Jamal Adams in first round

[Alleyviper13]

He will probably get picked by the Cardinals ahead of us but if hes there we need to take this guy.

Jamal Adams LSU. SS

He is the best safety in the draft and is comparable to Sean Taylor. SERIOUS. Marvin always picks interchangable safties while better teams like Pittsburgh always have badass safeties we have to worry about. Why cant the Bengals have a game changer teams need to worry about? The once in a lifetime DE is going early, why not snag the best future saftey of the NFL.

You guys can say we dont need a saftey, but this dude and play up in Nickel too. BPA right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QidaCaJwrDo

[Jpoore]

(01-08-2017, 04:22 AM)Alleyviper13 Wrote: He will probably get picked by the Cardinals ahead of us but if hes there we need to take this guy.

Jamal Adams LSU. SS

He is the best safety in the draft and is comparable to Sean Taylor. SERIOUS. Marvin always picks interchangable safties while better teams like Pittsburgh always have badass safeties we have to worry about. Why cant the Bengals have a game changer teams need to worry about? The once in a lifetime DE is going early, why not snag the best future saftey of the NFL.

You guys can say we dont need a saftey, but this dude and play up in Nickel too. BPA right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QidaCaJwrDo

I respectfully disagree here because I think hooker is better and has higher upside. But that's not the problem. We have a top 10 safety in Iloka when he has an actual fs next to him. Our problem is we are trying to convert Williams from ss to fs and it's not really working. If we were going to draft a safety I would take fs since we already have 2 legit ss in Iloka and Williams. And obviously hooker is a ball Hawk and a legit fs that is more than worthy of a number 9 pick. Is comparable as a mix of ed Reed and Eric berry. Not opposed to taking safety early just we have no need at that safety position. 

[ah5]

For some reason I want them to take Peppers or Adams at 9 as well, even with holes on both lines and mb.

[Jpoore]

(01-08-2017, 05:31 AM)ah5 Wrote: For some reason I want them to take Peppers or Adams at 9 as well, even with holes on both lines and mb.

 too me Peppers isn't even a pick till late third round. He had 1 pick in his entire college career. And that was on a tipped pass. If I'm drafting a safety he has to get picks and hooker had 7 times as many as Peppers and 2 more than Adams did in three years as hooker did in one.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-08-2017, 04:44 AM)Jpoore Wrote: I respectfully disagree here because I think hooker is better and has higher upside. But that's not the problem. We have a top 10 safety in Iloka when he has an actual fs next to him. Our problem is we are trying to convert Williams from ss to fs and it's not really working. If we were going to draft a safety I would take fs since we already have 2 legit ss in Iloka and Williams. And obviously hooker is a ball Hawk and a legit fs that is more than worthy of a number 9 pick. Is comparable as a mix of ed Reed and Eric berry. Not opposed to taking safety early just we have no need at that safety position. 

Yeah, I like Malik Hooker better myself. I like Adams of course but he is no Shawn Taylor.

Malik Hooker compares to the guys you speak of here, Ed Reed and Eric Berry. Ed Reed especially cause he is a ballhawk
that can take it to the house when he gets the ball in his hands. If we take a Safety in the first i hope it is Hooker.

Would not be mad with Jamal though, he is good, really good.

(01-08-2017, 08:32 AM)Jpoore Wrote:  too me Peppers isn't even a pick till late third round. He had 1 pick in his entire college career. And that was on a tipped pass. If I'm drafting a safety he has to get picks and hooker had 7 times as many as Peppers and 2 more than Adams did in three years as hooker did in one.

Agree again, Peppers does not fit here. He cannot cover, fantastic athlete with a high football IQ.

Project is what Jabril Peppers is, we don't need any more of these with our sad coaching.

[McC]

(01-08-2017, 02:56 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yeah, I like Malik Hooker better myself. I like Adams of course but he is no Shawn Taylor.

Malik Hooker compares to the guys you speak of here, Ed Reed and Eric Berry. Ed Reed especially cause he is a ballhawk
that can take it to the house when he gets the ball in his hands. If we take a Safety in the first i hope it is Hooker.

Would not be mad with Jamal though, he is good, really good.


Agree again, Peppers does not fit here. He cannot cover, fantastic athlete with a high football IQ.

Project is what Jabril Peppers is, we don't need any more of these with our sad coaching.

I wouldn't say so much of a project as knowing how to use him.  Harbaugh predicts big things for him.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-08-2017, 04:57 PM)McC Wrote: I wouldn't say so much of a project as knowing how to use him.  Harbaugh predicts big things for him.

Exactly why he wouldn't fit here. We wouldn't know how to use him.

Wonder what position he is even going to play. He can't cover so Corner is out. Too small for LB.

Maybe Safety but even then he would have to get much better in coverage.

Returner i am sure he would be great at.

[Diligence]

I think Hooker and Adams are gone by 9. I'd go with best edge rusher on board. McKinley or Barrett

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(01-08-2017, 05:09 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Exactly why he wouldn't fit here. We wouldn't know how to use him.

Wonder what position he is even going to play. He can't cover so Corner is out. Too small for LB.

Maybe Safety but even then he would have to get much better in coverage.

Returner i am sure he would be great at.

How big was Lavonte David coming out of college? Kwon Alexander?

[Au165]

Don't want either Adams or Hooker. We have bigger needs in the front 7. When the front is getting pressure and the LB's can cover underneath it makes the back end look a lot better. The back half of the year the defense played better, but we need replacements for Maugham and Johnson, like it or not Williams and Illoka are young and have contracts in hand.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-09-2017, 12:35 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: How big was Lavonte David coming out of college? Kwon Alexander?

