Question for Anti-Establishment Trump People

[Benton]

(11-14-2016, 02:09 PM)bfine32 Wrote: As I said: Mitch is good for KY. We will miss him when he's gone.

I guess I got mixed up. I thought you said "KY has 2 Military bases and they are a couple of the few that are not losing folks (actually gaining)." Which, as the article notes, hasn't been true. 

He gives off a good appearance of it though. He's gotten federal money to pay for Mich McConnell Park in bowling Green and Mitch McConnell Plaza in Owensboro. The pork king got around $100 million in one decade for municipal projects named for himself or his wife. Not energy plants, little for infrastructure. Just walking trails and parks and kickbacks.

But surely that creates jobs?

Not much.

A lot of Mitch's jobs were in the defense industry. Like the McConnell Tech Training Center, which got about $100 million in federal funds to develop paint for the Navy. That brought a $50 million contract to the state that created about 40 jobs. There's nothing to indicate if $150 million created a paint ever purchased by the government, or ever put into use. And of the 40ish jobs created (that's from newspapers reports of them planning to hire, no one knows if they actually hired that many, but let's give them the benefit of the doubt), it would have been cheaper and as effective to just pay each employee $1 million and told them to stay home.

It's more of Mitch's duality. He talks about wasteful government spending, but few members of Congress can match his ability to waste. And some voters love him for it.

[*bfine32*]

(11-14-2016, 03:56 PM)Benton Wrote: I guess I got mixed up. I thought you said "KY has 2 Military bases and they are a couple of the few that are not losing folks (actually gaining)." Which, as the article notes, hasn't been true. 

He gives off a good appearance of it though. He's gotten federal money to pay for Mich McConnell Park in bowling Green and Mitch McConnell Plaza in Owensboro. The pork king got around $100 million in one decade for municipal projects named for himself or his wife. Not energy plants, little for infrastructure. Just walking trails and parks and kickbacks.

But surely that creates jobs?

Not much.

A lot of Mitch's jobs were in the defense industry. Like the McConnell Tech Training Center, which got about $100 million in federal funds to develop paint for the Navy. That brought a $50 million contract to the state that created about 40 jobs. There's nothing to indicate if $150 million created a paint ever purchased by the government, or ever put into use. And of the 40ish jobs created (that's from newspapers reports of them planning to hire, no one knows if they actually hired that many, but let's give them the benefit of the doubt), it would have been cheaper and as effective to just pay each employee $1 million and told them to stay home.

It's more of Mitch's duality. He talks about wasteful government spending, but few members of Congress can match his ability to waste. And some voters love him for it.

Oh the Military is downsizing and all bases will be affected. As your article pointed out Campbell is losing 300 people; while other bases are losing 10 times that; I consider that to be a positive; Knox is indeed gaining, which is pretty much unheard of.

I assumed you posted the article to validate what he is doing as far as keeping the Military bases in KY vibrant; apparently. it was to illustrate the opposite. If you think he's not an asset to KY, just wait until he's gone.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(11-11-2016, 05:55 PM)xxlt Wrote: He is a businessman with a solid track record of bankrupting businesses. He will run it like a business. He will bankrupt America.

Now, that isn't just a funny or even mean thing to say. Many economists predicted a massive recession if Trump were elected.

Bankruptcy is overblown.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2015/sep/21/carly-fiorina/trumps-four-bankruptcies/

While it is accurate that Trump filed Chapter 11 bankruptcy four times, Fiorina’s statement doesn’t tell the whole story. In context, Fiorina’s phrasing suggests Trump was personally responsible for the failures of these businesses, but in reality, much was out of Trump’s control -- such as a struggling casino industry. But Trump is certainly not blameless.

He's not entirely at fault nor blameless, but you are acting like it was all his fault. The casino industry never took off like it did in Vegas.

Millionaires also file bankruptcy about an average of 3.5 times over their lifetime.

[Benton]

(11-14-2016, 05:10 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Oh the Military is downsizing and all bases will be affected. As your article pointed out Campbell is losing 300 people; while other bases are losing 10 times that; I consider that to be a positive; Knox is indeed gaining, which is pretty much unheard of.  

I assumed you posted the article to validate what he is doing as far as keeping the Military bases in KY vibrant; apparently. it was to illustrate the opposite. If you think he's not an asset to KY, just wait until he's gone.

I'm not the best at math, but, generally, I view a loss as a loss as a loss. I'm not sure how that's adding anything. I served on a regional board looking at mitigating the loss of FTC jobs. It was better than forecasted, but still a loss. And with Knox, I'm not sure what you're talking about.

http://www.wave3.com/story/3342390/radcliff-community-sorry-fort-knox-will-lose-jobs-but-thankful-its-open

Quote:Radcliff already has experienced its share of downsizing. In 1995, it lost the 194th Armored Brigade: 3,000 soldiers and the post's only stand alone combat ready unit at the time. Losses back to 1991 total more than 7,000 civilian and military positions.

http://www.wlky.com/article/fort-knox-hospital-to-be-downsized-due-to-army-restructuring/3768869

Quote:Due to Army restructuring, the post's hospital will be downsized and some services will be cut.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/06/26/army-post-with-few-fighting-troops-downsizing-means-fort-knox-to-lose-lone.html

Quote:e elimination of 3rd Brigade means a 43 percent cut to Fort Knox's active duty force. That's far beyond the level of cuts elsewhere, but it could be a precursor to what other communities may feel if Congress allows billions in automatic budget cuts to continue next year, Army leaders warned.


