Just a matter of time before Biden illegal immigrant killed somone

[GMDino]

(02-27-2024, 04:17 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: No, it had nothing t do with it, Trump's block expired 18 mos after it was signed, Jan 2021. Ibarra entered the US in Sep 2022, which is that 18th month. 

Biden's administration didn't enact Title 42 on them until October of 2022 so that executive order was still in place I guess.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/oct/20/venezuela-migrants-us-title-42

Quote:On 12 October, the Biden administration announced that it would deport Venezuelan migrants to Mexico, under a previously obscure public health law, Title 42, which was used for summary expulsions by the Trump administration and has been continued under Joe Biden. 


Venezuelans arriving at the southern border will no longer be able to join their families in the US while they wait their turn in the asylum process, but will be forced to languish in Mexico, where they are routinely targeted for rape, robbery and extortion.

The abrupt implementation of Title 42 for Venezuelans has created an arbitrary cutoff, and left tens of thousands to an uncertain future.

...

Critics of Title 42 say it represents a gutting of the right to request asylum for vulnerable people with few other options.

“Just at the moment that the Biden administration is fighting a lawsuit to try to end Title 42, they are also expanding it, which is just baffling. We’ve lost just about any pretense that this is a health measure. They are using a backdoor way to end the right to asylum,” said Adam Isacson, director of the Defense Oversight Program at the Washington Office on Latin America.

...

Nearly 7 million Venezuelans have fled economic collapse and political repression since 2018, most of them settling elsewhere in South America. But this year has seen an unprecedented surge of migrants from the country walking north.


In most recent years, the number of Venezuelans detained at the US southern border has been fewer than 100, but between November 2021 and September 2022, about 150,000 Venezuelans have made the dangerous journey over land to the US.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(02-27-2024, 04:46 PM)GMDino Wrote: Biden's administration didn't enact Title 42 on them until October of 2022 so that executive order was still in place I guess.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/oct/20/venezuela-migrants-us-title-42

But....entering the country and being arrested are two different dates.


Jose Ibarra entered the US in Sep 2022.

Jose Ibarra arrested by NYPD in Sept 2023.
So if Biden ended it in Oct 2022, then he should have not been protected any longer when he was arrested? 

[GMDino]

(02-27-2024, 08:32 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: But....entering the country and being arrested are two different dates.


Jose Ibarra entered the US in Sep 2022.

Jose Ibarra arrested by NYPD in Sept 2023.
So if Biden ended it in Oct 2022, then he should have not been protected any longer when he was arrested? 

And the deportations of Venezuelans under Biden began in earnest in October of 2023

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/immigration-venezuelan-arrivals-us-southern-border-biden-deportations/

Quote:The number of Venezuelans crossing the U.S.-Mexico border illegally dropped dramatically in October, when the Biden administration started deporting some migrants directly to crisis-stricken Venezuela, according to Customs and Border Protection (CBP) data published Tuesday.


Border Patrol agents apprehended 29,637 migrants from Venezuela who entered the U.S. without authorization last month, a 46% drop from September, when unlawful crossings by Venezuelans soared to 54,833, a monthly record high.


The Biden administration announced in early October it had reached a deportation agreement with the Venezuelan government, a U.S.-sanctioned regime that had long refused to accept the return of its citizens. Officials at the time vowed to deport those found to be ineligible for asylum or a temporary legal status the Biden administration offered to 472,000 Venezuelans who arrived before July 31.


On Oct. 18, U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) carried out its first-ever deportation flight to Venezuela. The agency has since staged weekly deportation flights there, deporting hundreds of Venezuelan adults under a process known as expedited removal.


Acting CBP Commissioner Troy Miller said the decrease in Venezuelan arrivals along the southern border was more pronounced after the deportation flights started.


"In conjunction with our resumption of removal flights to Venezuela consistent with delivering consequences for those who cross the border unlawfully, CBP saw a 65 percent decrease in southwest border encounters of Venezuelans in the second half of October, compared to the second half of September," Miller said in a statement.


