Coronavirus Information...who do you trust?

[GMDino]

(03-22-2021, 04:38 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: We should.  We should have protected the at risk......nursing homes (Cuomo huge fail), hospitals, healthcare practices, etc, and let everyone else keep on living.

"People at risk" are not all in nursing homes. They have lives and jobs. If "WE" the lower risk can protect them we should. At least that is what I believe. Some seem to only care about themselves.

(03-22-2021, 04:38 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: Right, cause there is nothing selfish about crushing our economy, keeping kids out of school and making people feel like they should be human lab rats when the vaccine doesn't even keep you from getting or passing covid.  Meanwhile, over 16 months of covid and 1/38th of NYC (500k) has passed and those are mostly elderly and people with underlying conditions.

No matter how many times you try "human lab rats" is not correct. Almost nothing in that rambling two sentence paragraph is correct.

(03-22-2021, 04:38 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: Say whatever you want.  You cannot change the total dead over x amount of time and who covid effects.  No reason to be shut down and schools closed.

I also will never understand why someone keeps repeating false information and as no care for others...unless it is about money. But then I am routinely disappointed by my fellow man.

[Au165]

(03-22-2021, 04:09 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: All I'm saying is if covid was the scourge people are making it out to be to the point of convincing people to be human lab rats, we would have a crap ton more than 500k elderly/people with underlying conditions dead over 16 months.

The final death toll will be far less than it would have been if it had left unchecked. How do we know that? We know that the spread was in fact curtailed by the various measures put in place because the Flu data showed dramatic drops because of these same measures. I have heard some people say, "The flu drop is because people are calling it COVID". The reality is that it's the exact opposite, in no time have we ever tested more people to confirm a diagnosis than we have over the last year.

While I see you constantly demean the lives of 500k people, underlying conditions can be "obese" based on BMI which I hate to tell you most of the country would meet that criteria. Also, note that BMI-based "obesity" is a horrible metric that doesn't actually take into account health or body composition. For instance, I am obese by the metric but have a body fat below 12%. If I died from COVID, I would be classified in the data as having a pre-existing condition. Now you might say, but you wouldn't die, but that is the issue with simply using data because the data doesn't tell the story. There are plenty of stories we have seen of perfectly healthy middle-aged people who did in fact die. I was fortunate when I got it that I was Asymptomatic, however, a fellow employee who I'd argue is a similar body composition to me ended up in the hospital and received assistance for his breathing at one point.

You will probably bring up heart disease again, and I would counter with more people have died in a year from COVID than all U.S. casualties from war since WW2. It's not to say heart disease isn't a big deal, but heart disease is not the same as something that spreads hence why it takes a community effort to combat it. Masks, quarantines, vaccines are this current world's version of doing your part for a war effort against an enemy that can be defeated if we pull together. 

[Belsnickel]

(03-22-2021, 04:05 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: Actually, the experts have flip flopped on numerous things covid.  Look at Fauci or the WHO.  You are assuming the experts are actually getting it correct. 

Common sense is also knowing when you are being mislead or to know the experts may not be as "expert" as they may claim.  Questioning is good vs blindly believing the experts are always correct.  Not everything has to be complicated even when it appears to be. 

The "flip flopping" is a result of learning new things about the virus. That's the scientific process. Questioning is good, but when you don't understand the issues enough to ask good questions about the topic, then you might want to step back. I don't blindly accept anything, I actually read the source documents. I read the studies and look at the data. Not only do I look at the data, I look at the data collection methods and the information about the statistical modelling. Then I look for corroborating studies and meta-analyses. I look for consensus among experts.

When these things exist, I will trust them over someone on Facebook any day of the week when they try to say that disagreeing with all of that is "common sense."

[*Nately120*]

(03-22-2021, 05:27 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: The "flip flopping" is a result of learning new things about the virus. That's the scientific process. Questioning is good, but when you don't understand the issues enough to ask good questions about the topic, then you might want to step back. I don't blindly accept anything, I actually read the source documents. I read the studies and look at the data. Not only do I look at the data, I look at the data collection methods and the information about the statistical modelling. Then I look for corroborating studies and meta-analyses. I look for consensus among experts.

When these things exist, I will trust them over someone on Facebook any day of the week when they try to say that disagreeing with all of that is "common sense."

I never flip flop on science, that's why I still stand by bloodletting and alchemy. 

[BigPapaKain]

(03-22-2021, 01:13 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: Actually they do lend to the problem of overcrowding in some schools, but whatever. 

