All Male Squads performed better

[Mike M (the other one)]

(09-11-2015, 12:14 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: Screw it !
Let's have mandatory 2 years of service for everyone.

Mandatory with very few exceptions.

I would want it that way as well, then follow up with 4 free years of college or 2 years of additional training in a vocational school to learn a specific trade.

It would take a few years to start noticing the changes within our country, but in the long run, we'd be much better off.

[Belsnickel]

(09-11-2015, 01:21 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Mandatory with very few exceptions.

I would want it that way as well, then follow up with 4 free years of college or 2 years of additional training in a vocational school to learn a specific trade.

It would take a few years to start noticing the changes within our country, but in the long run, we'd be much better off.

We couldn't handle that, the college bit, fiscally. The military is having a tough time fulfilling their GI Bill obligations as it is and is trying to find a way out of them.

[SteelCitySouth]

(09-11-2015, 01:21 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Mandatory with very few exceptions.

I would want it that way as well, then follow up with 4 free years of college or 2 years of additional training in a vocational school to learn a specific trade.

It would take a few years to start noticing the changes within our country, but in the long run, we'd be much better off.

Man...Start with some service requirements and Mike M immediately goes after the government handouts...damn liberal

[*bfine32*]

(09-11-2015, 01:41 AM)Benton Wrote: Don't think you were.

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/story/military/2015/09/10/mixed-gender-teams-come-up-short-marines-infantry-experiment/71979146/

That's the link from the from the OP link.

I got it from this:

Quote:They were divided by military occupational specialties representative of those in the ground combat element of a traditional Marine air-ground task force: infantry; weapons; artillery; and mechanized units, including tanks and other armored vehicles. A provisional rifle platoon rounded out the unit, allowing officials to assess and compare the performance of Marines who had received no formal infantry training with those who had completed Lejeune's Infantry Training Battalion, including some of the first female graduates.

As I said, not sure I'm reading correctly, but it looks like the squads were each devided with experienced Infantrymen and then non-combat Soldier added to round out the squards regardless of sex.  But like the article said They will release more on the composition of the Squads in current weeks.

It just seemed as if some were suggesting that the squads with females performed more poorly because they were being compared to squads consisting solely of Infantrymen. Who knows I could be wrong and be 0-4 this week. Imagine my shame.

[Rotobeast]

(09-11-2015, 01:21 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Mandatory with very few exceptions.

I would want it that way as well, then follow up with 4 free years of college or 2 years of additional training in a vocational school to learn a specific trade.

It would take a few years to start noticing the changes within our country, but in the long run, we'd be much better off.

I'd be ok with that.
As already mentioned though, the cost may be too steep.
Also, let's be fair, 2 years service really doesn't pay for a 4 year degree.
Maybe offer 50% or 100 for 4 years.
I'd like to see this put in effect and take place of the TSA and other similar agencies.

[*Nately120*]

Wait, I thought the answer when anyone questions anything the US Military does is:

SUPPORT OUR TROOPS!!!!!!!!

[SteelCitySouth]

(09-11-2015, 03:04 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: I'd like to see this put in effect and take place of the TSA and other similar agencies.

Not sure that would be constitutional.  

[Belsnickel]

(09-11-2015, 03:07 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: Not sure that would be constitutional.  

I don't know about constitutionality, but it would be against our current laws. Military cannot participate in domestic law enforcement activities.

[SteelCitySouth]

(09-11-2015, 03:53 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I don't know about constitutionality, but it would be against our current laws. Military cannot participate in domestic law enforcement activities.

Yup...Just federal law. 

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-11-2015, 01:21 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Mandatory with very few exceptions.

I would want it that way as well, then follow up with 4 free years of college or 2 years of additional training in a vocational school to learn a specific trade.

It would take a few years to start noticing the changes within our country, but in the long run, we'd be much better off.

Do you have any military experience?

[Mike M (the other one)]

(09-11-2015, 01:41 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: We couldn't handle that, the college bit, fiscally. The military is having a tough time fulfilling their GI Bill obligations as it is and is trying to find a way out of them.

It can be done. The government wastes a lot of money on stupid things. We could even take it out of the Defense Fund.

(09-11-2015, 02:17 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: Man...Start with some service requirements and Mike M immediately goes after the government handouts...damn liberal

No, not going after hand outs, this is something that I firmly believe that we need to have. Free education for all.
We are so far behind in this department compared to the rest of the world.

[RoyleRedlegs]

(09-11-2015, 12:59 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'm a fan of the Swiss model.

That part of the world puts out some beautiful ladies. 

[Rotobeast]

(09-11-2015, 03:07 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: Not sure that would be constitutional.  

(09-11-2015, 03:53 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I don't know about constitutionality, but it would be against our current laws. Military cannot participate in domestic law enforcement activities.

(09-11-2015, 03:58 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: Yup...Just federal law. 

