Coronavirus Information...who do you trust?

[*Nately120*]

(08-30-2020, 01:40 PM)BengalHawk62 Wrote: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm?fbclid=IwAR2-muRM3tB3uBdbTrmKwH1NdaBx6PpZo2kxotNwkUXlnbZXCwSRP2OmqsI


This week the CDC quietly updated the Covid number to admit that only 6% of all the 153,504 deaths recorded actually died from Covid.

That's 9,210 deaths.  

The other 94% had 2 to 3 other serious illnesses and the overwhelming majority were of very advanced age; 90% in nursing homes.

I guess neo-cons owe Andrew Cuomo an apology, then.

(08-30-2020, 02:16 PM)Von Cichlid Wrote: If voters think Biden is going to pay them to sit at home and social distance for 2 years, they are in for a rude awakening.

I'm pretty sure the assertion that democrats are going to pay people to sit around and do nothing is a key point of the republican platform, though.  Personally, I have a low-paying job that relates to national defense so I'm stuck carrying all your worthless butts.  You're welcome.

[Von Cichlid]

(08-30-2020, 04:12 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I guess neo-cons owe Andrew Cuomo an apology, then.



I'm pretty sure the assertion that democrats are going to pay people to sit around and do nothing is a key point of the republican platform, though.  Personally, I have a low-paying job that relates to national defense so I'm stuck carrying all your worthless butts.  You're welcome.

What do you do with national defense that is so low paying?  I appreciate your work in that area, seriously.

I was in the Army for 4 yrs, but that wound up being the most i had ever made at that time.

Edit: Well, Biden said he was ready and willing to shut it down if the "science" dictates, so I assume his voters figure that he will subsidize such a decision. Me, I don't think he will shut it down and I don't that he should either. However, that does not change the fact that Biden is running on the possibility of another long, paid sick day for everyone even if he is not actually going to provide it.

[*Nately120*]

(08-30-2020, 05:44 PM)Von Cichlid Wrote: What do you do with national defense that is so low paying?  I appreciate your work in that area, seriously.

I was in the Army for 4 yrs, but that wound up being the most i had ever made at that time.

Edit:  Well, Biden said he was ready and willing to shut it down if the "science" dictates, so I assume his voters figure that he will subsidize such a decision.  Me, I don't think he will shut it down and I don't that he should either.  However, that does not change the fact that Biden is running on the possibility of another long, paid sick day for everyone even if he is not actually going to provide it.

I just digitally push papers for people looking to get security clearances, so I'm in my basement more than Biden, I guess.  Hardy har.  I can't say I blame Biden for running on "I'm going to listen to science" since it is seen as the opposite of the Trump plan of attack.  

Americans are an interesting breed since they'll gladly cash their own government handout check while stewing over how many people who got the same check don't deserve it like they do.  But it is just standard practice for politicians to promise free stuff.

[Von Cichlid]

(08-30-2020, 06:00 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I just digitally push papers for people looking to get security clearances, so I'm in my basement more than Biden, I guess.  Hardy har.  I can't say I blame Biden for running on "I'm going to listen to science" since it is seen as the opposite of the Trump plan of attack.  

Americans are an interesting breed since they'll gladly cash their own government handout check while stewing over how many people who got the same check don't deserve it like they do.  But it is just standard practice for politicians to promise free stuff.

So you're the reason I couldn't get my clearance and had to be infantry instead of ammunition specialist!  


To be clear, I understand Biden didn't promise subsidization of another shutdown, but the precedent has been totally set.  I can imagine that would be the main reason that anyone in their right mind would support another shut down, the fact that they think it will not hurt them financially and that they may even benefit from it.  

[*Nately120*]

(08-30-2020, 06:08 PM)Von Cichlid Wrote: So you're the reason I couldn't get my clearance and had to be infantry instead of ammunition specialist!  

I'm not the reason you couldn't get your clearance, you're the reason you couldn't get your clearance.

(08-30-2020, 06:08 PM)Von Cichlid Wrote: To be clear, I understand Biden didn't promise subsidization of another shutdown, but the precedent has been totally set.  I can imagine that would be the main reason that anyone in their right mind would support another shut down, the fact that they think it will not hurt them financially and that they may even benefit from it.  

I hear ya.  Biden is a middle of the road boring politician so if he gets elected all sort of things could grind to a rather boring halt, so maybe that's a plus.

