President Trump says he plans to end birthright citizenship with an executive order

[Dill]

(10-30-2018, 04:37 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: Obviously he cannot. Congressional Republicans are lining up to state this.

What is more concerning to me is the fact that he has no issue stating an outright lie like "we're only only country that does it" in reference to birth right citizenship, but when the media corrects yet another of his hundreds of outright lies since taking office, they are denounced as "fake" by his supporters. Hell, even people who claim not to be outright supporters of us still take part in the vilification of the media for their attempts to report the truth.

That is the key to the whole Trump phenomenon.  Right wing media and politicians have created a permanent class of disinformed voters and can now wield them like a club.  Impervious to fact checking.

Around these supporters is a ring of Trump "defenders" who claim not to support Trump and to disapprove of his behavior, but still can't attack him, cannot disengage from the incredible notion that Obama and Hillary were "just as bad."

Completely Fox-neutered, they can only attack people who actually hold him accountable and "resist."

[*michaelsean*]

(10-30-2018, 06:08 PM)Nately120 Wrote: The threat of a democrat ending the 2nd amendment has been the crux of republican votes for generations.  Nothing Trump does will change that.

No matter what happens and no matter what the democrat candidate says in 2020 he/she will apparently be running on a platform of taking your guns.  As a bonus, minorities of all kinds will be more dangerous and plentiful.

Well choosing the second amendment as an example of a Democrat counter-move may play into their hands.

[*Nately120*]

(10-30-2018, 09:02 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Well choosing the second amendment as an example of a Democrat counter-move may play into their hands.

You mean a democrat saying that Trump undoing the amendments may lead to the undoing of the 2nd amendment?  So the democrats use the "they're gonna take yer guns" threat to drum up support against republicans?

[*michaelsean*]

(10-30-2018, 09:58 PM)Nately120 Wrote: You mean a democrat saying that Trump undoing the amendments may lead to the undoing of the 2nd amendment?  So the democrats use the "they're gonna take yer guns" threat to drum up support against republicans?

No I’m saying if you contend that Republicans like to falsely scare people by saying Dems want to repeal the 2nd amendment, then you probably shouldn’t use Dems repealing the 2nd amendment as your hypothetical counter move.

[*Nately120*]

(10-30-2018, 10:04 PM)michaelsean Wrote: No I’m saying if you contend that Republicans like to falsely scare people by saying Dems want to repeal the 2nd amendment, then you probably shouldn’t use Dems repealing the 2nd amendment as your hypothetical counter move.

Oh.  I'm just saying that "the democrats are gonna take your guns" is going to be one of the main selling points of the republican candidate until the sun burns out, regardless of how possible or likely it is.  

The republican playbook is so gloriously simple that I'm surprised they ever lose. Democrats are going to take your money and take your guns and then give minorities your money and then make them better able to cause you harm and you won't be able to defend yourself. Also, democrats hate the troops, will cause us to get invaded if they get elected, and they love to kill babies (insert picture of a white baby, here).

[Benton]

(10-30-2018, 10:08 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Oh.  I'm just saying that "the democrats are gonna take your guns" is going to be one of the main selling points of the republican candidate until the sun burns out, regardless of how possible or likely it is.  

The republican playbook is so gloriously simple that I'm surprised they ever lose.  Democrats are going to take your money and take your guns and then give minorities your money and then make them better able to cause you harm and you won't be able to defend yourself.  Also, democrats hate the troops, will cause us to get invaded if they get elected, and they love to kill babies (insert picture of a white baby, here).

Democrats rarely make "taking away you guns" a platform issue, but Republicans put it front and center as part of the fearmongering. If Democrats were smart, they'd at least make one of the GOP's fake pledges about balanced budgets and such, except they'd make it about guns. And keep it. Pledge not file any gun control legislation until at least 2050, when the Russians attack with laser drones at the urging of their GOP masters. Do that, and BAM half the GOP voters will at least stay home without the fear that Clinton/Obama/Carter is coming for their guns.

[Dill]

(10-30-2018, 10:08 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Oh.  I'm just saying that "the democrats are gonna take your guns" is going to be one of the main selling points of the republican candidate until the sun burns out, regardless of how possible or likely it is. 

That is the trigger in The Turner Diaries.  The "Cohen Act" passed under a Jewish president sends black goon squads led by liberal whites into the homes of honest gun owners to confiscate.  Gun registries guide them to right homes.  Turner is arrested. Until whites organize to oppose Marxists and blacks, the racial genocide cannot be stopped. 

Oh I know . . . all that's out of date.  No one buys into Christian white nationalism anymore.

[BrownAssClown]

List of Presidents and number of executive orders each have made... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_federal_executive_orders

Is Trumps latest "executive Order" threat nothing more than red meat for his base? Like last week when he was going to pass a middle class tax cut before the mid terms even though congress is NOT in session? Are these are the ravings of a desperate man that will say anything to keep republicans in charge of congress, so he will not face the chance of impeachment and possible criminal charges?  

