Feel Any Better About The Wideout Situation?

[HarleyDog]

OMG - We are hoping again.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-08-2017, 12:28 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: I don't think anyone was worried about replacing Sanu.

It was Jones that we needed to replace badly. And it showed throughout the year.

I know people are having a bit of a kumbaya moment with Lafell, but you need to remember that, he was invisible for the 0-3-1 string that officially killed our season. 87 total yards in 4 straight games.  

He came on well at the end when nothing mattered, but there were significant stretches of time when he was not around.

Is that really a fault of LaFell?  Sometimes Andy gets tunnel vision when it seems like AJ Green is the only man that he sees on the field.  The fact that LaFell, as well as Core got plenty of action in garbage games is mostly attributable to AJ Green not being in those games.

[CJD]

(01-08-2017, 12:33 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Is that really a fault of LaFell?  Sometimes Andy gets tunnel vision when it seems like AJ Green is the only man that he sees on the field.  The fact that LaFell, as well as Core got plenty of action in garbage games is mostly attributable to AJ Green not being in those games.

Perhaps, but Green wasn't even in 2 of them. In the Buffalo game he had 1 target before being injured then, obviously, was out against Baltimore.

Lafell still couldn't get open. It was heart breaking haha.

[bengalsturntup926]

(01-08-2017, 12:43 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Perhaps, but Green wasn't even in 2 of them. In the Buffalo game he had 1 target before being injured then, obviously, was out against Baltimore.

Lafell still couldn't get open. It was heart breaking haha.

Good to see someone agrees with me. I'm scared for next year to be the same. I did not like lafell during that losing stretch,he caught a couple tds in garbage time of Dallas, he caught one td vs patriots and the rest was invisible. He's just not what we need at outside receiver!! I hope some other team over pays for him and he walks if not he will be back here. We need our outside guy to get separation and is a deep threat wwhere corners want to play off him some times. Where a safety has to help the corner. He was getting no seperation and looking for pass interference calls and they wasn't giving him the calls.then he let some passes go through his hands. New England did not do good when they relied on him being a deep threat guy,that's the year he couldn't catch nothing. Heck I'd rather have boyd onthe outside.as for core I think he's a good #4,emegency outside recciver.dump wright

[magikod]

I really like Boyd and Core. Hope they can continue to improve into next season.

[McC]

(01-07-2017, 07:00 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: How people are reacting to Core reminds me of how we reacted to James Wright in 2014.

Hopefully, i'm wrong, but a lot of Core's yards in these past few games seemed to come from broken coverages (or CB slips) and quick passes on heavy blitzes.

He doesn't make me comfortable at all at WR.

Boyd is good, but does seem to struggle to break away from CBs and Lafell is getting old.

I think we still need another high end receiver in this draft in order for me to actually feel good about this WR corp.

That would take a high pick.  And using a high pick on a receiver would be like buying another pie when there's already four or five and you have no meat on the table.

[Jpoore]

(01-08-2017, 02:33 AM)bengalsturntup926 Wrote: Good to see someone agrees with me. I'm scared for next year to be the same. I did not like lafell during that losing stretch,he caught a couple tds in garbage time of Dallas, he caught one td vs patriots and the rest was invisible. He's just not what we need at outside receiver!! I hope some other team over pays for him and he walks if not he will be back here. We need our outside guy to get separation and is a deep threat wwhere corners want to play off him some times. Where a safety has to help the corner. He was getting no seperation and looking for pass interference calls and they wasn't giving him the calls.then he let some passes go through his hands. New England did not do good when they relied on him being a deep threat guy,that's the year he couldn't catch nothing. Heck I'd rather have boyd onthe outside.as for core I think he's a good #4,emegency outside recciver.dump wright