Overall illegal entries along the southern border also decreased in October. Border Patrol apprehensions of migrants who entered the U.S. without legal permission dropped below 189,000 last month, a 14% decrease from nearly 219,000 in September.



Those tallies do not include legal entries under two programs the Biden administration created to disincentivize migrants from crossing into the country unlawfully. One policy allows up to 30,000 Cubans, Haitians, Nicaraguans and Venezuleans to fly to the U.S. each month if Americans agree to sponsor them. The other program allows migrants in Mexico to use a phone app to request an appointment to be processed at an official border crossing. In October, more than 44,000 migrants were allowed to enter the U.S. through the app-powered process, according to federal data.

Again, not blaming, not defending, simply looking at what was in place as to *A* reason why he may not have been sent packing immediately.

He may have been one that was smart enough to avoid being deported or who just slipped through the cracks as far as that goes.  Which, if he is indeed is the killer, would be an awful thing to have happened but not one done on purpose.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(02-28-2024, 10:03 AM)GMDino Wrote: And the deportations of Venezuelans under Biden began in earnest in October of 2023

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/immigration-venezuelan-arrivals-us-southern-border-biden-deportations/




Again, not blaming, not defending, simply looking at what was in place as to *A* reason why he may not have been sent packing immediately.

He may have been one that was smart enough to avoid being deported or who just slipped through the cracks as far as that goes.  Which, if he is indeed is the killer, would be an awful thing to have happened but not one done on purpose.

Well done, and yes, he slipped thru the cracks because he was arrested in a Sanctuary city. 

I personally don't care where you are from. If you are here illegally, you should keep your nose clean and just violate the the work part (working illegally is practically unavoidable). Any other laws  you start breaking and you need to be deported because it shows you don't respect the laws.

And not related but related to Jose, his brother is being held by ICE for Green Card Fraud.

[GMDino]

(02-28-2024, 11:53 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Well done, and yes, he slipped thru the cracks because he was arrested in a Sanctuary city. 

I personally don't care where you are from. If you are here illegally, you should keep your nose clean and just violate the the work part (working illegally is practically unavoidable). Any other laws  you start breaking and you need to be deported because it shows you don't respect the laws.

And not related but related to Jose, his brother is being held by ICE for Green Card Fraud.

And because of the way the deportation were handled and started in earnest.

Yeah that part about his brother was in another link I posted.  I believe he was one of the three people "interviewed" before the arrest.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(02-28-2024, 11:54 AM)GMDino Wrote: And because of the way the deportation were handled and started in earnest.

Yeah that part about his brother was in another link I posted.  I believe he was one of the three people "interviewed" before the arrest.

Do you agree that if someone is here illegally and they break laws (other than working and being here illegally) that they should be deported?

[GMDino]

(02-28-2024, 12:26 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Do you agree that if someone is here illegally and they break laws (other than working and being here illegally) that they should be deported?

What did they do?

Jay walking? Petty theft or shop lifting?

Not sure we should fly them back to their home country for that.

If it's a more severe crime I'd rather they be held for trial before sent home.

And what if they are the child of an illegal immigrant and the US is the only "home" they know?  Send them back alone?

It's not as black and white a question as many would like it to be.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(02-28-2024, 12:32 PM)GMDino Wrote: What did they do?

Jay walking? Petty theft or shop lifting?

Not sure we should fly them back to their home country for that.

If it's a more severe crime I'd rather they be held for trial before sent home.

And what if they are the child of an illegal immigrant and the US is the only "home" they know?  Send them back alone?

It's not as black and white a question as many would like it to be.

So excuses for people here illegally.
When i go to other countries, i have to follow US laws and Local laws or else i'm subject to Deporting/banning. 
I think it's fair to apply the reverse, especially if you are here illegally. If you are here legally, then you are allowed a "gray" area and when it's time to renew your status, then the severity is taken into consideration.

