2023 TE Draft Prospects Group Assessment

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(02-04-2023, 03:08 PM)QueenCity Wrote: Not getting why Bengals fans are hell-bent on drafting a TE..... just roll with Hurst for another season or two and upgrade elsewhere.

We need another weapon. When Boyd went down, they swarmed Chase & Tee & no one else could get open. Be it TE or WR. 

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

OK, injecting boilerplate analysis on cap/FA/team situation.

I. 2023 Bengals General FA/Cap Situation

# of Starters who are FA = 8.
Offense = 1. Hurst
Defense = 4. Bates, Bell, Pratt, Apple.
Special = 3. Adomitis (Restricted?), Taylor (PR), T. Williams (KR)

# of Key Reserves who are FAs = 4.
Offense = 3. Perine, Scharping, Wilcox (Restricted)
Defense = 1. Flowers.

With 41 guys signed, we have an estimated $182,145,784 in slaries and $619,060 in Dead Cap for 2023. For total commitments so far of $182,764,844. With a projected cap of $225 million and $2,497,443 in rollover cap from last year, we project to have $44,733,599 in cap space to fill out our roster. Re-sign our own guys. Sign new guys. Pay draft picks.

And that sounds like a lot of money, and it is. But remember, we always leave a cushion to sign other players to the 53 when guys get hurt during the season & go on IR. Usualy $6-$10 mil. Our FA's this year are either due significant raises (Pratt, Hurst), already making big money (Bates, Bell), or likely to be significantly above vet min level (Apple, Perine, Flowers, Scharping).


II. Looming Cap Issues

And of course the issue of the looming raises for Burrow & Chase. While they won't hit until 2025 for Burrow and 2026 for Chase, they are gonna represent a large increase over what they currently make & change our cap space going forward. Burrow could go from $11 mil to $50 mil, and Chase from $10 mil to $25-30 mil. Guys who sign deals this year (or next) will have their contracts overlap with these new deals. Yes, the cap will go up as well, it went up around $17 mil for 2023, but that still falls short of covering this. More so when other rookie scale guys are up. FWIW, here is the FA schedule for guys who could command significant salary.

2023: Pratt (rookie), Bates, Bell, Hurst, Apple.
2024: Higgins (rookie), L. Wilson (rookie), Reader, Mixon (Team Option), J. Williams, Boyd, Awuzie.
2025: Burrow (rookie), Hendrickson, Mixon, BJ Hill, Collins, Hilton, Karras
2026: Chase (rookie); Hubbard, Cappa

Also remember that as the cap goes up, the number it takes to retain good players also increases. And I am mindful that creative contracts can reduce the cap hit for Burrow & Chase & others. And for some, we may part ways befire the FA year if the salary is high, but the oerfromance & Dead Cap number is low.

It certainly behooves us to line up possible replacements in rookie scale deals for some of our higher priced players who are not performing to contract, who we may not be able to pay again, or for rookie scale guys who may be too expensive to retain.

[Nicomo Cosca]

Darnell Washington pushing the sled then other TEs for reference. ?

Some GM is gonna get an extra OL who is also fast and can catch. pic.twitter.com/lIU20evvxV

— Jon Tweets Sports (@jontweetssports) March 5, 2023

This is pretty wild. Kid is a freak.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

IF we are gonna go TE in Rd1 he really needs to be an impact guy. We are gonna want a guy who can line up in-line rather than split. I'd much rather take a speedy WR (Hyatt, Flowers) than a weak-blocking TE who splits out (Kincaid). Maybe if the line was better, I'd change my tune. If we want a catch inly guy, take Mallory later on.

I'd also want the TE to be really strong in one aspect. And while I think guys like Mayer, Musgrave, Kraft, LaPorta, Whyle, to be good all around players, they don't blow me away me in any one skill.

Washington's blocking does. It's almost like adding a RT as well as a TE. And he woukd fit well with Hurst. TE2 plays a lot for us. While washington is a better blocker than receiver, and Hurst the opposite, they both can do both. When Wilcox, Sample, or Asiasi are in, they are zero threat receiving and we almost are giving the play away via personnel.

I remain TE skeptical in Rd1, but if we do it, Washington would be my guy.

[*Synric*]

(03-05-2023, 12:27 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote:

Darnell Washington pushing the sled then other TEs for reference. ?

Some GM is gonna get an extra OL who is also fast and can catch. pic.twitter.com/lIU20evvxV

— Jon Tweets Sports (@jontweetssports) March 5, 2023

This is pretty wild. Kid is a freak.

Darnell Washington has a ton of power in his lower half lol.

My guy Brenton Strange just would not be shown up though. Listen when he uncoils those hips and strikes the sled THEN drives it back.

