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(06-22-2015, 06:14 PM)michaelsean Wrote: And the $2500 is much more important to the middle class guy than the $4000 to the rich guy.
You can't be serious with this argument, can you? We have to give the rich bigger tax breaks because they are so rich that small tax breaks don't matter?
Really?
(06-22-2015, 06:14 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Bottom line is if you take it away, you hurt millions of middle class families. How much do you think you could cut their taxes by eliminating the interest deduction? I have no idea how to figure that out.
Bottom line is that by removing the $70 billion tax break that benefits the rich more than the lower and middle classes we can adjust the tax brackets so that EVERYONE benefits instead of just the people wealthy enough to have a mortgage large enough to be a tax deduction.
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(06-22-2015, 06:21 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You can't be serious with this argument, can you? We have to give the rich bigger tax breaks because they are so rich that small tax breaks don't matter?
Really?
Bottom line is that by removing the $70 billion tax break that benefits the rich more than the lower and middle classes we can adjust the tax brackets so that EVERYONE benefits instead of just the people wealthy enough to have a mortgage large enough to be a tax deduction.
I never came close to saying that. When you are talking about benefiting people, the 2500 is more beneficial than the 4000. And you cant have it bith ways. You want richer people to have a higher tax rate, but then complain that a deductiion favors them more because of it. Or complain that tax breaks favor only people who pay taxes.
Ok so you eliminate the mortgage deduction altogether. Is the savings from what the rich pay enough to counter what the middle class loses? And when you say help everybody, there is a nice chunk of people dont benefit now, but did previously. I will be one of those soon. I'll be in the 42% who do not itemize in the next couple of years, but I got to for many years.
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Fred do you not take the mortgage deduction since its so anti middle and low class? I would expect you to stand for your principles and pay your fair share... Since you believe the more taken from us the better.
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(06-22-2015, 07:24 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Fred do you not take the mortgage deduction since its so anti middle and low class? I would expect you to stand for your principles and pay your fair share... Since you believe the more taken from us the better.
I don't have enough mortgage interest (or other deductions) to itemize.
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(06-22-2015, 07:29 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't have enough mortgage interest (or other deductions) to itemize.
So you would not take it even if the numbers worked out for you?
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(06-22-2015, 06:55 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Ok so you eliminate the mortgage deduction altogether. Is the savings from what the rich pay enough to counter what the middle class loses?
Almost half of the middle class have zero benefit right now.
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(06-22-2015, 07:30 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: So you would not take it even if the numbers worked out for you?
Of course I would take it. And I am not blaming anyone for taking the deduction.
I am concerned about an entire class of people. My taking a few thousand dollars off my taxes is meaningless when talking about helping an entire class of people. The law needs to be changed to make any difference.
This type of argument is silly. You believe that the US needs to take a stand against Islamic extremists. Have you volunteered to fight them?
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(06-22-2015, 07:40 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Of course I would take it. And I am not blaming anyone for taking the deduction.
I am concerned about an entire class of people. My taking a few thousand dollars off my taxes is meaningless when talking about helping an entire class of people. The law needs to be changed to make any difference.
This type of argument is silly. You believe that the US needs to take a stand against Islamic extremists. Have you volunteered to fight them?
Yeah I volunteer for a group who helps women who have expierenced DV. Since muslims have a horrible record of beating their women then I am standing against their way of life.
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If you concerned about that people then take a personal stand, stop taking the benfits of having money .... And start writing a check out of your income and giving it to a poor family.
How much do you think a poor family needs to live? Write a check out of your money. Start a trend.
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(06-22-2015, 07:30 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Almost half of the middle class have zero benefit right now.
Rigjht now, but some of that 42% had it at one timeas well. Maybe Matt can figure it out, but I don't see any way you eliminate the mortgage deduction, move the money the rich were saving to middle class tax cuts and end up with more money in the middle class.
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(06-22-2015, 08:38 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Yeah I volunteer for a group who helps women who have expierenced DV. Since muslims have a horrible record of beating their women then I am standing against their way of life.
You are treating them after they have been abused. You are not man enough to do anything to actually stop it.
If you are really concerned then volunteer to fight against them. Go fight ISIS if you consider them a threat
FYI I don't really believe any of this is a valid argument. I am just pointing out how silly Lucy's argument is.
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(06-22-2015, 08:40 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: If you concerned about that people then take a personal stand, stop taking the benfits of having money .... And start writing a check out of your income and giving it to a poor family.
How much do you think a poor family needs to live? Write a check out of your money. Start a trend.
I can't solve the problem. The system has to be changed to solve the problem.
I give to charity but there is still too much poverty in this country.
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(06-22-2015, 09:39 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I can't solve the problem. The system has to be changed to solve the problem.
I give to charity but there is still too much poverty in this country.
So your passing the buck to the "system" .. Gotcha
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(06-22-2015, 09:36 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You are treating them after they have been abused. You are not man enough to do anything to actually stop it.
If you are really concerned then volunteer to fight against them. Go fight ISIS if you consider them a threat
FYI I don't really believe any of this is a valid argument. I am just pointing out how silly Lucy's argument is.
Yeah it's silly to spend time and money supporting DV victims. ... I guess I just can't wait for the "system" to take care of the problems in my local community.
And FYI I do believe in everything I do locally. ... See while your waiting for the system to come fix your problems we are rolling up our sleeves and getting dirty. No wonder your town is a bad as you make it.... Maybe if you spent more time helping people in need there would be less division. But hey your just gonna complain about the "system"
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(06-22-2015, 10:28 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: So your passing the buck to the "system" .. Gotcha
No I am dealing with reality.
I can't solve the problem as an individual.
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(06-22-2015, 10:33 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Yeah it's silly to spend time and money supporting DV victims.
Never said it was silly.
Just said you were not doing anything to fight against radical Islam. Instead you are just passing the buck to the system.
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(06-22-2015, 10:33 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: we are rolling up our sleeves and getting dirty.
You are "getting dirty" with DV victims?
That sounds a little creepy to me.
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(06-22-2015, 10:46 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No I am dealing with reality.
I can't solve the problem as an individual.
All we can do as individuals is hammer away at the problems at a local level. If we spend our lives waiting for the system to do things for us .... when we can do what we can now and hope it's contagious. I have more faith in my local community stepping up than I do the system.
Your right you can't solve the problem by yourself ... But you can solve a problem for someone else.
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(06-22-2015, 10:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You are "getting dirty" with DV victims?
That sounds a little creepy to me.
Haha yes down and dirty
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Most idiotic load of bull shit I've ever heard.
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