Ephesians 6:5

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(06-22-2020, 09:40 AM)michaelsean Wrote: This is Paul writing and giving instructions to slaves. Everyone thinks Jesus came to change the world. To make it a better place. That ain’t his primary purpose. His primary purpose was to save the individual. Although my thoughts are more along the line of He came to advance the individual. There is no saving necessary. But that’s a whole nother topic.

But, isn’t the Bible the word of god or at least his teachings?

[*michaelsean*]

(06-22-2020, 11:43 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: But, isn’t the Bible the word of god or at least his teachings?

To me no, but there still is no hypocrisy for those who believe it.  Jesus didn't come here to end slavery or misery.  Now if people actually followed His teachings, and I think the bible jumbles those up as well,  a lot of misery would be minimized as a result.  But Jesus is all about the individual.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(06-22-2020, 12:52 PM)michaelsean Wrote: To me no, but there still is no hypocrisy for those who believe it.  Jesus didn't come here to end slavery or misery.  Now if people actually followed His teachings, and I think the bible jumbles those up as well,  a lot of misery would be minimized as a result.  But Jesus is all about the individual.

To save us from sin, right?

[*michaelsean*]

(06-22-2020, 01:19 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: To save us from sin, right?

If you are taking the traditional Christian view then yes. And I know your next question. Isn’t slavery a sin? He doesn’t spend a lot of time singling our specific sins. The golden rule covers it pretty well. The beatitudes doesn’t a pretty good job.

[*michaelsean*]

The other things are these letters from Paul are written to specific groups of people. So it’s addressing their issues.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(06-22-2020, 01:31 PM)michaelsean Wrote: If you are taking the traditional Christian view then yes. And I know your next question. Isn’t slavery a sin? He doesn’t spend a lot of time singling our specific sins. The golden rule covers it pretty well. The beatitudes doesn’t a pretty good job.

I don’t think slavery is a sin according to the Bible. But, in my opinion, I think it should be. I think slavery is more immoral than some of the Ten Commandments.

Who decides what is or isn’t a sin? God, correct? If you sin you go to hell. Jesus came to save us. Save us from what? Our sin. Who decides what is sin? God. If Jesus didn’t come to make the world a better place, but rather to save the individual; why did god create sin? If god wasn’t trying to make the world a better place with teachings such as murder is a sin, then what was god doing?

I just question the moral authority of a god who would damn me for taking his name in vain, but gives tacit approval to slavery by instructing slaves to obey their masters. I don’t understand the logic.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(06-22-2020, 01:38 PM)michaelsean Wrote: The other things are these letters from Paul are written to specific groups of people. So it’s addressing their issues.

I get that. Paul’s letters. But, who inspired the words? God or the Holy Spirit. They aren’t Paul’s words, but god’s word. Paul was just the scribe, not really the author. Kinda like a medical scribe dictating what the doctor wants in the patient’s chart.

I don’t think everyone believes that so it just makes it more confusing for me to understand.

[*michaelsean*]

(06-22-2020, 01:52 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: I don’t think slavery is a sin according to the Bible. But, in my opinion, I think it should be. I think slavery is more immoral than some of the Ten Commandments.

Who decides what is or isn’t a sin?  God, correct? If you sin you go to hell. Jesus came to save us. Save us from what?  Our sin. Who decides what is sin? God. If Jesus didn’t come to make the world a better place, but rather to save the individual; why did god create sin? If god wasn’t trying to make the world a better place with teachings such as murder is a sin, then what was god doing?

I just question the moral authority of a god who would damn me for taking his name in vain, but gives tacit approval to slavery by instructing slaves to obey their masters. I don’t understand the logic.

You are asking a lot of questions in which I agree.  I have my beliefs and there are the Christian beliefs.  Some things don't make a lot of sense.  
We are sent here knowing literally nothing, and are told to figure it all out in 80 years if we are lucky, (much less time over most of our history history) or spend eternity suffering. That's ridiculous.  
I love you, but I I may feel the need to torture you for eternity.  
If God wants everyone to go to heaven, then it's impossible that they don't.  
God would never need us to constantly tell Him how great He is.  I mean that's some serious ego-maniacal shit right there.

[Belsnickel]

(06-22-2020, 02:04 PM)michaelsean Wrote: God would never need us to constantly tell Him how great He is.  I mean that's some serious ego-maniacal shit right there.

Well, that comes from Judaism's polytheistic days. They believed in more than one god up until their exile in Babylon.

[*michaelsean*]

(06-22-2020, 02:10 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Well, that comes from Judaism's polytheistic days. They believed in more than one god up until their exile in Babylon.

I can see that.  The Norse all had their favorite god.  But it's been 5000 years or something people.  

[Belsnickel]

(06-22-2020, 02:13 PM)michaelsean Wrote: I can see that.  The Norse all had their favorite god.  But it's been 5000 years or something people.  

Roughly 2600 years. The construction of the second temple was around 537 BCE, which marked the return of the Jews from their exile. This was the start of Zoroastrian influenced Judaism where they ditched the other gods.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

Bible is meant to be taken contextually, not literally.

This has been taught in Catholic Schools for centuries, come on now.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(06-22-2020, 02:41 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Bible is meant to be taken contextually, not literally.

This has been taught in Catholic Schools for centuries, come on now.

Not all Christians subscribe to that belief.

[Lucidus]

(06-22-2020, 02:41 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Bible is meant to be taken contextually, not literally.

This has been taught in Catholic Schools for centuries, come on now.

The Bible is a collection of allegory. Unfortunately, far too many still believe that is literal, in whole or part. 

[Arturo Bandini]

The Bible is a projection of what we are doing. : Manifesting suffering in our reality which is basically what God did by creating us because he doesn't like how his creation behave.

If you write a poem and you don't like 2 or 3 lines, you can yell at it, curse it, burn it forever, it will be your lines whatever.

If I draw a dude with a knife in his hands ... who's the murderer ? The dude or the designer ?

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(06-22-2020, 03:29 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Not all Christians subscribe to that belief.

(06-22-2020, 03:35 PM)Lucidus Wrote: The Bible is a collection of allegory. Unfortunately, far too many still believe that is literal, in whole or part. 

Sadly

[Lucidus]

(06-22-2020, 03:49 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: If I draw a dude with a knife in his hands ... who's the murderer ? The dude or the designer ?

It depends on what you believe about the capabilities and foreknowledge of the designer as whether they're complicit or not.

[Arturo Bandini]

(06-22-2020, 04:14 PM)Lucidus Wrote: It depends on what you believe about the capabilities and foreknowledge of the designer as whether they're complicit or not.

If you are not omniscient you are not God unless he has no clue what he's doing which is basically a central point in all religions.

He created Satan with megasuperpowers and then he will blame you for being tempted ...

[Lucidus]

(06-22-2020, 04:47 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: If you are not omniscient you are not God unless he has no clue what he's doing which is basically a central point in all religions.

He created Satan with megasuperpowers and then he will blame you for being tempted ...

In that case, the designer is necessarily complicit.

[fredtoast]

How about this for an explanation.

The Bible is not the word of an omnipotent god because an amnipotent god would find slavery immoral and an abomination. So instead the Bible is just the words of men who claimed (and might even have believeed) that they were inspired by an omnipotent god.