2017 Bengal Defense Strategies and Plans

[bengalguy71]

http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Defense-looks-to-roll-16-into-17/c86538af-095d-4c69-af36-c226d1bb81f8

Interesting interview with Guenther.

[3wt]

(01-11-2017, 03:00 PM)bengalguy71 Wrote: http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Defense-looks-to-roll-16-into-17/c86538af-095d-4c69-af36-c226d1bb81f8

Interesting interview with Guenther.

Really good interview I thought.   I was starting to question his quality in the beginning of last season, but he pulled things out nicely in the 2nd half.  I think I underestimated the transition with the new coaches and it was clear that there were problems with the safety package for much of the year. 

He seems to have a handle on what's going on and what needs to happen.   I was psyched that he was talking to Tez during the Championship game and comparing notes on players they were interested in.   I like it that he does not have an "us/them" attitude regarding the relationship between coaching staff and players.   He has more of a Belichick mentality towards his key players.

And I was VERY excited about his comments about Billings, "when he got into the pads in training camp, it was ‘Whoa…this guy…’".   I got the feeling from the press that Billings was not all that impressive in camp, but Pauli clearly thought differently.

Encouraging about Pauli and players both.

[Au165]

I like that Vigil has a shot to be the starting LOLB next year. I worry sometimes about guys sitting for too long like we have seen and never getting their shot. I also like that it's at LOLB because it means we are still open to drafting the MLB of the future. Cunningham or Foster in the Middle could make for a nice young and athletic linebacker group.

[Socal Bengals fan]

Agree. Vigil is more of a lolb in a 4 3. FOSTER in the middle would be awesome. Guy looks like Navarro Bowman out there

[Big Boss]

I'm starting to think it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world having him as our next HC.

Having said that, can we please do something about our defensive schemes in the secondary? If I see one more ten-yard cushion given to an opposing wide receiver for an easy first down, I'm going to lose it.

[Jpoore]

(01-11-2017, 04:37 PM)Big Boss Wrote: I'm starting to think it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world having him as our next HC.

Having said that, can we please do something about our defensive schemes in the secondary?  If I see one more ten-yard cushion given to an opposing wide receiver for an easy first down, I'm going to lose it.

Not sure if this is who u are talking about but Dennard allowed an 87 percent completion rate into his area according to pff. That's ridiculous.

[Hammerstripes]

(01-11-2017, 03:50 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: Agree.  Vigil is more of a lolb in a 4 3.   FOSTER in the middle would be awesome.   Guy looks like Navarro Bowman out there

Sure, but the reality is that we use 3 LBs less than 50% of the time.

IF you can read anything into this - it tells me that LB isn't going to be a priority in the draft and that they will roll with Rey, Vigil and Burfict with Burfict and Vigil seeing the most action.

[wolfkaosaun]

My biggest issue is he talked about age and production. That he likes veterans but they have to produce. Then he talks about wanting Peko back. That's the complete opposite of what he just said he wanted.

He had 37 total tackles.....that's it. No sacks. No Fumbles. No recoveries. And you can tell he's struggled.

Sure. Atkins has around the same amount of tackles. But you SEE him make plays. You SEE him disrupt plays.

When you see Peko, what are you more likely to see? Him make a play? Or him being pushed back one on one?

Love Peko. Great guy. But it's time to move on.

[BengalChris]

(01-11-2017, 07:32 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: My biggest issue is he talked about age and production. That he likes veterans but they have to produce. Then he talks about wanting Peko back. That's the complete opposite of what he just said he wanted.

He had 37 total tackles.....that's it. No sacks. No Fumbles. No recoveries. And you can tell he's struggled.

Sure. Atkins has around the same amount of tackles. But you SEE him make plays. You SEE him disrupt plays.

When you see Peko, what are you more likely to see? Him make a play? Or him being pushed back one on one?

Love Peko. Great guy. But it's time to move on.

When he talks about age and lack of production my mind goes to Hunt, who is 29 and has career grand totals of 29 tackles, 1.5 sacks, 3 passes defended, 0 forced fumbles and 3 or 4 blocked kicks. Those are 4 year totals.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-11-2017, 07:32 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: My biggest issue is he talked about age and production. That he likes veterans but they have to produce. Then he talks about wanting Peko back. That's the complete opposite of what he just said he wanted.

