Hell just froze over.

[SunsetBengal]

Yes, the day that many thought would never happen is upon us. Today, SunsetBengal actually agrees with an idea proposed by a Liberal Politician.

http://www.truckersnews.com/sen-warren-veterans-ought-to-get-driving-jobs-more-easily/

Quote:Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Massachusetts) said veterans ought to be able to move into civilian jobs similar to those they performed while in uniform without additional training and without the expense of extensive paperwork. - See more at: http://www.truckersnews.com/sen-warren-veterans-ought-to-get-driving-jobs-more-easily/#sthash.DnQCMsGa.dpuf

Quote:Warren said she does not want to change or lower civilian certification standards, but, “It seems to me America spends hundreds of millions of dollars each year to train our service members to do these highly skilled jobs. We train them to do these jobs with precision, to do them without mistakes, to do them in active combat situations and I believe they should be able to move into civilian life with those certifications. What concerns me right now is that too many service members are being roped into expensive credentialing programs by predatory for-profit colleges that are looking to get ahold of those military benefits and make a profit off them.” - See more at: http://www.truckersnews.com/sen-warren-veterans-ought-to-get-driving-jobs-more-easily/#sthash.DnQCMsGa.dpuf

Save the jokes and insults, as posting this required a bit of humble on my part. All smacks aside, she makes perfect sense. We have way too many US Veterans that are struggling to mesh into civilian life, we owe it to them to use their training and expertise to do the jobs that they were trained to do, free of jumping through lower hoops.

[Dill]

(02-16-2017, 08:27 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Yes, the day that many thought would never happen is upon us.  Today, SunsetBengal actually agrees with an idea proposed by a Liberal Politician.  

http://www.truckersnews.com/sen-warren-veterans-ought-to-get-driving-jobs-more-easily/


Save the jokes and insults, as posting this required a bit of humble on my part.  All smacks aside, she makes perfect sense.  We have way too many US Veterans that are struggling to mesh into civilian life, we owe it to them to use their training and expertise to do the jobs that they were trained to do, free of jumping through lower hoops.

Brrrrrrr! I'ts chilly in here, but I stand with you on this one Sunset.

There are a lot of super competent people trained in the military. And they often have to perform under exacting conditions.  How could driving truck in Afghanistan NOT qualify someone for driving in the U.S.?

Also Warren slams the predatory for-profit colleges that suck up tuition assistance from servicemen.  

[SunsetBengal]

(02-16-2017, 08:36 PM)Dill Wrote: Brrrrrrr! I'ts chilly in here, but I stand with you on this one Sunset.

There are a lot of super competent people trained in the military. And they often have to perform under exacting conditions.  How could driving truck in Afghanistan NOT qualify someone for driving in the U.S.?

Also Warren slams the predatory for-profit colleges that suck up tuition assistance from servicemen.  

It's not just truck drivers that she's pulling for, but ship captains, air traffic controllers, and a whole host of other skilled positions.

[xxlt]

(02-16-2017, 08:27 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Yes, the day that many thought would never happen is upon us.  Today, SunsetBengal actually agrees with an idea proposed by a Liberal Politician.  

http://www.truckersnews.com/sen-warren-veterans-ought-to-get-driving-jobs-more-easily/





Save the jokes and insults, as posting this required a bit of humble on my part.  All smacks aside, she makes perfect sense.  We have way too many US Veterans that are struggling to mesh into civilian life, we owe it to them to use their training and expertise to do the jobs that they were trained to do, free of jumping through lower hoops.

She makes sense about a lot more than that. Give her a chance. You might be surprised. You might end up liking her as much as I always liked Chuck Hagel. Kudos to you for agreeing with her on this issue and sharing it.

[xxlt]

(02-16-2017, 08:39 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: It's not just truck drivers that she's pulling for, but ship captains, air traffic controllers, and a whole host of other skilled positions.

Phlebotomists is one example I know of...

[Benton]

A friend of mine is a state rep. He's pretty involved with a program as Ft. Campbell where they train servicemen to be pipe fitters. From my understanding, it doesn't matter what you did in the Army, they'll get you an apprenticeship and a good job when your service is over.

Would love to see more of that kind of program. For a lot of guys, the skills they learn serving the country don't translate well into anything except law enforcement and maybe running a day care.

