On the cost of Education

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(07-27-2016, 11:59 AM)Nebuchadnezzar Wrote: The way I did it,

I got sick of the job I was working so when I got home from work, I hopped on the Internet and filled out the FAFSA form online. After about 3 months, I recieved a letter in the mail telling me what I needed to do next and it listed the grants, loans and scholarships I qualified for.

I never expected it to be so easy and thought it rather strange. I just filled out that form and BAM! I was in school.

I will have to check that out for sure!

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(07-27-2016, 12:00 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Well, there are some others that provide assistance currently. I definitely think, though, that we should do more for other civil servants as well. To be frank about it, the military is currently in the works of finding every possible excuse they can muster to not pay for things. It's pretty horrendous. When they do pay, it can take them a year or more to fulfill obligations. I currently have several AR accounts for ROTC and GI Bill students over a year old.

Wow that is horrendous.  I used the GI bill when I got out, and the government can work slow, but I don't remember it working THAT slow!?!?

[*bfine32*]

(07-27-2016, 11:46 AM)RICHMONDBENGAL_07 Wrote: Nothing I really disagree with your post.  Just wondering if there is some other sort of public service or government service that would qualify someone for college tuition?   I ask because (as some here may know) my son is diabetic and will never qualify for the military.  (On a more Personal level), he's devastated by that.  Most of the males (and one female) in my family were in the military.  Wish there were other options for him, he's a smart and capable kid, he just has that one issue.

Edit:  I really like the idea of public service as payment of education.  I just think we need to rethink the notion that the military is the only route.

Look into the SMART Scholarship. http://smart.asee.org/

As I have said in the past. If a kid is willing to serve, there are numerous educational benefits. Good luck with your son and I wouldn't totally dismiss the Military until he has been disqualifed officially by DoDMERB.

[Belsnickel]

(07-27-2016, 12:10 PM)RICHMONDBENGAL_07 Wrote: Wow that is horrendous.  I used the GI bill when I got out, and the government can work slow, but I don't remember it working THAT slow!?!?

Yeah, it is very interesting what all goes into that stuff. GI Bill for vets, VMSDP for their dependents, ROTC for cadets, and Tuition Assistance (state and fed) for current. All of them are tough to actually get paid and the number of hoops we, and the students, have to jump through is a bit ridiculous.

[Belsnickel]

(07-27-2016, 12:11 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Look into the SMART Scholarship. http://smart.asee.org/

I've had a handful of those students. Great program.

[*bfine32*]

(07-27-2016, 12:00 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Well, there are some others that provide assistance currently. I definitely think, though, that we should do more for other civil servants as well. To be frank about it, the military is currently in the works of finding every possible excuse they can muster to not pay for things. It's pretty horrendous. When they do pay, it can take them a year or more to fulfill obligations. I currently have several AR accounts for ROTC and GI Bill students over a year old.

If you have ROTC payments that are over a year late; I would be curious to know the name of the Cadet(s) and who you have spoken to in regards to this (PM if you wish and I will give you my official email). As to GI Bill, that's VA and I know they can be slow.

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(07-27-2016, 12:11 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Look into the SMART Scholarship. http://smart.asee.org/

As I have said in the past. If a kid is willing to serve, there are numerous educational benefits. Good luck with your son and I wouldn't totally dismiss the Military until he has been disqualifed officially by DoDMERB.

I have no idea what DoDMERB is?  Could he still qualify for military service as a diabetic?  Any Info is greatly appreciated, thanks.  I will also look into the SMART Scholarship.

[Belsnickel]

(07-27-2016, 12:15 PM)bfine32 Wrote: If you have ROTC payments that are over a year late; I would be curious to know the name of the Cadet(s) and who you have spoken to in regards to this (PM if you wish and I will give you my official email). As to GI Bill, that's VA and I know they can be slow.

Getting into names would be hairy with regards to FERPA. I know some of it is the result of cadets not doing what they need to do, and some of it is due to a change in leadership with our BN.

[*bfine32*]

(07-27-2016, 12:47 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Getting into names would be hairy with regards to FERPA. I know some of it is the result of cadets not doing what they need to do, and some of it is due to a change in leadership with our BN.

Yeah, that's why I was not going to discuss further here. Anything older that 90 days should be addressed.

[*wildcats forever*]

(07-27-2016, 12:34 PM)RICHMONDBENGAL_07 Wrote: I have no idea what DoDMERB is?  Could he still qualify for military service as a diabetic?  Any Info is greatly appreciated, thanks.  I will also look into the SMART Scholarship.

Department of Defense Medical Examination Review Board

[Belsnickel]

(07-27-2016, 12:52 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Yeah, that's why I was not going to discuss further here. Anything older that 90 days should be addressed.

It gets addressed. The issue for me is that I supervise the person that directly deals with this stuff. She isn't the most, shall we say proactive, of people. Every month when I reconcile I prod her, and (most of the time) she prods one of her contacts.

Most of them aren't an issue for me. They become an issue for me when we send the students money for their stipend (incentive?) or whatnot and we have not been paid. I just realized, because you caused me to look at my last recon, that we received payment for all the ones we had left in that situation in June.

[*bfine32*]

(07-27-2016, 12:34 PM)RICHMONDBENGAL_07 Wrote: I have no idea what DoDMERB is?  Could he still qualify for military service as a diabetic?  Any Info is greatly appreciated, thanks.  I will also look into the SMART Scholarship.

