with the musical director from Hee Haw arranging what parts people will play.

[Bilbo Saggins]

1. Trenches on both sides of the ball - both units have some really good players but both units are underwhelming.
2. Safety play.  Not sure what happened to Iloka, but he doesn't look the same this year.  Neither starting safety seem to really scare QBs away from throwing deep.
3. Linebacker play outside of Burfict.

[*bfine32*]

Well I'm going to honor the OP's wishes and keep it about the players:

Safety- Iloka has really disappointed once given the job of QB of the D secondary and Williams should be a hybrid LB. If we re-sign Dre, keep Adam, DD improves, and WJIII returns healthy I'd love to see Shaw at Safety and pick up a thumper either in FA or draft.

Edge- We need a pass rush specialist. Preferably one that can play SAM on running down and blitz from there on occasion. I cannot remember the last time we've had someone like that. We had the kid from the Steelers last year bring a little excitement.

Offensive Weapon- We need a jitterbug that can fly. Boyd and Wright are good receivers but they are not gadget playmakers. I was hoping Alford could fulfill this role, but we may have to invest a little higher draft pick on it.

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-19-2016, 09:24 PM)wolverine515151 Wrote: We also need another tight end in case Eifert gets injured. Kroft and Uzomah are spare tires. We need a good pass catching tight end in case eifert gets injured.

Also, we have trouble scoring. Eifert and another tight end would improve our scoring efficiency. We would just go to two tight end sets when we get in scoring position.

We have a vertical threat in core, we just don't use him enough.

If we sign whitworth and extend zeitler we'll have a need at right tackle. Whitworth and Fischer will be the starters. Ogabuegi backs up whitworth and the 3rd round draft pick backs up Fischer. It looks like Winston is shot. He's like old yeller at this point.

These picks would shore up the defensive line and offensive line as well as deal with the inability to score at a high rate when we get in scoring position.So the first three picks would be .

1.DE
2.TE
3. OT

The next pick would be corner because we probably won't extend Kirkpatrick. We have Dennard and WJ3 to take over for him. After that RB. Bernard is coming off a serious leg injury and we don't know if he'll be 100%. Plus Burkhead and Peerman are both free agents. You can add a cover linebacker to the equation because we don't know if vigil flowers or Dawson will be any good. I'm going to assume a third round comp fourth round comp and two fifth round comp picks.

3. CB
4. RB
4. OLB
5. S
5. K
5. C

I agree with just about all of this but I have Center ranked way higher, above everything but RDE, and I think the TEs we have are good players, but the are improperly utilized.  

[GodFather]

(12-19-2016, 10:57 AM)Wyche Wrote: 1.)  Coaching

2.)  Coaching

3.)  Then there's coaching.

4.)  Finally, and last but not least, coaching.

Clean. House.

^ And then there's this

and this

and this

and this

and this

and this

and this

and this

and this

and finally 

this....