[Von Cichlid]

(08-30-2020, 06:10 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I hear ya.  Biden is a middle of the road boring politician so if he gets elected all sort of things could grind to a rather boring halt, so maybe that's a plus.

-I failed a drug test (weed) on my first attempt to join, so that was it I'm sure.  I made it all the way through AIT and then had to change jobs 6 months in.


What you say about Biden may be the best analysis of what his presidency would look like I've heard yet.

We would be back to growth like we saw under Obama, except maybe slightly less.  The daily fire works that every body is sick of would subside, and that would be a plus, but it would only be because the msm is not inflaming it.

The major problem is that China is a real threat to us.  As bad as many nations may feel about the USA, us being the number one power in the world is a lot better for everyone involved than if it were China, I would think.  We can not stagnate for another 8 years (and this went on well before Obama) and outsource manufacturing infrastructure to them.  

If there is one positive to Trump's term that the whole world can see, it is that he opened the eyes of the world to China's intentions and really did put a dent in their trajectory.  That took some real nerve that no one before him had. 

[Von Cichlid]

(08-30-2020, 03:54 PM)Dill Wrote: On the other hand, If the pandemic is still with us in January/February, and Biden is president, I'm pretty sure you'll see a national policy similar to that taken by European countries, with clear and consistent messaging from the whitehouse regardng research, needed precautions, etc. 

Biden's policy will be driven by a medical consensus on the proper means of fighting the pandemic, not a divisive re-election strategy. Media coverage of that response will indeed be less critical of it response to Trump's handling of the pandemic.

The European countries had the advantage of a msm that was not trying to subvert the presidency, so naturally they handled it less chaotically than we did.  You seem like a very even keeled person to me, much more than myself even, so I cant believe that you would possibly think that the media disagreed with Trump in good faith on all of this.  If Trump wanted A, the media demanded B.

As I have said, a silver lining of Biden winning would be that the onslaught of the msm would cease.  

[GMDino]

Irony is dead.

I died of covid but here’s why it’s not as bad as you’re hearing pic.twitter.com/W0dJpYjBLG

— kilgore trout, non ass-talker (@KT_So_It_Goes) August 31, 2020

 

[GMDino]

(08-30-2020, 06:56 PM)Von Cichlid Wrote: The European countries had the advantage of a msm that was not trying to subvert the presidency, so naturally they handled it less chaotically than we did.  You seem like a very even keeled person to me, much more than myself even, so I cant believe that you would possibly think that the media disagreed with Trump in good faith on all of this.  If Trump wanted A, the media demanded B.

As I have said, a silver lining of Biden winning would be that the onslaught of the msm would cease.  

Just curious how it is the fault of "the media" for how the POTUS handled the pandemic?

They didn't thrown out the plan to handle it he was given.
They didn't dismantle the team put together to handle it he was given.

The "media" reported what Trump did and said and how it wasn't working and/or went against what the science at the time was saying.

Maybe Trump should accept a least some of the blame?

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(08-30-2020, 01:40 PM)BengalHawk62 Wrote: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm?fbclid=IwAR2-muRM3tB3uBdbTrmKwH1NdaBx6PpZo2kxotNwkUXlnbZXCwSRP2OmqsI


This week the CDC quietly updated the Covid number to admit that only 6% of all the 153,504 deaths recorded actually died from Covid.

That's 9,210 deaths.

The other 94% had 2 to 3 other serious illnesses and the overwhelming majority were of very advanced age; 90% in nursing homes.

It is really sad to see the CDC misused to carry water for the Trump campaign like this.

[GMDino]

(08-31-2020, 01:21 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: It is really sad to see the CDC misused to carry water for the Trump campaign like this.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/twitter-removes-trump-tweet-false-coronavirus-statistics/?fbclid=IwAR26RE_NvzfmqZJoJ9WzbWKZc4Rc__UzqWwm5habHRTh4S2PrCMRJ6wPOBQ

Quote:Washington — Twitter on Sunday removed a tweet shared by President Trump that contained false information about coronavirus statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), with the company saying it violated its rules.


The tweet was originally posted by Twitter user "Mel Q," a supporter of the unfounded QAnon conspiracy theory, and retweeted by Mr. Trump on Sunday. The post claimed the CDC "quietly updated the Covid number" to show a small fraction of all deaths — 6% — from the coronavirus were "actually" a result of COVID-19, the disease caused by the novel coronavirus. The vast majority of deaths, the post claimed, were because of "other serious illnesses."


