Good Night Irene

[fredtoast]

(10-23-2018, 06:54 PM)bfine32 Wrote: As I said: No one ever said the Left has a monopoly on it. But unfortunately.  "whataboutisim" excuses it for some.

No one says "whataboutism" excuses anything.  We are just responding to your constant one sided attack on the left.  If you really believe neither side has a monopoly why are you so obsessed with posting about how vile the left is?

I agree both sides use unpleasant tactics, so why don't we concentrate on policy and campaign positions.  Which party is currently the favorite of white supremacists?  All the anti-LGBT, anti-Muslim, and anti-Mexican groups are on your side.  

[Dill]

(10-23-2018, 06:54 PM)bfine32 Wrote: As I said: No one ever said the Left has a monopoly on it. But unfortunately.  "whataboutisim" excuses it for some.

Ha ha, when asked for an example of "it", you reach for . . . ?

Whataboutists are interested in stalling or paralyzing accountability.

I think there is some value in addressing, empirically, the question of which "side" is more intolerant.  

Starting from the top down.

[*bfine32*]

(10-23-2018, 07:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No one says "whataboutism" excuses anything.  We are just responding to your constant one sided attack on the left.  If you really believe neither side has a monopoly why are you so obsessed with posting about how vile the left is?

I agree both sides use unpleasant tactics, so why don't we concentrate on policy and campaign positions.  Which party is currently the favorite of white supremacists?  All the anti-LGBT, anti-Muslim, and anti-Mexican groups are on your side.  

And your side is against freedom of speech, religious freedoms and stopping illegal entry into our sovereign nation. Absolutely no "whataboutisim" there. 

I've already pointing out why and you have done nothing but solidify since I have. 

[Dill]

(10-23-2018, 07:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No one says "whataboutism" excuses anything.  We are just responding to your constant one sided attack on the left.  If you really believe neither side has a monopoly why are you so obsessed with posting about how vile the left is?

I agree both sides use unpleasant tactics, so why don't we concentrate on policy and campaign positions.  Which party is currently the favorite of white supremacists?  All the anti-LGBT, anti-Muslim, and anti-Mexican groups are on your side.  

Oh yeah--well WHATABOUT all the groups INTOLERANT of anti-LGBT, anti-Muslim, and anti-Mexican groups?

They are all on "the left."  So it balances out.

[Dill]

(10-23-2018, 07:17 PM)bfine32 Wrote: And your side is against freedom of speech, religious freedoms and stopping illegal entry into our sovereign nation. Absolutely no "whataboutisim" there. 

I've already pointing out why and you have done nothing but solidify since I have. 

Er, who is against "freedom of speech" and "religious freedoms"?  Like it was Obama who wanted to shut down presses and silence journalists and ban Muslims.

How does stopping brown people at the border flip into "tolerance" or whatever you are trying to make of that.

[fredtoast]

(10-23-2018, 07:17 PM)bfine32 Wrote: And your side is against religious freedoms 

The left is not against any "religious freedoms".  The left is in favor of equality.  However when it comes to Christianity the right sees "equality" as "oppression".  They believe that Christians are entitled to special treatment so much that treating them the same as everyone else seems like punishment to them.

[*bfine32*]

(10-23-2018, 07:16 PM)Dill Wrote: Ha ha, when asked for an example of "it", you reach for . . . ?

Whataboutists are interested in stalling or paralyzing accountability.

I think there is some value in addressing, empirically, the question of which "side" is more intolerant.  

Starting from the top down.

I asked for no example, I freely stated both sides do it; however, I don't excuse the Right's vile nature because of that of the Left (as your little meme tried to do).

I've said numerous times that no one should call a spouse's appearance into question and Ted had every right to punch Trump right in the face for posting such a vile picture. I suppose I could have tried to excuse it by posting a vile picture that the left had shared; but that's not me. 

[*bfine32*]

(10-23-2018, 07:21 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The left is not against any "religious freedoms".  The left is in favor of equality.  However when it comes to Christianity the right sees "equality" as "oppression".  They believe that Christians are entitled to special treatment so much that treating them the same as everyone else seems like punishment to them.

Of course they are not; fortunately, SCOTUS has had a different view on the matter lately. I have no doubt that you think you are all about awesome stuff and the opposition is all about bad stuff. My reply was just to illustrate there are 2 sides to every coin. 

[fredtoast]

(10-23-2018, 07:22 PM)bfine32 Wrote:  I suppose I could have tried to excuse it by posting a vile picture that the left had shared; but that's not me. 

Is this supposed to be a joke?  YOU were the one who started this discussion with this snarky comment.

(10-22-2018, 07:30 PM)bfine32 Wrote: One of the things that always makes me wonder as I drive around is when I see all those Just Be Kind signs in folk's yard. I wonder how many of our open-minded Left friends on here have one in their yard. 

You are obsessed with attacking the left for "vile" behavior.  In this case there would have been no "whatabout" posts if you had not started it all yourself.

[fredtoast]

(10-23-2018, 07:20 PM)Dill Wrote: Er, who is against "freedom of speech"

Bfine is proving that the right is not the party of bigotry and hatred by pointing out that their right to spew bigoted hate speech is being challenged.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(10-23-2018, 07:18 PM)Dill Wrote: Oh yeah--well WHATABOUT all the groups INTOLERANT of anti-LGBT, anti-Muslim, and anti-Mexican groups?