Ya, but I must have missed the part where it said flood in across the border illegally and take resources from actual American citizens.  I'll have to read it again.

Then I guess we'll have to start giving funds to schools to compensate and help prevent overcrowding. But that'd be fixing national infrastructure and nobody wants to do that (ignoring that it'd create more jobs, lead to better test scores, better students, etc).

Where are these floods of immigrants at? Since illegals aren't exactly documented (which would make it easier to deport them since they're documented), saying their flooding across the border is impossible to prove, so you're entire point is conjecture at best. If you're entire theory is based on optics provided by the media, you're theory is dismissed without a second thought since the media deals in sensationalism these days.

[GMDino]

https://www.wafb.com/2021/03/22/national-guard-soldiers-transporting-vaccines-held-gunpoint-west-texas-suspect-arrested/

Quote:11 National Guard Soldiers transporting vaccines held at gunpoint in West Texas, suspect arrested
Idalou Police responded to the scene

Larry Lee Harris, 66, of Arizona, was arrested and charged with Aggravated Assault w/ Deadly Weapon, Unlawful Restraint of 11 National Guard Soldiers, Unlawful Carrying of a Weapon, Impersonating a Public Servant, and Interference with Texas Military Forces. (Source: Lubbock County Detention Center)



By KCBD Staff | March 22, 2021 at 12:48 PM CDT - Updated March 23 at 12:30 AM

LUBBOCK COUNTY, Texas (KCBD) - An Arizona man has been arrested after he cut off and held at gunpoint a caravan of National Guardsmen transporting COVID-19 vaccines to Matador, Texas around 7 a.m. this morning, according to Idalou Police.
Larry Harris, of Willcox, Arizona, is accused of following three National Guardsmen vans from Love’s Travel Station on East Regis Street in Lubbock to about two miles east of Idalou. Police say Harris attempted multiple times to run the vans off of the roadway. He then turned his vehicle into oncoming traffic on Hwy. 62/82 and stopped the vans. He then pointed a gun at an unarmed National Guardsman, identified himself as a detective, and demanded to search the vehicles and ordered the rest of the unarmed guardsmen out of their vehicles at gunpoint.


11 National Guardsmen held at gunpoint while transporting COVID-19 vaccines to Matador, Texas on Monday, March 22, 2021. (Source: Idalou Police Department)

Harris told police he thought the people in the vans had kidnapped a woman and child. All 11 of the guardsmen were in uniform.
When police arrived on the scene, Harris was in possession of a loaded Colt 1911 pistol .45 Caliber. He had an additional loaded magazine on his person and another loaded magazine in his truck, police say.

The Idalou officers took Harris into custody without further incident.

Harris was arrested on charges of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon, unlawful restraint of 11 National Guard Soldiers, unlawful carrying of a weapon, impersonating a Public Servant, and interference with Texas Military Forces. The Idalou Police Department is currently investigating this incident. The Lubbock County Sheriff’s Office assisted with the investigation.

None of the Guardsmen were injured and none of them were armed.

“Mr. Harris appeared to be mentally disturbed. This was a very dangerous situation since the suspect was standing in the midst of the unarmed Guardsman with a loaded weapon when the Idalou Officers arrived on scene. We are grateful that the officers were able to take him into custody without any of the Guardsmen, the officers or the suspect getting hurt,” said Eric Williams, Idalou Police Chief.

Copyright 2021 KCBD. All rights reserved.

[*michaelsean*]

(03-23-2021, 09:40 AM)GMDino Wrote:

https://www.wafb.com/2021/03/22/national-guard-soldiers-transporting-vaccines-held-gunpoint-west-texas-suspect-arrested/

Is it bad that I see a picture of a person and think he should already be in prison just because?  I mean that guy had no chance of not doing something.  

[Au165]

(03-23-2021, 10:52 AM)michaelsean Wrote: Is it bad that I see a picture of a person and think he should already be in prison just because?  I mean that guy had no chance of not doing something.  

...am I the only one who sees Saddam Hussein post hiding in the hole here?

[*Nately120*]

(03-23-2021, 10:52 AM)michaelsean Wrote: Is it bad that I see a picture of a person and think he should already be in prison just because?  I mean that guy had no chance of not doing something.  

I was scrolling by and immediately though Sadaam Hussein had been resurrected or his cousin was up to something.  

[Mickeypoo]

Texas lifts mask mandate 3 weeks ago. Politicians, media and people scared of their own shadow predict death to all!!!! Cases and deaths steadily declined.