[SunsetBengal]

(02-16-2017, 08:45 PM)Benton Wrote: A friend of mine is a state rep. He's pretty involved with a program as Ft. Campbell where they train servicemen to be pipe fitters. From my understanding, it doesn't matter what you did in the Army, they'll get you an apprenticeship and a good job when your service is over.

Would love to see more of that kind of program. For a lot of guys, the skills they learn serving the country don't translate well into anything except law enforcement and maybe running a day care.

I agree, that is an excellent program.  You are correct, besides LEO, there aren't a ton of jobs requiring the skills of an infantryman.  Back to the Pipe Fitter's apprenticeship that your friend is involved with, perhaps some of those guys can get preferred selection on Trump's plan to move forward with both the Keystone and Dakota pipelines.

[SunsetBengal]

(02-16-2017, 08:42 PM)xxlt Wrote: Phlebotomists is one example I know of...

That is another great example.  I know jack squat of medical professions and their required skills.  I think that there is another member of this board with both Military experience, as well as a comprehensive medical knowledge.

[Belsnickel]

(02-16-2017, 08:42 PM)xxlt Wrote: Phlebotomists is one example I know of...

It's the case for a lot of the medical folks. A medic in any branch has the knowledge/skill base of of an NREMTP, and often an LPN at least for the hospital setting. Yet when they come out they have no cert. They have to start all over on training.

[hollodero]

(02-16-2017, 08:27 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Save the jokes and insults, as posting this required a bit of humble on my part.  All smacks aside, she makes perfect sense. 

Why would anyone be insulting? If any, you proved to be able to think in non-partisan lines, which should earn you nothing but respect.

[HarleyDog]

It has been nothing less than depressing and many times drastic in the transition from military life to civilian life. This would be awesome.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

Sounds like the kind of logical and sensible productive ideas that I like to see the government working on.

[CKwi88]

If only we had a presidential candidate who had made this part of their platform....

[*wildcats forever*]

(02-16-2017, 08:27 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Yes, the day that many thought would never happen is upon us.  Today, SunsetBengal actually agrees with an idea proposed by a Liberal Politician.  

http://www.truckersnews.com/sen-warren-veterans-ought-to-get-driving-jobs-more-easily/





Save the jokes and insults, as posting this required a bit of humble on my part.  All smacks aside, she makes perfect sense.  We have way too many US Veterans that are struggling to mesh into civilian life, we owe it to them to use their training and expertise to do the jobs that they were trained to do, free of jumping through lower hoops.

No jokes or insults due imho. Good ideas know no boundaries; just looking for the right time to be relevant. Keep searching for what is sensible, my friend.

[Dill]

(02-16-2017, 08:39 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: It's not just truck drivers that she's pulling for, but ship captains, air traffic controllers, and a whole host of other skilled positions.

I know.  Lots of computer programmers and mechanics too. Not to mention all kinds of engineers (Redhorse, etc.) And not to mention paramedics and nurses. 6 months in A-stan = 10 years of experience in a trauma facility in a major city in the US.

Then there is the experience of being responsible for people working under you on missions that count for something.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(02-16-2017, 09:00 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I agree, that is an excellent program.  You are correct, besides LEO, there aren't a ton of jobs requiring the skills of an infantryman.  Back to the Pipe Fitter's apprenticeship that your friend is involved with, perhaps some of those guys can get preferred selection on Trump's plan to move forward with both the Keystone and Dakota pipelines.

When I was an infantryman I was faced with the same decision, "What the hell am I gonna do when I get out?" Wondering what the hell I was going to do is one of the reasons why I joined the military.  I saw many transition into law enforcement, private security, or education (specifically physical education.). I didn't want to do any of that. (Lot of fire fighters or EMTs and I might have chosen that path.) So I came up with a plan and with luck, hard work, and the help of others it worked out. Not everyone is as lucky. 

The Interservice Physician Assistant Program I completed trained us to the standards required to pass the civilian national certification board. Thus military PAs transition into the civilian sector easily because we're required to obtain civilian certifications.  If you check the top ortho clinic in your area I can all but guarantee there is a military trained PA on staff.