He had 37 total tackles.....that's it. No sacks. No Fumbles. No recoveries. And you can tell he's struggled.

Sure. Atkins has around the same amount of tackles. But you SEE him make plays. You SEE him disrupt plays.

When you see Peko, what are you more likely to see? Him make a play? Or him being pushed back one on one?

Love Peko. Great guy. But it's time to move on.

From reading the interview, I couldn't hear the voice inflection during his responses.  However, he carried himself well, or at least I thought.  I read a guy that had to tow the company line, but subtly inserted his own thoughts.  Kind of like when asked about Peko, he gave the career Bengal player his obligatory respect, yet quickly brushed to the next item.  I felt like he softly expressed his wishes/intentions of making the defense a little younger, letting the younger guys actually earn their spots.  I particularly liked how he threw in a quip from his convo with Burfict during the CFB NC Game, with Burfict expressing that "we'd like to have a few of these guys".

Maybe I'm reading it all wrong, but I got a good feel from it, and feel like Guenther would have said more if it were totally up to him.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(01-11-2017, 05:27 PM)Jpoore Wrote: Not sure if this is who u are talking about but Dennard allowed an 87 percent completion rate into his area according to pff. That's ridiculous.

Question: how does PFF define his area and know his coverage responsibilities?

[BengalChris]

(01-11-2017, 03:00 PM)bengalguy71 Wrote: http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Defense-looks-to-roll-16-into-17/c86538af-095d-4c69-af36-c226d1bb81f8

Interesting interview with Guenther.

Here are some things I took note of from the interview:

Quote:Now the Bengals have to figure out how to keep the momentum flowing into next season by cobbling together their strengths (the lowest three-year scoring period in club history and a three-year total of 58 interceptions that leads the  league) while improving a fading pass rush and depth chart that is long in the tooth in some key areas.

There's no mention that Reggie Nelson really helped push that number up two of those 3 years.

Quote:No. 1 we have to do a good job identifying players that fill our needs.

I took this to mean that they need to do a better job of this, unlike what they did with several past draft picks, such has Still, Hunt and Thompson, etc, etc.

He does go on to say that the system will produce interceptions if the players do the scheme.

Quote:If you try to force it in practice, like interceptions, and we do all those drills all the time, but if you force it in practice sometimes guys get out of position to go get the ball and they give up the big one. My belief is always if you’re using the proper technique and the proper fundamentals and your eyes are in the right place and you just follow the scheme, the interceptions will come. It’s been proven now for three years.

Then there's this:

Quote:GH: Theoretically you could line up with Billings, Jackson, and Vigil as Opening Day starters.

PG: They very well could. Time will tell. But they have to earn their way like everybody else.

Too bad that "earn their way" policy doesn't extend to the OL. 

[Fan_in_Kettering]

(01-11-2017, 03:23 PM)3wt Wrote: And I was VERY excited about his comments about Billings, "when he got into the pads in training camp, it was ‘Whoa…this guy…’".   I got the feeling from the press that Billings was not all that impressive in camp, but Pauli clearly thought differently.

Encouraging about Pauli and players both.

Pauli?  The "Pauli Exclusion Principle" states two identical fermions cannot occupy the same quantum state.  Let's hope the 2017 Cincinnati defense has their own "Pauli G Exclusion Principle" where no offensive player from another team occupies the end zone!

[3wt]

(01-11-2017, 09:00 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: From reading the interview, I couldn't hear the voice inflection during his responses.  However, he carried himself well, or at least I thought.  I read a guy that had to tow the company line, but subtly inserted his own thoughts.  Kind of like when asked about Peko, he gave the career Bengal player his obligatory respect, yet quickly brushed to the next item.  I felt like he softly expressed his wishes/intentions of making the defense a little younger, letting the younger guys actually earn their spots.  I particularly liked how he threw in a quip from his convo with Burfict during the CFB NC Game, with Burfict expressing that "we'd like to have a few of these guys".

Maybe I'm reading it all wrong, but I got a good feel from it, and feel like Guenther would have said more if it were totally up to him.

 
That's the impression that I got too.   I believe he'll be gone when his contract is up.  After what Marvin did to him this season, and reading between the lines of the Bengals not allowing him to talk to the Redskins I don't think Pauli will ever be a head coach here - by his choice.