My prediction is this, if the republicans keep hold of the house and senate in the mid terms, Trump may feel emboldened to fire Mueller and Rosenstein and try to end the special counsels investigation and make the ugly cloud hanging over his administration go away. If Democrats get control in congress all heck might break loose. If the Republicans become the minority will they stand by Trump or throw him under the bus and blame him for their losses? Will they think they got all they can get out of him by getting two supreme court justices appointed and the corporate tax cut passed? Have they rode this horse as far as it will go? Stay tuned, as the political world turns.

[ballsofsteel]

(10-30-2018, 02:43 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: I don’t think he believes that at all. He believes that his supporters will believe anything he says and he’s trying to drum up enthusiasm for the midterms with bigot whistles.

Exactly!
This is what I think also. As his love mate Kim Jong Un stated, Trump is a dotard. He's not coming up with all these dumb ass ideas. He's being fed all this crap by his handlers to get his base fired up for the mid terms, thats all this is. Like the tax cut for the middle class and so on. Throw shit against the wall and see what sticks with his base. He is pilling it on before Nov.6. What he don't realize is that if all the people that don't like him get out and vote, he's going lose no matter what. Trump insults every American with his lies.

[ballsofsteel]

(10-31-2018, 06:03 AM)ballsofsteel Wrote: Exactly!
This is what I think also. As his love mate Kim Jong Un stated, Trump is a dotard. He's not coming up with all these dumb ass ideas. He's being fed all this crap by his handlers to get his base fired up for the mid terms, thats all this is. Like the tax cut for the middle class and so on. Throw shit against the wall and see what sticks with his base. He is pilling it on before Nov.6. What he don't realize is that if all the people that don't like him get out and vote, he's going lose no matter what. Trump insults every American with his lies.

Hi. I should clarify that by his handlers I'm referring to his main advisors at Fox News.




 

[Belsnickel]

(10-31-2018, 02:18 AM)BrownAssClown Wrote: List of Presidents and number of executive orders each have made... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_federal_executive_orders

If Trump keeps his current pace, he would have at least 340 EOs in 8 years. His rate surpasses that of G.W. Bush and Obama.

(10-31-2018, 02:18 AM)BrownAssClown Wrote: Is Trumps latest "executive Order" threat nothing more than red meat for his base? Like last week when he was going to pass a middle class tax cut before the mid terms even though congress is NOT in session? Are these are the ravings of a desperate man that will say anything to keep republicans in charge of congress, so he will not face the chance of impeachment and possible criminal charges?  

He's great at running for office, but he's terrible at governing (which really makes him a model Republican ). I just don't know where the lines are as far as how much he actually thinks he can get away with, how much he is just bullshitting, or how little he actually understands his role.

(10-31-2018, 02:18 AM)BrownAssClown Wrote: My prediction is this, if the republicans keep hold of the house and senate in the mid terms, Trump may feel emboldened to fire Mueller and Rosenstein and try to end the special counsels investigation and make the ugly cloud hanging over his administration go away. If Democrats get control in congress all heck might break loose. If the Republicans become the minority will they stand by Trump or throw him under the bus and blame him for their losses? Will they think they got all they can get out of him by getting two supreme court justices appointed and the corporate tax cut passed? Have they rode this horse as far as it will go? Stay tuned, as the political world turns.

I don't see the Republicans abandoning him if they end up in the minority. They'll try to ride the wave of discontent and blame their minority position for not getting anything done.

[Au165]

(10-31-2018, 08:42 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I don't see the Republicans abandoning him if they end up in the minority. They'll try to ride the wave of discontent and blame their minority position for not getting anything done.

I think they may because he will abandon them. He will cast them out as "losers" who didn't support him enough. 

[fredtoast]

Trumps appeal to his strong base is not very transferable.  It is not about a policy that every other Republican could adopt.  It is about sheer personality and worship of the wealthy.

What I am saying is that just because a lot of Republicans love Trump that does not mean they will love every mean spirited ass hole.

In a way Obama was a little like that.  He had a "cool" factor that people liked.  Even though he was very popular his support did not help other Democrats win elections and keep control of Congress.

[Au165]

(10-31-2018, 01:15 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Trumps appeal to his strong base is not very transferable.  It is not about a policy that every other Republican could adopt.  It is about sheer personality and worship of the wealthy.

What I am saying is that just because a lot of Republicans love Trump that does not mean they will love every mean spirited ass hole.

In a way Obama was a little like that.  He had a "cool" factor that people liked.  Even though he was very popular his support did not help other Democrats win elections and keep control of Congress.

This is a good point. I think there are figures that outshine their political party a bit and both seem to have been that. 

[BFritz21]

(10-30-2018, 10:38 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I'm pretty sure he's wrong, and I still like the idea that if you are born here then you are a citizen.  Obviously it can be abused, but for me that's the #1 maker of a citizen.  You were born here.