They are the folks that review physical exams for Department of Defense. (Wildcats provided you with the name). As to qualification; totally outside of my lane. I do know it varies by organization; as different branches/organization will waive different maladies.

Their website is referenced at the bottom of this link:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Defense_Medical_Examination_Review_Board

[*bfine32*]

(07-27-2016, 12:54 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: It gets addressed. The issue for me is that I supervise the person that directly deals with this stuff. She isn't the most, shall we say proactive, of people. Every month when I reconcile I prod her, and (most of the time) she prods one of her contacts.

Most of them aren't an issue for me. They become an issue for me when we send the students money for their stipend (incentive?) or whatnot and we have not been paid. I just realized, because you caused me to look at my last recon, that we received payment for all the ones we had left in that situation in June.

Great. Good luck with V.A.

[Belsnickel]

(07-27-2016, 01:11 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Great. Good luck with V.A.

Yeah, we will need it. Between them and our VAARNG stuff, I don't know which is worse.

[BmorePat87]

It is interesting, but it would hurt those who are in harder programs. I'd be cool with grants for those in STEM and other identified needs.

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(07-27-2016, 01:10 PM)bfine32 Wrote: They are the folks that review physical exams for Department of Defense. (Wildcats provided you with the name). As to qualification; totally outside of my lane. I do know it varies by organization; as different branches/organization will waive different maladies.

Their website is referenced at the bottom of this link:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Defense_Medical_Examination_Review_Board

Thank you very much, I will investigate more.  I never really looked into it, just assumed it was outside his realm of possibilities, mainly because of what I remember the physical standards that I had to meet.  He's always expressed interest in joining and would be thrilled if he could even if at just a support level like administration or something.
Thanks again

[Mike M (the other one)]

(07-26-2016, 04:43 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: You mean the type of degree someone might get at one of the military service academies?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2016/04/26/service-academies-where-the-u-s-military-meets-liberal-arts/

What degree do you have which is superior to a liberal arts degree?

Started off as a Computer Engineering (2 1/2 years), but then after being over half way thru switched to Computer Science, because the market was/is much better and broader. Since then, I've specialized in Networking, DBA, SQL and Programming. 
It didn't take me long to finish it either (1 1/2 years), since I had most of my core classes done for CE (Physics/Calculus/English), those classes wiped out my need to take any more math and English, so all I had to focus on was the specialized classes, even squeezed extra classes in so that I could have an even broader range to work in, such as Accounting and Business Management.

Now what kind of job is that person going to be able to do with that Liberal Arts Degree? and how strong is the job field/demand for people with that degree?

[Belsnickel]

(07-27-2016, 03:24 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Now what kind of job is that person going to be able to do with that Liberal Arts Degree? and how strong is the job field/demand for people with that degree?

Do you mean a liberal arts degree, or a degree based on a liberal arts education? Either way, I don't think you really know what you're saying. STEM degrees include liberal arts. Math, social/physical sciences, those are liberal arts. Essentially, if it's not professional/technical, it's a liberal art. So while it includes literature and history, it includes statistics and economics as well. Liberal arts universities require students even getting professional degrees, like a BBA, to take some classes in these subjects for a more well rounded education, as the theory goes.

[JustWinBaby]

(07-27-2016, 09:48 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'm not going to spend the time to go to prior budgets and make comparisons. I can tell you, though, that the percentages of revenue sources and the expenditures has remained fairly stagnant. The only real change is a consistently decreasing percentage of revenue coming from the general fund, which is what the General Assembly allocates to us.

And, in case anyone is wondering about me providing this information, as a public university all of this is public record. All but the first image are actually pulled directly from our website. The first one is me condensing information taken from multiple files that can be obtained from our website.

That's very interesting.  All looks very reasonable - for in-state tuition.  And that's probably how it should work.  Of course, if you're not smart enough to get into one of your better state schools....

But so either out-of-state students are getting gouged, or there's already a huge amount of money from state & federal going into college education (which, of course, is also true before we even get to subsidized loans).  And probably a combination of both.  There was a huge premium out-of-state at my school way back when I went there too, so always kind of been that way.

I did read some articles that said most of the increase is going to administrative costs.  One school or system had seen like a 230% increase over the past decade in EMPLOYEES, and many of those are making 6-figures.  There's some debate that this is caused by easy money (although most arguing against that appear to be college administrators  ).

[Belsnickel]

(07-27-2016, 04:57 PM)JustWinBaby Wrote: That's very interesting.  All looks very reasonable - for in-state tuition.  And that's probably how it should work.  Of course, if you're not smart enough to get into one of your better state schools....

But so either out-of-state students are getting gouged, or there's already a huge amount of money from state & federal going into college education (which, of course, is also true before we even get to subsidized loans).  And probably a combination of both.  There was a huge premium out-of-state at my school way back when I went there too, so always kind of been that way.

I did read some articles that said most of the increase is going to administrative costs.  One school or system had seen like a 230% increase over the past decade in EMPLOYEES, and many of those are making 6-figures.  There's some debate that this is caused by easy money (although most arguing against that appear to be college administrators  ).

Interestingly enough, we get a lot of kids from NJ because it is still cheaper than their own state school.

But yeah, the price for out of state is insane. As for employees, we have had some increase that has to come with increased enrollment. So that is something that has to be balanced. But Virginia doesn't let us pay shit, so there is that.