They are all on "the left."  So it balances out.

I dunno about that. When was the last time you heard about a Republican throwing homosexuals off the roof of a very tall buildings simply because they were gay?

No one is anti-Mexican. We are Pro-LEGAL immigrants, and anti-ILLEGAL immigrants.
I have no issues with anyone in the LGBT Community as long as they are decent people, same with Muslims.

Muslims that bring the hate and murder their daughters because their daughters have disgraced them are the ones I hate.

You know, like that Professor that dragged his niece from her College Classroom by her hair cause she wasn't wearing her burka a couple years back. The ones that believe the women are 'Property" are the ones I don't like either.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(10-23-2018, 07:34 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Bfine is proving that the right is not the party of bigotry and hatred by pointing out that their right to spew bigoted hate speech is being challenged.

Everyone in the US has the right to say what they want to Fred.

Doesn't mean I support them or their way of thinking, that is if I even pay attention to them in the first place.

But you keep paying attention to them, so therefore they will never fade into obscurity.

It's same with Trump, positive or negative reactions, doesn't matter, as long as you are still listening to him and making him relevant he will not quiet down.

[fredtoast]

(10-23-2018, 07:41 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: No one is anti-Mexican. We are Pro-LEGAL immigrants, and anti-ILLEGAL immigrants.

Actually lots of people are anti-Mexican.  And that is why Trump made them into disease ridden criminals instead of just addressing the economic impact of illegal immigration.  He knew what would get more results with his base.

And trump is NOT Pro-legal immigration.  He wants to greatly reduce the number of legal immigrants.  He wants to make America white again.

I respect your views but don't use the word "we" to describe Trump's base.  There is a reason there were confederate flags at his rallies and all the white supremacists love him.  They used to hide behind masks, but having Trump as their president has emboldened them.  He has given them legitimacy with comments about how there were "good people" marching through Charlottesville chanting "Soil and blood".

[fredtoast]

(10-23-2018, 07:41 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: I dunno about that. When was the last time you heard about a Republican throwing homosexuals off the roof of a very tall buildings simply because they were gay?

I have heard plenty of Republicans say it is okay to discriminate against them and deny them equal protection under the law.

You don't have to kill a person to be cruel and bigoted.

[Dill]

(10-23-2018, 07:41 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: I dunno about that. When was the last time you heard about a Republican throwing homosexuals off the roof of a very tall buildings simply because they were gay?

No one is anti-Mexican. We are Pro-LEGAL immigrants, and anti-ILLEGAL immigrants.
I have no issues with anyone in the LGBT Community as long as they are decent people, same with Muslims.

Muslims that bring the hate and murder their daughters because their daughters have disgraced them are the ones I hate.

You know, like that Professor that dragged his niece from her College Classroom by her hair cause she wasn't wearing her burka a couple years back. The ones that believe the women are 'Property" are the ones I don't like either.

Gosh Mike, does "throwing homosexuals off the roof of very tall buildings" have to be the standard?  If it is the death penalty for gays, we can certainly find Republicans support for that. https://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/16/opinion/campaign-stops/ted-cruz-and-the-anti-gay-pastor.html
The pastor in question was also one of the drivers of Uganda's "Kill the Gays" legislation.https://www.advocate.com/news/daily-news/2011/05/09/antigay-uganda-bill-nears-vote.

And you should be careful of deploying the pronoun "we." Perhaps you, personally, are not anti-Mexican, but some of "you" certainly are. Starting with your leader. This video gives some indication of how a segment of the Trump base view even "legal" Mexicans. http://www.latinorebels.com/2018/08/04/realsourceofantimexicansentiment/

What do you make of Christians who murder "disgraced" daughters?
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/maine-pastor-leaves-rehab-kills-daughter-article-1.2905994
Do you hate Christians who "bring the hate" like that?

Your defense of women is admirable, but how serious can it really be if it dissolves into support for the Misogynist-in-chief?

[Dill]

(10-23-2018, 08:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: And trump is NOT Pro-legal immigration.  He wants to greatly reduce the number of legal immigrants.  He wants to make America white again.

This is not correct, Fred. Trump is absolutely pro-legal immigration--from Norway.

[*bfine32*]

Kudos to Gladys Knight
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/gladys-knight-defends-decision-sing-anthem-super-bowl-face-criticism-200659397.html

Quote:“I understand that Mr. Kaepernick is protesting two things, and they are police violence and injustice,” Knight, a seven-time Grammy winner and Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductee, told Variety. “It is unfortunate that our national anthem has been dragged into this debate when the distinctive senses of the national anthem and fighting for justice should each stand alone.”

Of course it didn't stop people from responding with hate.

[HarleyDog]

(08-13-2018, 06:07 PM)bengalguy71 Wrote: https://youtu.be/SmWbGaT1jNY

For me, it's like Whitey Herzog used to say, "It's time to piss on the fire and call in the dogs!"

Still haven’t received a call?

[Au165]

/zombiethread

[fredtoast]

(01-21-2019, 07:07 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Of course it didn't stop people from responding with hate.

Brilliant analysis, Sherlock. No matter what she said some people would have responded with hate.  If she had refused to sing the anthem then she would have been villified by the other side.