If you have a child that's a USC and you are breaking the laws, then i don't feel sorry for you. Bad decisions have consequences. If we enforce that, then maybe some will think twice before they make that bad decision. I know it's a harsh stance, but a line has to be drawn somewhere.

As a single father with custody, i've had opportunities to make bad decisions, IE Such as drinking and driving, BUT I chose NOT TO do that so as to not jeopardize my custody status. 

[GMDino]

(02-28-2024, 01:10 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: So excuses for people here illegally.
When i go to other countries, i have to follow US laws and Local laws or else i'm subject to Deporting/banning. 
I think it's fair to apply the reverse, especially if you are here illegally. If you are here legally, then you are allowed a "gray" area and when it's time to renew your status, then the severity is taken into consideration.

If you have a child that's a USC and you are breaking the laws, then i don't feel sorry for you. Bad decisions have consequences. If we enforce that, then maybe some will think twice before they make that bad decision. I know it's a harsh stance, but a line has to be drawn somewhere.

As a single father with custody, i've had opportunities to make bad decisions, IE Such as drinking and driving, BUT I chose NOT TO do that so as to not jeopardize my custody status. 

No excuses.  I'm saying that it's not black and white.

I have a friend who travels a lot.  An "officer" tried to give him a ticket for parking illegally once and instead took a little "payment for the fine" personally in order to give my buddy his DL back.  He did nothing wrong but didn't follow the "laws" of the country he was in.

You might also end up in a foreign jail with no way "home".  Not a risk I want to take either.  

A child brought here who has no ties to the "home" country of their parents who is arrested for loitering being sent away is cruelty for the sake of it.

That's why we need to work on making them citizens as hard as we work on "rounding them up" and deporting them.

Did you ever speed?  With your child in the car?  

If you got a ticket would they take away or adjust your custody arrangement just for speeding?  I'd hope not unless you were recklessly driving by doing 100 or 50 through a school zone.

Gray areas exist.  Reason exists.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-28-2024, 01:18 PM)GMDino Wrote: No excuses.  I'm saying that it's not black and white.

I have a friend who travels a lot.  An "officer" tried to give him a ticket for parking illegally once and instead took a little "payment for the fine" personally in order to give my buddy his DL back.  He did nothing wrong but didn't follow the "laws" of the country he was in.

You might also end up in a foreign jail with no way "home".  Not a risk I want to take either.  

A child brought here who has no ties to the "home" country of their parents who is arrested for loitering being sent away is cruelty for the sake of it.

That's why we need to work on making them citizens as hard as we work on "rounding them up" and deporting them.

Did you ever speed?  With your child in the car?  

If you got a ticket would they take away or adjust your custody arrangement just for speeding?  I'd hope not unless you were recklessly driving by doing 100 or 50 through a school zone.

Gray areas exist.  Reason exists.

Rewarding illegal entry with citizenship is a recipe for disaster.  Either you have immigration laws that you enforce or you do not.  I used to find the leftist hand wringing over this issue curious, why would you be in favor of not actually enforcing the law?  Then last four plus years have shown me that the leftists have no appreciation for enforcing criminal law either, so at least it's consistent.

Do you not like the current immigration law?  The work to change it.  In the meantime it should be properly enforced.  You want to remove the incentive to illegally enter the country, mandate E-verify for employers and enforce criminal penalties for hiring people in the country illegally.  Remove the financial incentive and the problem solves itself.  And yes, in this regard the GOP has been just as guilty as the Dems, no one is clean here.

Choosing what laws we do, and do not actually enforce has been a recipe for disaster, and the past four years have proven this beyond any doubt.  And pointing this out is not racist because the majority of illegal aliens are not white, it wouldn't matter if it was entirely white French people entering illegally, the points being made would remain the same.