Marvin is a really complex person, he's done so much for this team and he seems like a quality coach really.   But I believe he is controlling to a fault.  I believe it's the reason Carson left and why Paul will end up leaving.

That's my gut.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-11-2017, 03:00 PM)bengalguy71 Wrote: http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Defense-looks-to-roll-16-into-17/c86538af-095d-4c69-af36-c226d1bb81f8

Interesting interview with Guenther.

It is a breath of fresh air hearing Paulie G talk.

Play the best guys.

Nothing like Marv.

BILLINGS!!!

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-11-2017, 09:00 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: From reading the interview, I couldn't hear the voice inflection during his responses.  However, he carried himself well, or at least I thought.  I read a guy that had to tow the company line, but subtly inserted his own thoughts.  Kind of like when asked about Peko, he gave the career Bengal player his obligatory respect, yet quickly brushed to the next item.  I felt like he softly expressed his wishes/intentions of making the defense a little younger, letting the younger guys actually earn their spots.  I particularly liked how he threw in a quip from his convo with Burfict during the CFB NC Game, with Burfict expressing that "we'd like to have a few of these guys".

Maybe I'm reading it all wrong, but I got a good feel from it, and feel like Guenther would have said more if it were totally up to him.

Yeah, all i read in that is respect for Peko who deserves it. He has been a great teammate and was once a good run stopper.

Give him respect and let him go. Paulie wants to play the best players and we have two bright young ones in Billings and DeShawn.

Might even add another in the draft. Hardison has played well too in his limited snaps.

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-11-2017, 03:44 PM)Au165 Wrote: I like that Vigil has a shot to be the starting LOLB next year. I worry sometimes about guys sitting for too long like we have seen and never getting their shot. I also like that it's at LOLB because it means we are still open to drafting the MLB of the future. Cunningham or Foster in the Middle could make for a nice young and athletic linebacker group.

Wasting a first round pick on a LB would be just that, a waste.  These are talented players, no doubt, but the Bengals spend 2/3rds of their time in nickel, and that package will likely be Vigil and Burfict.  They have Vinny Rey for depth, Maualuga for short yardage.  

I would spend a later round pick on a LB for special teams and development, but this team could be upgraded significantly with a speed rush end on the right side or a versatile RB.  I could even see an offensive linemen if they slide in the first and pick up extra picks, but it would have to be an elite talent. 

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-11-2017, 04:37 PM)Big Boss Wrote: I'm starting to think it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world having him as our next HC.

Having said that, can we please do something about our defensive schemes in the secondary?  If I see one more ten-yard cushion given to an opposing wide receiver for an easy first down, I'm going to lose it.

I was shouting this to anyone that would listen, but they did seem to get more aggressive as the season wore on...unfortunately, that defense waited too long before it really started to roll.  Adam Jones was a massive disappointment this past year.  He was out of shape in the beginning of the season and paid dearly for it. 

I remember hearing Eric Thomas describe Vance Joseph being on the secondary to contest every pass on every snap in training camp.  He watched Coyle this year in disbelief as there was a lot more goofing off and poor technique not being addressed.  I heard that interview the fourth week of the season.  It sent chills down my spine.  It turns out he was dead on.  

I hope Guenther spends more time on the back end with an iron fist.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-14-2017, 03:06 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yeah, all i read in that is respect for Peko who deserves it. He has been a great teammate and was once a good run stopper.

Give him respect and let him go. Paulie wants to play the best players and we have two bright young ones in Billings and DeShawn.

Might even add another in the draft. Hardison has played well too in his limited snaps.

Peko deserves praise for how he held down that position this year.  He was supposed to be used in a rotational manner, but ended up having to take the bulk of snaps (again) because the rookie got injured (again), and Pat Sims was too fat to play very long (again).

I believe he can still contribute very well if his snaps were reduced by 50%.  He is still a very instinctive player with a high motor.  I have no idea why he gets such hate around here (not saying that is you, Nate).  If he isn't brought back and Billings and Hardison struggle or have injuries, we will realize that it isn't easy to just plug and play a NT.  

I would give him the same two-year offer that I would Whit, but for less money.  Maybe $8-9 million for two years.  

[treee]

I'm not so sure that Vigil should be starting at LB next season. Rather, we shouldn't be comfortable with the prospect of him automatically being slated as a starter next season. Hopefully we have some good competition at LB this spring bringing in some talent from the draft and FA. He still has a lot to prove.