So, an illegal immigrant can be in labor, step across the border, pop the baby out a minute later, and then it's a citizen, guaranteed the same rights as everyone else?

(10-30-2018, 12:06 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I only wish I could go back in time and tell my newborn grandparents to get their freeloading asses back to Italy and Ireland.

Different times and circumstances.

[GMDino]

(11-01-2018, 10:02 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: So, an illegal immigrant can be in labor, step across the border, pop the baby out a minute later, and then it's a citizen, guaranteed the same rights as everyone else?

Yes.

Which is why many people pay for the opportunity to do so:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/birth-tourism-brings-russian-baby-boom-miami-n836121

Quote:Lured by the charm of little Havana or the glamour of South Beach, some 15 million tourists visit Miami every year.

But for a growing number of Russian women, the draw isn't sunny beaches or pulsing nightclubs. It's U.S. citizenship for their newborn children.

In Moscow, it's a status symbol to have a Miami-born baby, and social media is full of Russian women boasting of their little americantsy.

Why Russian mothers-to-be are rushing to Florida to give birth

"It's really common," said Ekaterina Kuznetsova, 29. "When I was taking the plane to come here, it was not only me. It was four or five women flying here."

Ekaterina was one of dozens of Russian birth tourists NBC News spoke to over the past four months about a round-trip journey that costs tens of thousands of dollars and takes them away from home for weeks or months.

Why do they come?

"American passport is a big plus for the baby. Why not?" Olesia Reshetova, 31, told NBC News.

"And the doctors, the level of education," Kuznetsova added.

The weather doesn't hurt, either.

"It's a very comfortable place for staying in wintertime," Oleysa Suhareva said.

Image: Oleysa Suhareva traveled from Russia to Miami to give birth.Oleysa Suhareva traveled from Russia to Miami to give birth.Courtesy Oleysa Suhareva
It's not just the Russians who are coming. Chinese moms-to-be have been flocking to Southern California to give birth for years.

What they are doing is completely legal, as long as they don't lie on any immigration or insurance paperwork. In fact, it's protected by the 14th amendment to the U.S. Constitution, which says anyone born on American soil is automatically a citizen.

The child gets a lifelong right to live and work and collect benefits in the U.S. And when they turn 21 they can sponsor their parents' application for an American green card.

As president, Donald Trump has indicated he is opposed to so-called chain migration, which gives U.S. citizens the right to sponsor relatives, because of recent terror attacks. And as a candidate, he called for an end to birthright citizenship, declaring it in one of his first policy papers the "biggest magnet for illegal immigration."

"You have to get rid of it," he said on "Meet the Press" on NBC. "They're having a baby and all of a sudden — nobody knows — the baby is here. You have no choice."

In a twist, as the Daily Beast first reported, condo buildings that bear the Trump name are the most popular for the out-of-town obstetric patients, although the units are subleased from the individual owners and it's not clear if building management is aware.

There is no indication that Trump or the Trump Organization is profiting directly from birth tourism; the company and the White House did not respond to requests for comment.

Roman Bokeria, the state director of the Florida Association of Realtors told NBC News that Trump- branded buildings in the Sunny Isles Beach area north of Miami are particularly popular with the Russian birth tourists and Russian immigrants.

"Sunny Isles beach has a nickname — Little Russia — because people who are moving from Russian-speaking countries to America, they want … a familiar environment."

"They go across the street, they have Russian market, Russian doctor, Russian lawyer," he added. "It's very comfortable for them."

More at the link.

[*michaelsean*]

(11-01-2018, 10:02 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: So, an illegal immigrant can be in labor, step across the border, pop the baby out a minute later, and then it's a citizen, guaranteed the same rights as everyone else?

Different times and circumstances.

Yeah.  Occasionally you have to live with things you may not think are quite right.  I can't think of a better definition of US citizen than born in the US.

[XenoMorph]

(11-01-2018, 10:02 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: So, an illegal immigrant can be in labor, step across the border, pop the baby out a minute later, and then it's a citizen, guaranteed the same rights as everyone else?

Its one of the most abused things...

They do this get citizenship for their kid then apply for welfare etc..    

[*Nately120*]

(11-01-2018, 10:02 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: Different times and circumstances.

I disagree, but that's par for the course.

[Benton]

(11-01-2018, 10:02 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: So, an illegal immigrant can be in labor, step across the border, pop the baby out a minute later, and then it's a citizen, guaranteed the same rights as everyone else?

Different times and circumstances.

To the bold, you don't have to be a citizen for this. Just being here guarantees you the rights (not the same privileges, but the same rights).

As far as the times and circumstances, why? Because they came by boat? People have come here for nearly three centuries to escape persecution, unjust laws and war. And they were often welcomed with unwelcomeness, because the people already here didn't want to give ground to a minority, be it Catholics or Jews or brown people or white-people-who-aren't-the-same-white-people, or Germans, or Japanese or whoever else.