Not very big but 6'0" 200 lbs is a pretty damn small Linebacker.

[dr1441]

(01-09-2017, 10:40 AM)Au165 Wrote: Don't want either Adams or Hooker. We have bigger needs in the front 7. When the front is getting pressure and the LB's can cover underneath it makes the back end look a lot better. The back half of the year the defense played better, but we need replacements for Maugham and Johnson, like it or not Williams and Illoka are young and have contracts in hand.

I do agree that we have much bigger needs upfront on both sides of the ball, but were trying to fit a square peg in a round role with putting Illoka or Williams at FS. Both are natural strong safeties and neither have a ton of range like the role of  what Reggie Nelson did for us. If you add someone that can play centerfield to this defense, you will see a ton of pressure taken off the CB's. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-09-2017, 04:01 PM)dr1441 Wrote: I do agree that we have much bigger needs upfront on both sides of the ball, but were trying to fit a square peg in a round role with putting Illoka or Williams at FS. Both are natural strong safeties and neither have a ton of range like the role of  what Reggie Nelson did for us. If you add someone that can play centerfield to this defense, you will see a ton of pressure taken off the CB's. 

This is very true. This is why i was for starting Derron Smith at FS most of the year and using Shawn as a Nickel LB.

Jamal Adams would be much better though and if Hooker is taken early Adams might fall to us and i am not against us drafting him.

He is no Shawn Taylor, nobody is but he would be our best Safety pretty soon on down the line i am sure of it and like you said would take a ton of pressure off our CB's. Adams is a bigger hitter than Hooker too and would fit in well in the AFC North and punish some Steelers.

[Au165]

(01-09-2017, 04:01 PM)dr1441 Wrote: I do agree that we have much bigger needs upfront on both sides of the ball, but were trying to fit a square peg in a round role with putting Illoka or Williams at FS. Both are natural strong safeties and neither have a ton of range like the role of  what Reggie Nelson did for us. If you add someone that can play centerfield to this defense, you will see a ton of pressure taken off the CB's. 

We don't play a "center field" friendly defense that is what I don't get when people keep saying this. We are a two high defense meaning both safeties are more often than not covering half a field. A Seattle type team that plays a lot of single high man, or cover three, it makes more sense but that's not the scheme we run. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-09-2017, 05:12 PM)Au165 Wrote: We don't play a "center field" friendly defense that is what I don't get when people keep saying this. We are a two high defense meaning both safeties are more often than not covering half a field. A Seattle type team that plays a lot of single high man, or cover three, it makes more sense but that's not the scheme we run. 

But it is true that both Iloka and Shawn are more SS types.

Having a true FS type like Adams, Derron or just dreaming Malik Hooker would help in pass coverage.

[Au165]

(01-09-2017, 06:34 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: But it is true that both Iloka and Shawn are more SS types.

Having a true FS type like Adams, Derron or just dreaming Malik Hooker would help in pass coverage.

Not really. We don't use the FS/SS distinction really because we play mainly two high. In a two high they are both just safeties. If your going to play two high then your are under utilizing someone with crazy range because their responsibility is only half the field.

[dr1441]

(01-09-2017, 05:12 PM)Au165 Wrote: We don't play a "center field" friendly defense that is what I don't get when people keep saying this. We are a two high defense meaning both safeties are more often than not covering half a field. A Seattle type team that plays a lot of single high man, or cover three, it makes more sense but that's not the scheme we run. 

I agree and disagree. We played a crap load more double high safety this season than last year because Nelson was able to cover a lot of ground and read the play much better than Williams can. This year we went a lot more double high to try to counter the safeties deficits. 

And if you give me a top S prospect as a defensive coordinator, i surely will be able to find a way to gameplay him to get his hands on the ball. I don't think what we are doing now will have much factoring into this because I am also not positive that the team or origination feels that these two coordinators, and head coach for that matter, will factor in really much long into the long term plans. 

[Au165]

(01-10-2017, 10:46 AM)dr1441 Wrote: I agree and disagree. We played a crap load more double high safety this season than last year because Nelson was able to cover a lot of ground and read the play much better than Williams can. This year we went a lot more double high to try to counter the safeties deficits. 

And if you give me a top S prospect as a defensive coordinator, i surely will be able to find a way to gameplay him to get his hands on the ball. I don't think what we are doing now will have much factoring into this because I am also not positive that the team or origination feels that these two coordinators, and head coach for that matter, will factor in really much long into the long term plans. 

We have ran more two high than almost any other team over the last five years. It is a staple of our defense even when Nelson was here.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-10-2017, 12:06 AM)Au165 Wrote: Not really. We don't use the FS/SS distinction really because we play mainly two high. In a two high they are both just safeties. If your going to play two high then your are under utilizing someone with crazy range because their responsibility is only half the field.

I have heard this from Marv before but i don't buy it. I remember Reggie saying that was a big reason for his
success here, he was able to be in more of a Free Safety role. Iloka is more of a Strong Safety and so is Shawn.

Like Doc says Reggie could cover lots more ground and read the plays much better than Shawn.

[blt4584]

(01-09-2017, 10:40 AM)Au165 Wrote: Don't want either Adams or Hooker. We have bigger needs in the front 7. When the front is getting pressure and the LB's can cover underneath it makes the back end look a lot better. The back half of the year the defense played better, but we need replacements for Maugham and Johnson, like it or not Williams and Illoka are young and have contracts in hand.

So it's more of a scheme fit/other needs than a talent issue with the two? I think they are both great players and would both be an upgrade, but I can see the point.