[*jason*]

(03-26-2021, 02:32 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: Texas lifts mask mandate 3 weeks ago. Politicians, media and people scared of their own shadow predict death to all!!!! Cases and deaths steadily declined.

I hope it stays that way... I think we're all weary and over the whole thing. Personally I'm tired of all the fussin' just to fuss at each other about masks and "lockdowns" (hopefully nobody who refers to them as that ever finds themselves in custody or incarcerated... They won't do well if they think that's what it's about). Texas can do what it sees fit, and I wish them the best. They're certainly ranting about all those Covid 19 positive folks at the border though... Not my problem.

[fredtoast]

(03-26-2021, 02:32 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: Texas lifts mask mandate 3 weeks ago.  Politicians, media and people scared of their own shadow predict death to all!!!!  Cases and deaths steadily declined.

There would be a larger decline if they were all wearing masks.

[Beaker]

An important factor to wearing masks and getting vaccinated that is not being touted is the virus' ability to mutate into different strains....which we are already beginning to see.

The more hosts the virus can infect, the more opportunities it has to reproduce. The more opportunities it has to reproduce, the more chances it has to mutate.

Influenza is another virus that is a corona virus. There is a reason we need flu shots every year. That virus has been around humans for literally hundreds of years. It has had the opportunity to mutate into so many different variants, that all we can do is chase it and try to guess which variant will be prevalent each flu season.

The Covid corona virus is new to human hosts. If we can get enough people vaccinated to cut off its opportunity to reproduce, we can prevent it from establishing too many variants and having to have different Covid shots available each season.

I encourage everyone to get vaccinated to prevent this scenario.

[TheUberHuber]

Linkedin
CORONAVIRUS
Birx recalls 'very difficult' call with Trump, says hundreds of thousands of Covid deaths were preventable
"I look at it this way: The first time, we have an excuse." Birx said about the initial surge of deaths. "All of the rest of them, in my mind, could have been mitigated or decreased substantially."

TAP TO UNMUTE
March 28, 2021, 12:39 PM PDT
By Allan Smith
Deborah Birx, who served as White House coronavirus response coordinator under former President Donald Trump, described an 'uncomfortable' call between the two after following an August interview with CNN in which she discussed the threat posed by Covid-19.

"Well, I think you've heard other conversations that people have posted with the president," Birx said as part of a CNN documentary “Covid War: The Pandemic Doctors Speak Out," which is airing in full Sunday evening. "I would say it was even more direct than what people have heard. It was very uncomfortable, very direct and very difficult to hear."


In this segment, which CNN released Sunday, Birx was asked if she was threatened in the call.

"I would say it was a very uncomfortable conversation," she said.

In an earlier clip released by CNN, Birx said the Trump administration could have prevented hundreds of thousands of Covid-19 deaths had it acted more forcefully to mitigate the pandemic.

"I look at it this way: The first time, we have an excuse. There were about 100,000 deaths that came from that original surge," Birx said. "All of the rest of them, in my mind, could have been mitigated or decreased substantially."


The virus has killed more than 551,000 Americans, according to an NBC News tracker. The initial spring wave was followed by surges over the summer and winter, which proved to be the deadliest stretch.

Recommended

WHITE HOUSE
Many Trump voters are skeptical of the Covid-19 vaccines. This may be the way to convince them.
Within weeks of Covid-19 shutdown measures being put in place, Trump, who would later contract the virus and be hospitalized, began pushing for cities and states to reopen. He also pitched unproven treatments for the virus and questioned the need for wearing face coverings.

Birx, who has spoken out about her experience on Trump's coronavirus task force repeatedly in recent months, has taken heat for not being more critical while serving in that role. Last March, she praised Trump as being "so attentive to the scientific literature and the details and the data” with regards to the outbreak."

Such past commentary led to backlash over her latest remarks.






https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/birx-recalls-very-difficult-call-trump-says-hundreds-thousands-covid-n1262283


"The malicious incompetence that resulted in hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths starts at the top, with the former president and his enablers," Rep. Ted Lieu, D-Calif., tweeted. "And who was one of his enablers? Dr. Birx, who was afraid to challenge his unscientific rhetoric and wrongfully praised him."

She was also criticized last year for traveling during the Thanksgiving holiday weekend after warning Americans to avoid travel and gatherings with people outside their "immediate household.”

[GMDino]

(03-28-2021, 10:05 AM)Beaker Wrote: An important factor to wearing masks and getting vaccinated that is not being touted is the virus' ability to mutate into different strains....which we are already beginning to see.

The more hosts the virus can infect, the more opportunities it has to reproduce. The more opportunities it has to reproduce, the more chances it has to mutate.