.@BrentonStrange out here making it look EASY ??

? #NFLCombine on @NFLNetwork pic.twitter.com/m9kmNSFAY4

— Penn State Football (@PennStateFball) March 5, 2023

 

[QueenCity]

Starting to think Washington isn't going to make it to the Bengals.

[OSUfan]

After watching a ton of film and watching the players on the field together and doing individual drills the following are the TEs that I believe fit the Bengals well and where I would draft them:

Round 1:

Darnell Washington - he is the only round 1 TE that I would select. I could understand the selection at 28 but ideally would prefer to see a trade down scenario.

Round 2:

Tucker Kraft - I feel that he is an outstanding all around TE and I think he compares favorably to Dallas Goedert another SD State product. May be a bit high and if he is there in 3 it is a no brainer.

Luke Musgrave - His blocking concerns me a bit but he has the size and build for it so this could develop.

Michael Mayer - Extremely solid in all phases.

Round 3:

Tucker Kraft - See above

Luke Schoonmaker - The more film I watch on him the more I like him. I think he will contribute day 1 and I believe he will continue to develop and be a really good pro.

Josh Whyle - Needs to continue to develop his play strength but a good prospect for sure. Would be really good value in round 4.

Round 4:

Schoonmaker or Whyle would be a great value in this round.

Round 5-6:

Cameron Latu - Wish he would have ran the drills with the other TEs. Decent film just needs to continue to develop.

[TecmoBengals]

That sled push!

I feel like we're lucky to end up with a good player at 28 no matter who is taken. A TE, RB, OL, or DT/DE of talent might fall to us.

[*Synric*]

(03-05-2023, 01:08 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: That sled push!

Everyone is so impressed by Darnell Washington pushing that sled back and me all I can think about when watching that clip is "YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG!" He doesn't really come out of his stance and strike the bag he reaches out and lightly perfectly places his hands on the sled then just starts driving.


Edit: Although its not an issue because Washington just beats people up on tape.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(02-02-2023, 03:11 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Musgrave is too big of a question mark.  Unsure of his blocking skills and he only played 2 games this season?

Washington is more of our style as he is a very good blocker with strong hands.  If we re-sign Hurst I'm not sure we are willing to draft him in the 1st or 2nd round...?

Agree on both points, I like Washington and Mayer for us if we do go for a TE at 28 if Hurst leaves for big dough like PFF is 
predicting. But if Hurst is back I wait on TE until at least the 2nd round, preferably day 3 I look at guys like Whyle, Durham, 
Schoonmaker etc.

(02-02-2023, 05:17 PM)Synric Wrote: Yea after watching Musgrave these two days at the Senior Bowl Practices you can see why he was getting alot of hype going into the week. He has been open every route in team drills lol. Today in redzone offense that's gonna be fun to watch with Musgrave.

He sure looks talented and smart. But like Casaer says, so little play on the field to justify a first round pick pretty much on 
talent and the Senior Bowl. Interesting to say the least to see where Musgrave is drafted.

(02-04-2023, 07:14 AM)Synric Wrote: I really like Darnell Washington. He is a throw back Tight End entering the league at the perfect moment because defenses are playing alot more cover 2 shells to stop all these star receivers teams are running the ball more.

Does he fit the Bengals though? In Cincinnati he will likely see a lot more of his reps running routes than blocking and that takes away from what he does best.

Seems like Washington fits if Hurst leaves. Still want the other Darnell over him.

(02-04-2023, 11:50 AM)WVUHomer Wrote: Considering how his best trait is his blocking and you'd have to unlock his receiving potential (which didn't happen at Georgia due to Bowers talents), I don't see how you could justify that at 1. 

Thats why I suggested Durham. Solid blocker, seems to have good hands, runs decent routes and willing to carry a team (literally, watch him carry 6 Maryland defenders for a touchdown). In his interview at the Senior Bowl, sounded like a Bengal (I don't care what I have to do as long as the team wins). And best of all, he's a lower pick so you can replenish more important areas first with higher level talents.

Same, I like Durham a lot more the more when evaluating these TE's. Kraft I also really like, once he catches the ball he turns into a RB.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-05-2023, 12:45 PM)Synric Wrote: Darnell Washington has a ton of power in his lower half lol.

My guy Brenton Strange just would not be shown up though. Listen when he uncoils those hips and strikes the sled THEN drives it back.

.@BrentonStrange out here making it look EASY ??