[GMDino]

(02-28-2024, 01:30 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Rewarding illegal entry with citizenship is a recipe for disaster.  Either you have immigration laws that you enforce or you do not.  I used to find the leftist hand wringing over this issue curious, why would you be in favor of not actually enforcing the law?  Then last four plus years have shown me that the leftists have no appreciation for enforcing criminal law either, so at least it's consistent.

Do you not like the current immigration law?  The work to change it.  In the meantime it should be properly enforced.  You want to remove the incentive to illegally enter the country, mandate E-verify for employers and enforce criminal penalties for hiring people in the country illegally.  Remove the financial incentive and the problem solves itself.  And yes, in this regard the GOP has been just as guilty as the Dems, no one is clean here.

Choosing what laws we do, and do not actually enforce has been a recipe for disaster, and the past four years have proven this beyond any doubt.  And pointing this out is not racist because the majority of illegal aliens are not white, it wouldn't matter if it was entirely white French people entering illegally, the points being made would remain the same.

(02-28-2024, 01:18 PM)GMDino Wrote: No excuses.  I'm saying that it's not black and white.

That's why we need to work on making them citizens as hard as we work on "rounding them up" and deporting them.

Gray areas exist.  Reason exists.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(02-28-2024, 01:18 PM)GMDino Wrote: No excuses.  I'm saying that it's not black and white.

I have a friend who travels a lot.  An "officer" tried to give him a ticket for parking illegally once and instead took a little "payment for the fine" personally in order to give my buddy his DL back.  He did nothing wrong but didn't follow the "laws" of the country he was in.

You might also end up in a foreign jail with no way "home".  Not a risk I want to take either.  

A child brought here who has no ties to the "home" country of their parents who is arrested for loitering being sent away is cruelty for the sake of it.

That's why we need to work on making them citizens as hard as we work on "rounding them up" and deporting them.

Did you ever speed?  With your child in the car?  

If you got a ticket would they take away or adjust your custody arrangement just for speeding?  I'd hope not unless you were recklessly driving by doing 100 or 50 through a school zone.

Gray areas exist.  Reason exists.

Nice try, i do speed but only up to 10mph over the posted speed limit and not in school zones. That's not considered wreckless driving, whicch can give the other parent an opening to use against  you for custody if they want to try it, but usually it would be used in a string of bad decisions to prove that you are not fit.

Sounds like your friend was in a 3rd world country. Your buddy should have paid the bribe and then reported it to the local police a couple days before leaving the country. By not reporting it, that officer will keep doing it and get away with it.

Back to the USC child thing. You know very well that i am a big proponent of doing away with Jos Soli (citizenship by birth in the country) and using Jus Sanguinis (by blood, one or both parents must be a citizen of that country). I said my stance was harsh. No sympathy for willingly breaking the laws that would jeopardize your family status. Keep it simple, no exceptions. Unfortunately if you allow one, then everyone after will think they are also an exception. 

[Mike M (the other one)]

PS you know something has to give as for the first time in polling in the last 10 years, slightly over 50% want a wall now...

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-28-2024, 01:42 PM)GMDino Wrote:

That's not changing the immigration law, that's granting citizenship to people who entered the country illegally.  You can't reward illegal behavior, not and expect to have a country with a firm sense of the rule of law.  For many people, including moderates, that's a non-starter.  One of my favorite officers I've trained is the child of legal immigrants from El Salvador.  They still speak very limited English.  They can't stand people coming here illegally and are adamantly opposed to rewarding them with citizenship.  This isn't a conservative v. liberal issue.  This is about the rule of law v. ignoring laws whenever we find it convenient.  No amount of emojis will change that.

[GMDino]

(02-28-2024, 01:59 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Nice try, i do speed but only up to 10mph over the posted speed limit and not in school zones. That's not considered wreckless driving, whicch can give the other parent an opening to use against  you for custody if they want to try it, but usually it would be used in a string of bad decisions to prove that you are not fit.