The tweet was taken down, and a message from Twitter says it's "no longer available because it violated the Twitter Rules."


Another tweet from Jenna Ellis, a senior legal adviser to the Trump campaign, that promoted the same false claim about the CDC's statistics and was retweeted by Mr. Trump remains on the site. 

The information removed by Twitter appears to stem from provisional death counts for the coronavirus that was updated August 26 and listed underlying health conditions among those killed by the virus. According to the CDC, "for 6% of the deaths, COVID-19 was the only cause mentioned. For deaths with conditions or causes in addition to COVID-19, on average, there were 2.6 additional conditions or causes per death."

In the United States, the number of confirmed coronavirus cases is nearing 6 million, and more than 183,000 people have died, according to Johns Hopkins University.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

The US now has approximately 183K Covid deaths since the pandemic began. That total represents almost three 747s crashing and killing all passengers everyday since the first death in the US from Covid.

If almost three 747s were crashing each day for six months in a row do you think our government’s response would be more robust? Or do you think they would let each state figure it out for themselves?

If three 747s were crashing everyday, do you think people would claim it’s main stream media fear mongering?

Would the president claim it’s the Democrat’s new hoax?

Would all the planes stop crashing the day after the election?

[Big Boss]

"15 cases soon to be down to 0."

"It'll just go away, like a miracle."

[Von Cichlid]

(08-31-2020, 12:13 PM)GMDino Wrote: Just curious how it is the fault of "the media" for how the POTUS handled the pandemic?

They didn't thrown out the plan to handle it he was given.
They didn't dismantle the team put together to handle it he was given.

The "media" reported what Trump did and said and how it wasn't working and/or went against what the science at the time was saying.

Maybe Trump should accept a least some of the blame?

I don't know anything that Trump could've done do that would make the msm happy.

Weld people in their houses like China?  Blockade NYC and Seattle with the military to prevent people from entering and leaving?  Yeah, the msm would go right along with that.  They sh!t bricks when he prevented incoming flights from afflicted countries, there is no way they would tolerate any heavier hand that what he already had.


Let me ask you this:  What are some specific things that you or Hillary would have done different?

Don't just say vague platitudes like "Listen to the science!" or "Wear a mask and present a unified message!"  The science changed daily in the early months and there hasn't been anything unified since 2003 in this country.

What are some specific, quantifiable things that you would have done differently?

[*bfine32*]

(08-31-2020, 01:21 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: It is really sad to see the CDC misused to carry water for the Trump campaign like this.

It's equally sad to see folks try to blame all this on one person. 

[Von Cichlid]

(08-31-2020, 06:06 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: The US now has approximately 183K Covid deaths since the pandemic began. That total represents almost three 747s crashing and killing all passengers everyday since the first death in the US from Covid.

If almost three 747s were crashing each day for six months in a row do you think our government’s response would be more robust? Or do you think they would let each state figure it out for themselves?

If three 747s were crashing everyday, do you think people would claim it’s main stream media fear mongering?

Would the president claim it’s the Democrat’s new hoax?

Would all the planes stop crashing the day after the election?

What more of a response do you want?  

We've tested more than almost any country out there.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104645/covid19-testing-rate-select-countries-worldwide/

We've given every unemployed person an extra 2400 a month for 5 months.  What other nation of 330,000,000 is doing that?  Would $4800 had done the trick?

Fact of the matter is that people are running away in droves from the big cities who made the heavy handed response like you Dems are asking for.  

[Von Cichlid]

(08-31-2020, 06:22 PM)Big Boss Wrote: "15 cases soon to be down to 0."

"It'll just go away, like a miracle."

"Go hug a Chinese person."

"Protests are safe, but churches are unsafe."

"You can walk on the water, but not the sand!"

[*Nately120*]

(08-31-2020, 09:05 PM)bfine32 Wrote: It's equally sad to see folks try to blame all this on one person. 

The buck stops elsewhere. 

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(08-31-2020, 09:05 PM)bfine32 Wrote: It's equally sad to see folks try to blame all this on one person. 

No one is blaming all this on Trump. That’s pure hyperbole. But, Trump is 100% responsible for his response. But, you’ve been told this before.

[*jason*]

(08-31-2020, 09:10 PM)Von Cichlid Wrote: "Go hug a Chinese person."

"Protests are safe, but churches are unsafe."

"You can walk on the water, but not the sand!"

Who said the first one?

And does the Chinese person have to consent?... Also; what if I think they're Chinese, but it turns out they're Korean?