Influenza is another virus that is a corona virus. There is a reason we need flu shots every year. That virus has been around humans for literally hundreds of years. It has had the opportunity to mutate into so many different variants, that all we can do is chase it and try to guess which variant will be prevalent each flu season.

The Covid corona virus is new to human hosts. If we can get enough people vaccinated to cut off its opportunity to reproduce, we can prevent it from establishing too many variants and having to have different Covid shots available each season.

I encourage everyone to get vaccinated to prevent this scenario.

Wait, so this image shared by a friend on FB isn't a good reason to ignore covid and to not get the vaccine?



Color me stunned.

[GMDino]

(03-28-2021, 07:43 PM)TheUberHuber Wrote: Linkedin
CORONAVIRUS
Birx recalls 'very difficult' call with Trump, says hundreds of thousands of Covid deaths were preventable
"I look at it this way: The first time, we have an excuse." Birx said about the initial surge of deaths. "All of the rest of them, in my mind, could have been mitigated or decreased substantially."

TAP TO UNMUTE
March 28, 2021, 12:39 PM PDT
By Allan Smith
Deborah Birx, who served as White House coronavirus response coordinator under former President Donald Trump, described an 'uncomfortable' call between the two after following an August interview with CNN in which she discussed the threat posed by Covid-19.

"Well, I think you've heard other conversations that people have posted with the president," Birx said as part of a CNN documentary “Covid War: The Pandemic Doctors Speak Out," which is airing in full Sunday evening. "I would say it was even more direct than what people have heard. It was very uncomfortable, very direct and very difficult to hear."


In this segment, which CNN released Sunday, Birx was asked if she was threatened in the call.

"I would say it was a very uncomfortable conversation," she said.

In an earlier clip released by CNN, Birx said the Trump administration could have prevented hundreds of thousands of Covid-19 deaths had it acted more forcefully to mitigate the pandemic.

"I look at it this way: The first time, we have an excuse. There were about 100,000 deaths that came from that original surge," Birx said. "All of the rest of them, in my mind, could have been mitigated or decreased substantially."


The virus has killed more than 551,000 Americans, according to an NBC News tracker. The initial spring wave was followed by surges over the summer and winter, which proved to be the deadliest stretch.

Recommended

WHITE HOUSE
Many Trump voters are skeptical of the Covid-19 vaccines. This may be the way to convince them.
Within weeks of Covid-19 shutdown measures being put in place, Trump, who would later contract the virus and be hospitalized, began pushing for cities and states to reopen. He also pitched unproven treatments for the virus and questioned the need for wearing face coverings.

Birx, who has spoken out about her experience on Trump's coronavirus task force repeatedly in recent months, has taken heat for not being more critical while serving in that role. Last March, she praised Trump as being "so attentive to the scientific literature and the details and the data” with regards to the outbreak."

Such past commentary led to backlash over her latest remarks.






https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/birx-recalls-very-difficult-call-trump-says-hundreds-thousands-covid-n1262283


"The malicious incompetence that resulted in hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths starts at the top, with the former president and his enablers," Rep. Ted Lieu, D-Calif., tweeted. "And who was one of his enablers? Dr. Birx, who was afraid to challenge his unscientific rhetoric and wrongfully praised him."

She was also criticized last year for traveling during the Thanksgiving holiday weekend after warning Americans to avoid travel and gatherings with people outside their "immediate household.”

Just another who was too afraid to speak up for fear of losing her job.  She should feel the weight of every death she thinks could have been prevented.  

[Mickeypoo]

(03-26-2021, 04:35 PM)fredtoast Wrote: There would be a larger decline if they were all wearing masks.

Sure Fred.  

I think it is more the media and Pols don't want it to be shown that no masks and no lockdowns are not much different from, let's say, The NY Nanny States.

[TheUberHuber]

(03-28-2021, 08:06 PM)GMDino Wrote: Just another who was too afraid to speak up for fear of losing her job.  She should feel the weight of every death she thinks could have been prevented.  

She is definitely complicit. What she is saying highlights Republicans faux outrage and overt hypocrisy. 

[fredtoast]

(03-29-2021, 02:42 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: Sure Fred.  

I think it is more the media and Pols don't want it to be shown that no masks and no lockdowns are not much different from, let's say, The NY Nanny States.

Then educated people know the huge differences between New York and Texas that effect rate of covid infection.

Only people who depend on the right-wing media for all their information think they are "not much different".

[GMDino]

This what is happening in my area. Yes, this is a friend of mine.