So glad there are people who have common sense. it felt like he would disappear for 3.5 out of 4 quarters of a game. People are always well he has comparable yards to Jones. Yeah but Jones had catches throughout the game not just in the 1st or 4th quarter .and before aj got hurt he only had 387 total yards in 9 games including 3 games with a combined receptions of 4 for 28. I have been balling hard for the last month to get Mike Williams out of Clemson 6"3 205 runs 4.4 40 long arms and is willing to extend his arms in the middle of the field over 1200 yards receiving. Also the best in college at 50/50 and deep balls. He's the most complete receiver since aj green. Oh and did I mention the dude sure can run block well. Has been compared most like Keenan Allen but I think he compared closer to aj than Keenan.either way he will be a legit number 1 in this league and that would give us 2 number 1 receivers on the outside as well as our future number 1 wr since aj would be 34 when Williams rookie deal is over.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(01-07-2017, 11:19 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: If you extrapolate 17 catches in two games, over the course of a 16 game season, that would be 136 catches. 

Except those 17 catches were in 8 games. Even if you want to exclude the games where he played but didn't get catches, that's still 5 games he had at least 1 catch in, not 2. So that'd be 54 in a 16 game season, assuming AJ Green is no longer available to catch passes either.

You can take your extrapolations and put them right next to the extrapolations of Mohamed Sanu's rookie season. "OMG! 3 TDs in 2 starts! He's gonna catch like 24 TDs a season!"  Lol....

[SunsetBengal]

(01-08-2017, 05:13 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Except those 17 catches were in 8 games. Even if you want to exclude the games where he played but didn't get catches, that's still 5 games he had at least 1 catch in, not 2. So that'd be 54 in a 16 game season, assuming AJ Green is no longer available to catch passes either.

You can take your extrapolations and put them right next to the extrapolations of Mohamed Sanu's rookie season. "OMG! 3 TDs in 2 starts! He's gonna catch like 24 TDs a season!"  Lol....

Yeah, my mistake.  I should have looked up the stats before writing that post.  I'm still good with him playing a bigger role in the offense, moving forward. 

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-07-2017, 07:00 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: How people are reacting to Core reminds me of how we reacted to James Wright in 2014.

Hopefully, i'm wrong, but a lot of Core's yards in these past few games seemed to come from broken coverages (or CB slips) and quick passes on heavy blitzes.

He doesn't make me comfortable at all at WR.

Boyd is good, but does seem to struggle to break away from CBs and Lafell is getting old.

I think we still need another high end receiver in this draft in order for me to actually feel good about this WR corp.

I remember Lapham saying something to the effect of:  You have to spend a few early picks on weapons when you have a guy like Carson Palmer...well, then the same should go for Dalton.  As intrigued as I am with some of the running backs in this draft, however, and the talent on the roster with AJ, Boyd and Eifert in key receiving positions paired with the struggles in the running game, I would opt for talent (if equally rated) at the offensive line and RB positions before I would draft a WR.  I think with another full off-season, OTAs, and training camp that Core would evolve in to a capable X receiver.  Let's not wait until his rookie contract is up (Burkhead) before he is provided an opportunity. 

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-07-2017, 08:01 PM)CageTheBengal Wrote: Is it just me or does Core remind anyone else of Chris Henry a little bit?

He doesn't quite have Henry's length (6'5" vs. 6'3"), but I think they are similar in terms of speed.  Core also has a bit more beef on him.  I always held my breath when Henry would get tackled, but Core is a physical guy.  

The roles, however, are what I think are most similar.  If the Bengals were in three-wide, which was the Brat staple, they had Chad, TJ, and Henry on the field.  When those three were on the field together, there was not a defense that could stop them.  Henry would take the top off so TJ and Chad could work underneath, although Brat would have Chad run the occasional deep shot.  

I see Green as the Chad, Boyd as the TJ(That is high praise, but he is WAY ahead of where most Bengal rookie WRs are in year 1), and Core COULD be the Henry.  

I think a lot of folks fear it would be waste sending anyone deep because Dalton won't have time to get it there.  There are a number of things that could solve this:

1.) Go play-action on first down for your deep shots.  Stop waiting until 3rd and 10 before attempting something downfield.  That falls a lot in to the "stop playing not to lose" mentality that plagues this team.

2.) A WR like Core running a deep route early takes a safety with him as well.  This should not only help create bigger plays in the running game, but could open up the underneath for Boyd.  I would like to see Boyd become the key target underneath when looking at the matchups of who would cover AJ and Core.  Those 8 yard crossing routes and dig routes move the chains and are high-% completions.  