Sounds like your friend was in a 3rd world country. Your buddy should have paid the bribe and then reported it to the local police a couple days before leaving the country. By not reporting it, that officer will keep doing it and get away with it.

Back to the USC child thing. You know very well that i am a big proponent of doing away with Jos Soli (citizenship by birth in the country) and using Jus Sanguinis (by blood, one or both parents must be a citizen of that country). I said my stance was harsh. No sympathy for willingly breaking the laws that would jeopardize your family status. Keep it simple, no exceptions. Unfortunately if you allow one, then everyone after will think they are also an exception. 

I'm not "trying" anything, but I was right:  You break the law, maybe get a ticket but your "poor choice" didn't affect your custody.  That's a good thing.

Yeah, your view is too harsh for me so I don't see us getting anywhere going back and forth today, so I'll end my part with this:  What happened in this one case should not be the motivation to over adjust and adapt very harsh laws that would sweep up more innocent people (or people who are not violent) than hardened criminals, IMHO.  I'm more in favor of legislation that helps solidify and quicken the citizenship process.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-28-2024, 01:59 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Nice try, i do speed but only up to 10mph over the posted speed limit and not in school zones. That's not considered wreckless driving, whicch can give the other parent an opening to use against  you for custody if they want to try it, but usually it would be used in a string of bad decisions to prove that you are not fit.

Sounds like your friend was in a 3rd world country. Your buddy should have paid the bribe and then reported it to the local police a couple days before leaving the country. By not reporting it, that officer will keep doing it and get away with it.

If it was Mexico, best to move on with your day and be thankful that's all it cost you.

Quote:Back to the USC child thing. You know very well that i am a big proponent of doing away with Jos Soli (citizenship by birth in the country) and using Jus Sanguinis (by blood, one or both parents must be a citizen of that country). I said my stance was harsh. No sympathy for willingly breaking the laws that would jeopardize your family status. Keep it simple, no exceptions. Unfortunately if you allow one, then everyone after will think they are also an exception. 

The vast majority of the world, including pretty much the entirety of Europe, does it that way.  They must all be racist.  That portion of the 14th amendment has served its purpose, time to amend it.  Maybe a couple of emojis will help us?

[Mike M (the other one)]

(02-28-2024, 02:21 PM)GMDino Wrote:
I'm not "trying" anything, but I was right:  You break the law, maybe get a ticket but your "poor choice" didn't affect your custody.  That's a good thing.

Yeah, your view is too harsh for me so I don't see us getting anywhere going back and forth today, so I'll end my part with this:  What happened in this one case should not be the motivation to over adjust and adapt very harsh laws that would sweep up more innocent people (or people who are not violent) than hardened criminals, IMHO.  I'm more in favor of legislation that helps solidify and quicken the citizenship process.

But i'm also here Legally.... so those gray area's can apply to me. It's not like i can be deported from the US. 

[Mike M (the other one)]

Double PS,
Looks like Virginia might be the next hot spot for Illegals to go to.
Especially if the Dems get the medical coverage for all kids approved which would be paid for by the State tax payers.
Fun stuff when not all USC kids are covered..

[GMDino]

(02-28-2024, 02:33 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: But i'm also here Legally.... so those gray area's can apply to me. It's not like i can be deported from the US. 

No, I was just tying it the level of response to the act.

Don't deport a person who can't even remember being brought here as a child for a minor offense, don't take away parental rights over a speeding ticket.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(02-28-2024, 02:49 PM)GMDino Wrote: No, I was just tying it the level of response to the act.

Don't deport a person who can't even remember being brought here as a child for a minor offense, don't take away parental rights over a speeding ticket.

Who said i would automatically deport the child?
There is usually 2 parents, so one will go. IF they both go, then better have a contingency plan in place where they can go live with Aunt/Uncle or another relative. If there is no one left, then sadly they will go as well unless you want the state to take care of it.

Consequences need to suck and be routinely enforced, that's kinda the point.