I wasn't aware that the TSA employees (screeners in particular) were actually law officers.
I thought they were just on a security guard kind of level.

http://abcnews.go.com/Travel/story?id=5173231&page=1

Furthermore, my thoughts on National Service are that there would be other alternatives for people to choose, other than military.
The TSA could be one of them, were they to qualify.
Emergency responders, Negotiators, and such would be necessary.
Heck, I'd even allow people to be child care professionals in a program run by the government.
I do think it would still be prudent to have some sort of light basic training though, to instill discipline and make sure people have proper life skills.
And if you drop out of high school, however many years early you drop out would be tacked onto your National Service.
I think Israel has a nice set-up.
They even have an alternative to the Defense Force.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherut_Leumi

[Belsnickel]

(09-11-2015, 08:13 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: I wasn't aware that the TSA employees (screeners in particular) were actually law officers.
I thought they were just on a security guard kind of level.

http://abcnews.go.com/Travel/story?id=5173231&page=1

Title 10 lays out prohibitions on members of the armed services being involved in searches or seizures as well. So while the majority of the TSA may not be considered full on LEOs (there are actual officers among them), the actions they take would not be permissible under USC as it is currently written.

[Rotobeast]

(09-11-2015, 10:26 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Title 10 lays out prohibitions on members of the armed services being involved in searches or seizures as well. So while the majority of the TSA may not be considered full on LEOs (there are actual officers among them), the actions they take would not be permissible under USC as it is currently written.

Ok then.
Thank you for educating me.
Again though, we could allow the TSA as is and allow those in NS to fill roles.
Those in NS wouldn't necessarily have to be under military control, just a federal program.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(09-11-2015, 01:41 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: We couldn't handle that, the college bit, fiscally. The military is having a tough time fulfilling their GI Bill obligations as it is and is trying to find a way out of them.

That's because we allow them to find a way out of it. 

[Beaker]

Free college for everyone is not a good idea. Not everyone is college material. There needs to be a "qualification" to enroll in any free college. What should come along with it is apprenticeship type programs, or job training for trades for those who would not make good college candidates. Along with that would be a placement program for successful completion. Like my dad used to say "there is honor in manual labor....the world needs ditch diggers too son". And I don't think college should be free. I think that colleges should have something akin to tuition limits so that it can be affordable to all who qualify. You always appreciate things more when you have some type of investment in them.

[Blutarsky]

(09-12-2015, 01:17 PM)Beaker Wrote: Free college for everyone is not a good idea. Not everyone is college material. There needs to be a "qualification" to enroll in any free college. What should come along with it is apprenticeship type programs, or job training for trades for those who would not make good college candidates. Along with that would be a placement program for successful completion. Like my dad used to say "there is honor in manual labor....the world needs ditch diggers too son". And I don't think college should be free. I think that colleges should have something akin to tuition limits so that it can be affordable to all who qualify. You always appreciate things more when you have some type of investment in them.

All true. Not to mention that some college degrees are next to worthless, and that many trade and manual labor workers earn more that those with college degrees.

The average salary of a UPS driver is $76,000 yr. Good for the UPS driver. Probably insulting to a teacher or engineer that a delivery guy makes as much as they do.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-11-2015, 07:04 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: It can be done. The government wastes a lot of money on stupid things. We could even take it out of the Defense Fund.


No, not going after hand outs, this is something that I firmly believe that we need to have. Free education for all.
We are so far behind in this department compared to the rest of the world.

Do you have military experience?

[Mike M (the other one)]

(09-12-2015, 01:17 PM)Beaker Wrote: Free college for everyone is not a good idea. Not everyone is college material. There needs to be a "qualification" to enroll in any free college. What should come along with it is apprenticeship type programs, or job training for trades for those who would not make good college candidates. Along with that would be a placement program for successful completion. Like my dad used to say "there is honor in manual labor....the world needs ditch diggers too son". And I don't think college should be free. I think that colleges should have something akin to tuition limits so that it can be affordable to all who qualify. You always appreciate things more when you have some type of investment in them.

I agree with this, and that whole line of thinking. I posted in huge detail in the old forums about this and this was included. Some will want to learn a trade and that's fine as well. Hopefully while in the military they can get some basics about some crafts and when they get out, go to a school to fine tune themselves in their chosen craft.

(09-13-2015, 01:42 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Do you have military experience?

No I do not, however I don't see how that is truly relevant to the discussion, as I was not the first to suggest it, nor the last to agree with it and I don't see you asking any of them about their military experience. I'm pretty sure you intend to use my answer as an ad hominem attack. So here's your chance to prove me wrong.

I would've had no problems going into the military. I was being recruited by both the Navy and the Air Force. I was informed (based on my ASFAB scores) that I would be a great candidate for Intelligence. However, I decided to pay my own way thru college instead.