The top NCO of the Air Force testified the Air Force air traffic control training includes obtaining civilian certification while the Navy's training did not. That's a problem for the service member wanting to transition later. (Matter of fact, my niece's husband is an Army air traffic controller recently stationed in Germany. I'll have to ask him if his training includes civilian certification when I see him next.)

There is also the dilemma many military jobs don't have a civilian counterpart. Like an 18D or SF medic. They could easily do the job of an advanced EMT, but their training exceeds that of an EMT, but falls short of a NP, PA, or RN. 

So I see three areas of improvement. 1) The individual service member needs to have a plan for their transition. 2) Require military training to include civilian certification where applicable to assist the service member during their transition. 3) Develop a fast track system for civilian certifications for military jobs; like a CLEP system for CDL/DOT certification as an example. 

The Army has a program all soldiers are supposed to attend before they leave the service to teach job seeking skills. I was grateful for the assistance, but you only get out of it what you put into it as with everything in life. I was 38 at the time and took it seriously. Someone who is 22 may not. 

[Belsnickel]

(02-17-2017, 01:53 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: So I see three areas of improvement. 1) The individual service member needs to have a plan for their transition. 2) Require military training to include civilian certification where applicable to assist the service member during their transition. 3) Develop a fast track system for civilian certifications for military jobs; like a CLEP system for CDL/DOT certification as an example. 

The Army has a program all soldiers are supposed to attend before they leave the service to teach job seeking skills. I was grateful for the assistance, but you only get out of it what you put into it as with everything in life. I was 38 at the time and took it seriously. Someone who is 22 may not. 

That part in bold is something I never really understood as to why it never happened, but from looking at some information is may be different from when I was looking at it 15 years ago, I don't know. But it seemed pretty simple to me that a 68W, or an 18D for that matter, would qualify for an NREMT-P certification given their ATLS, ACLS, and PALS training. But someone I ran squad with was a discharged medic and he could only test for EMT-B, which amazed me because I was an EMT-I at the time and he was as knowledgeable as I was at least.

Edit: looks like that change occurred as they consolidated the 91s down to just 91W, and then changed it to 68W. Now the certification is mandatory. Interesting.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(02-17-2017, 10:46 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: That part in bold is something I never really understood as to why it never happened, but from looking at some information is may be different from when I was looking at it 15 years ago, I don't know. But it seemed pretty simple to me that a 68W, or an 18D for that matter, would qualify for an NREMT-P certification given their ATLS, ACLS, and PALS training. But someone I ran squad with was a discharged medic and he could only test for EMT-B, which amazed me because I was an EMT-I at the time and he was as knowledgeable as I was at least.

Edit: looks like that change occurred as they consolidated the 91s down to just 91W, and then changed it to 68W. Now the certification is mandatory. Interesting.

It comes down to simple economics. The civilian certifications add an extra layer of cost to military training. 

[*PhilHos*]

(02-16-2017, 08:27 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Yes, the day that many thought would never happen is upon us.  Today, SunsetBengal actually agrees with an idea proposed by a Liberal Politician.  

http://www.truckersnews.com/sen-warren-veterans-ought-to-get-driving-jobs-more-easily/





Save the jokes and insults, as posting this required a bit of humble on my part.  All smacks aside, she makes perfect sense.  We have way too many US Veterans that are struggling to mesh into civilian life, we owe it to them to use their training and expertise to do the jobs that they were trained to do, free of jumping through lower hoops.

Can't say I disagree with anything posted, other than my surprise on whom is proposing this.

(02-16-2017, 08:40 PM)xxlt Wrote: She makes sense about a lot more than that. Give her a chance. You might be surprised. You might end up liking her as much as I always liked Chuck Hagel. Kudos to you for agreeing with her on this issue and sharing it.

This is the first time I've ever "heard" her say anything sensible.

[SunsetBengal]

(02-17-2017, 11:50 AM)PhilHos Wrote: Can't say I disagree with anything posted, other than my surprise on whom is proposing this.


This is the first time I've ever "heard" her say anything sensible.

Yeah, I almost held out on posting this thread, as most of my views don't align with the Senator that I'm giving credit to.  However, despite anyone's differences in politics, beliefs or philosophies, I do think it important to at least try to find ideas that we can all agree on.  Senator Warren's position on helping Veterans attain civilian certification/licensing to perform jobs that they have already been doing is one of those ideas that I can get on board with.