3.) If teams stack the LOS to stuff our running game, the fear of getting beat over the top just isn't there with Lafell.  AJ was doubled so teams didn't have to worry about it.  Core could change that complexion.

Add in to this a core (pardon the pun) of young, talented TEs and the offense could really start to roll.  Core is already here.  Add another solid option at RB, boost the offensive line (which already happened by removing Ced O) and off you go.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-07-2017, 10:40 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I feel better that all out x-coordinators took the 3 WRs before us in the first round. I'd take Boyd over Doctson and Fuller. WTS, Coleman is the type we are missing. I was hoping Mario Alford would fill that role, but that looks more and more unlikely.

Especially since he is on the Raven's roster...

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-08-2017, 12:08 AM)wildcats forever Wrote: Erickson might turn out to be the Rex Burkhead of the WR group. Similar kind of grit and determination. I'm hoping Urban works some magic there.

With you 100%.  I feel very comfortable with Boyd and Erickson in the slot.  The kid just knows how to find spots in zone coverage and have very good hands, and quick feet.  He isn't going to blaze a 4.3 forty-yard dash, but he has short-space quicks, a la Sexy Rexy.  

If there was another WR I would use to replace Lafell it would be another later round selection that has vertical speed to pair with Core at X.  

Lafell was very solid for us this year, but aside from one busted play at Houston, he never really stretched the field opposite Green, who should, along with Eifert, draw the majority of the coverage.  

I would not select any WR before a RB and offensive line is addressed, however.  And DE, of course.  

[bengalguy71]

(01-07-2017, 07:00 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: How people are reacting to Core reminds me of how we reacted to James Wright in 2014.

If there is one coach on this staff I trust, it would be Urban.  Plus, he sees these guys and knows them inside and out.  We are just privy to what we see on Sunday, read on the website, or come across on other websites.

I have no clue about being certain about this, but I don't recall Urban saying the same thing about Wright.  As I recall, and could be wrong, Wright was hurt most of the time and never got the snaps and looks that Core did, primarily based upon Green's injury.

I agree with some in here and don't believe WR will be on the radar in the draft except maybe late or FA that falls.

[Big Boss]

I thought our receiver corps was okay this season. Could've be better, could've been a hell of a lot worse.

The problem is our guys cannot seem to get separation. It feels like nobody is ever open.

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-08-2017, 05:13 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Except those 17 catches were in 8 games. Even if you want to exclude the games where he played but didn't get catches, that's still 5 games he had at least 1 catch in, not 2. So that'd be 54 in a 16 game season, assuming AJ Green is no longer available to catch passes either.

You can take your extrapolations and put them right next to the extrapolations of Mohamed Sanu's rookie season. "OMG! 3 TDs in 2 starts! He's gonna catch like 24 TDs a season!"  Lol....

I actually think he has a valid point, Leonard.  If you break down the number of snaps they played, on offense, you would see that Core got a good number of targets and receptions in very limited opportunities.  

As far as how he played against the Texans, he made a couple plays where he didn't fight back to the ball as he should have, but you saw him adjust and improve in the game.  The Texans secondary is downright amazing.  Did you watch what they did to Cooper and Crabtree last night?  Core didn't get a lot of yards per reception that game, but they DID complete 8 passes to him underneath because the defense had to respect his deep speed.

If he broke just one of those tackles (tips hat to Texans defender), he would have had a vastly different net.  And that was his first game in the NFL seeing significant snaps.  All that with no Eifert and no AJ to draw coverage.

Then, he goes four for over 80 yards against the Ratbirds.  Call it what you will about being a meaningless game, but the guy never broke stride when he caught passes and wasn't an easy tackle for any DB.  Again, no AJ or Eifert.  

This guy deserves a chance to be our X receiver with AJ on the opposite side, and Boyd in the slot.  

Again, no disrespect to Lafell, as he was a very solid receiver for the Bengals this season, but I see him commanding around $5 million and I strongly believe Core can handle the X receiver spot and that money be used to sign Whit, Dre, Sexy, and perhaps even Zeitler over re-signing Lafell.  