? #NFLCombine on @NFLNetwork pic.twitter.com/m9kmNSFAY4

— Penn State Football (@PennStateFball) March 5, 2023

 

Yeah, that is the way to move the sled, the way Strange did it. Washington like you said went soft handed first, not the way even 
if he pushed the sled a mile like it was nothing. Still, these are some strong TE's.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-05-2023, 12:57 PM)OSUfan Wrote: After watching a ton of film and watching the players on the field together and doing individual drills the following are the TEs that I believe fit the Bengals well and where I would draft them:

Round 1:

Darnell Washington - he is the only round 1 TE that I would select. I could understand the selection at 28 but ideally would prefer to see a trade down scenario.

Round 2:

Tucker Kraft - I feel that he is an outstanding all around TE and I think he compares favorably to Dallas Goedert another SD State product. May be a bit high and if he is there in 3 it is a no brainer.

Luke Musgrave - His blocking concerns me a bit but he has the size and build for it so this could develop.

Michael Mayer - Extremely solid in all phases.

Round 3:

Tucker Kraft - See above

Luke Schoonmaker - The more film I watch on him the more I like him. I think he will contribute day 1 and I believe he will continue to develop and be a really good pro.

Josh Whyle - Needs to continue to develop his play strength but a good prospect for sure. Would be really good value in round 4.

Round 4:

Schoonmaker or Whyle would be a great value in this round.

Round 5-6:

Cameron Latu - Wish he would have ran the drills with the other TEs. Decent film just needs to continue to develop.

Nice breakdown of the TE's and where you predict they might go. Kraft sounds intriguing will have to watch some of his vids.

Always liked Schoonmaker who I saw the most of last season at Michigan. He can block, catch and run routes well. Solid.

Payne Durham should also be a thought on day 3 for us.

[casear2727]

(03-05-2023, 04:15 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Nice breakdown of the TE's and where you predict they might go. Kraft sounds intriguing will have to watch some of his vids.

Always liked Schoonmaker who I saw the most of last season at Michigan. He can block, catch and run routes well. Solid.

Payne Durham should also be a thought on day 3 for us.

Durham is solid.  I can see him going ahead of Schoonmaker, Latu and Whyle.  Although I think Whyle has a big upside.

[OSUfan]

(03-05-2023, 06:25 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Durham is solid.  I can see him going ahead of Schoonmaker, Latu and Whyle.  Although I think Whyle has a big upside.

Not sure what makes you see him jumping these guys. Yes he is solid but so is Schoonmaker who is far more dynamic in the passing game. 

[casear2727]

(03-05-2023, 06:40 PM)OSUfan Wrote: Not sure what makes you see him jumping these guys. Yes he is solid but so is Schoonmaker who is far more dynamic in the passing game. 

Durham has twice the receptions and receiving yards of Schoonmaker, he was the go to guy for their offense.  Michigan was obviously a more talented and well rounded team.  But Schoonmaker was never the primary target of the opposing defense.

I do not dislike Schoonmaker, I love his athleticism.  Im just saying i wouldnt be surprised if Payne was chosen ahead of him.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-05-2023, 06:25 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Durham is solid.  I can see him going ahead of Schoonmaker, Latu and Whyle.  Although I think Whyle has a big upside.

I could see that. Better production than Schoonmaker so he could definitely go ahead of him like you said. Yes, Whyle's upside is huge.

So many TE's in this class I like it is crazy. I don't know who I like the best honestly, so many different styles of play. Mayer might be the 
best all around without a weakness, but he isn't a monster TE, 6'4" is average. Was surprised LaPorta is only 6'3" that is a touch undersized
for an NFL TE.

[casear2727]

(03-05-2023, 07:53 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I could see that. Better production than Schoonmaker so he could definitely go ahead of him like you said. Yes, Whyle's upside is huge.

So many TE's in this class I like it is crazy. I don't know who I like the best honestly, so many different styles of play. Mayer might be the 
best all around without a weakness, but he isn't a monster TE, 6'4" is average. Was surprised LaPorta is only 6'3" that is a touch undersized
for an NFL TE.

LaPorta can catch and actually get YAC though, he's more in the mold of a running back.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-06-2023, 10:48 PM)casear2727 Wrote: LaPorta can catch and actually get YAC though, he's more in the mold of a running back.

Yes, him and Kraft seem a bit alike. Always liked LaPorta, he just had shit at QB. LaPorta in the 3rd would be great IMO.

But like I said, so many TE's in this draft I like.

[*psychdoctor*]

(03-07-2023, 05:11 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yes, him and Kraft seem a bit alike. Always liked LaPorta, he just had shit at QB. LaPorta in the 3rd would be great IMO.

But like I said, so many TE's in this draft I like.

Keep your eye on Davis Allen.  

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-07-2023, 05:15 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Keep your eye on Davis Allen.  

I will thanks.