[BengalsRocker]

(01-08-2017, 12:05 PM)bengalguy71 Wrote: If there is one coach on this staff I trust, it would be Urban.  Plus, he sees these guys and knows them inside and out.  We are just privy to what we see on Sunday, read on the website, or come across on other websites.

I have no clue about being certain about this, but I don't recall Urban saying the same thing about Wright.  As I recall, and could be wrong, Wright was hurt most of the time and never got the snaps and looks that Core did, primarily based upon Green's injury.

I agree with some in here and don't believe WR will be on the radar in the draft except maybe late or FA that falls.

This was the first season ever I honestly think Tate should have been on the roster.

IMO he was a better option at WR than Wright.

The only thing is that if he was retained Erickson would have never got the shot at returning.

[jfkbengals]

(01-08-2017, 11:50 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: He doesn't quite have Henry's length (6'5" vs. 6'3"), but I think they are similar in terms of speed.  Core also has a bit more beef on him.  I always held my breath when Henry would get tackled, but Core is a physical guy.  

The roles, however, are what I think are most similar.  If the Bengals were in three-wide, which was the Brat staple, they had Chad, TJ, and Henry on the field.  When those three were on the field together, there was not a defense that could stop them.  Henry would take the top off so TJ and Chad could work underneath, although Brat would have Chad run the occasional deep shot.  

I see Green as the Chad, Boyd as the TJ(That is high praise, but he is WAY ahead of where most Bengal rookie WRs are in year 1), and Core COULD be the Henry.  

I think a lot of folks fear it would be waste sending anyone deep because Dalton won't have time to get it there.  There are a number of things that could solve this:

1.) Go play-action on first down for your deep shots.  Stop waiting until 3rd and 10 before attempting something downfield.  That falls a lot in to the "stop playing not to lose" mentality that plagues this team.

2.) A WR like Core running a deep route early takes a safety with him as well.  This should not only help create bigger plays in the running game, but could open up the underneath for Boyd.  I would like to see Boyd become the key target underneath when looking at the matchups of who would cover AJ and Core.  Those 8 yard crossing routes and dig routes move the chains and are high-% completions.  

3.) If teams stack the LOS to stuff our running game, the fear of getting beat over the top just isn't there with Lafell.  AJ was doubled so teams didn't have to worry about it.  Core could change that complexion.

Add in to this a core (pardon the pun) of young, talented TEs and the offense could really start to roll.  Core is already here.  Add another solid option at RB, boost the offensive line (which already happened by removing Ced O) and off you go.  

I'd argue against that statement for this reason:  he was a high round pick playing primarily in the slot with two veterans at X and Z.  The last high round pick we gave time to in the slot in these conditions was Jordan Shipley, who had 52 catches compared to Boyd's 54.  Sanu and Jones were splitting time with Binns, Tate, and Hawkins in search of who the #2 receiver would be, so I don't think they ever were given the opportunity to focus on the inside receiver position and master one spot.

[bengalguy71]

(01-08-2017, 12:36 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: This was the first season ever I honestly think Tate should have been on the roster.

IMO he was a better option at WR than Wright.

The only thing is that if he was retained Erickson would have never got the shot at returning.

True, and from the little I've seen so far, I think Erickson could be at least as good as Tate as a receiver.

[CJD]

(01-08-2017, 04:53 AM)McC Wrote: That would take a high pick.  And using a high pick on a receiver would be like buying another pie when there's already four or five and you have no meat on the table.

I don't know about that. 

It'd be more like having 1 pie on the table and then the ingredients for 1 or 2 more pies sitting on the table, problem being that no one has checked if the apples are still fresh yet. 

If you need 2 pies right now for the number of people you have to feed, you may not have enough time to bake those other 2 pies in time (or the ingredients may not be suitable to make a pie with anyway). Maybe it's a better idea just to call Servatii's and order a second pie...

That said, I understand that we have more needs than just pie. 

You still need to provide a protein source and vegetables and a few things to drink.

It just so happens that the pie is the reason the guests came to the picnic in the first place.