"This decision will likely remove nearly 10,000 military employees and dependents from the area, which will have a profound economic impact not only on Fort Knox, but the surrounding region as well," Kentucky Gov. Steve Beshear said in a news release.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/mar/5/4-schools-at-fort-knox-to-close/

Quote:With a combat brigade departing as part of military base realignment, Fort Knox will shutter four schools for the coming year as enrollment at the institutions drops.

The shutdown will take place at the end of the current school year as the central Kentucky military post prepares for the deactivation of its lone combat unit, the 3,000-member 3rd Combat Brigade, 1st Infantry Division. The school shutdowns are part of a ripple effect as the U.S. Army seeks to shrink its ranks to about 450,000 active duty soldiers.

Bizarro Mitch. Kentucky loses jobs, Kentucky voters applaud his work.

[*bfine32*]

(11-14-2016, 06:58 PM)Benton Wrote: I'm not the best at math, but, generally, I view a loss as a loss as a loss. I'm not sure how that's adding anything. I served on a regional board looking at mitigating the loss of FTC jobs. It was better than forecasted, but still a loss. And with Knox, I'm not sure what you're talking about.

http://www.wave3.com/story/3342390/radcliff-community-sorry-fort-knox-will-lose-jobs-but-thankful-its-open


http://www.wlky.com/article/fort-knox-hospital-to-be-downsized-due-to-army-restructuring/3768869


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/06/26/army-post-with-few-fighting-troops-downsizing-means-fort-knox-to-lose-lone.html


http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/mar/5/4-schools-at-fort-knox-to-close/


Bizarro Mitch. Kentucky loses jobs, Kentucky voters applaud his work.

Well if you are not sure what I'm talking about in regards to Ft Knox, perhaps you should read your own links as it was mentioned in the first one you posted:

http://www.theleafchronicle.com/story/news/local/fort-campbell/2015/07/09/fort-campbell-reduced-troops/29906307/

Quote:Fort Knox, for example, is expected to gain 67 troops, according to The Courier-Journal.

I was just going off the cuff when I mentioned they weren't losing any (at Campbell), but if you want to point to a realignment that causes a base the size of Ft Campbell to lose 300 folks as an example of Mitch not doing good things for the state then have at it. Just understand you may be on the inside looking out of Bizarro world; instead of the inverse.

Ft Campbell has about 30,000 Active Duty Soldiers and they are losing about 300 (1%) in a climate that is working to drastically downsize. I honesty thought you were giving him praise because to link the article you did as an example of a slight makes zero sense.

[Benton]

(11-14-2016, 08:01 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Well if you are not sure what I'm talking about in regards to Ft Knox, perhaps you should read your own links as it was mentioned in the first one you posted:

http://www.theleafchronicle.com/story/news/local/fort-campbell/2015/07/09/fort-campbell-reduced-troops/29906307/


I was just going off the cuff when I mentioned they weren't losing any (at Campbell), but if you want to point to a realignment that causes a base the size of Ft Campbell to lose 300 folks as an example of Mitch not doing good things for the state then have at it. Just understand you may be on the inside looking out of Bizarro world; instead of the inverse.

Ft Campbell has about 30,000 Active Duty Soldiers and they are losing about 300 (1%) in a climate that is working to drastically downsize. I honesty thought you were giving him praise because to link the article you did as an example of a slight makes zero sense.

Ah, thanks for clarifying.

Losing thousands of troops and even more civilians supporting them at Knox — about a third of staff in the last two decades from its peak — is made up by bringing in 67 jobs.



And, no, I won't praise a guy who loses thousands of jobs for his constituents. If his pork amounted to jobs for Kent8ucky — significant jobs, not temporary ones to build parks with his name on them — then I'd have a different view.

[*bfine32*]

(11-14-2016, 08:31 PM)Benton Wrote: Ah, thanks for clarifying.

Losing thousands of troops and even more civilians supporting them at Knox — about a third of staff in the last two decades from its peak — is made up by bringing in 67 jobs.



And, no, I won't praise a guy who loses thousands of jobs for his constituents. If his pork amounted to jobs for Kent8ucky — significant jobs, not temporary ones to build parks with his name on them — then I'd have a different view.

I'm not the best at math, but, generally, I view a gain as a gain as a gain.


Glad I could clear up your link for you. 

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(11-14-2016, 08:36 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I'm not the best at math, but, generally, I view a gain as a gain as a gain.


Glad I could clear up your link for you. 

How many were assigned to the Armor School and where is it located now?  When you balance the gains with the loss of just the Armor School is that a net gain or loss?

[Benton]

(11-15-2016, 12:35 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: How many were assigned to the Armor School and where is it located now?  When you balance the gains with the loss of just the Armor School is that a net gain or loss?

<-6,000 + 67 = >-5,933

 Or something.

[*bfine32*]

(11-15-2016, 12:35 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: How many were assigned to the Armor School and where is it located now?  When you balance the gains with the loss of just the Armor School is that a net gain or loss?

How far back do you want to go? Ft Campbell has increased by over 14% since 2001 (I wonder why you didn't bring that up when dude pointed to Campbell's loses). I just asserted in the current climate the bases in KY are doing better than most. I guess we should include how many folks have come in with HRC, Cadet Command, ect...

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(11-15-2016, 01:43 AM)bfine32 Wrote: How far back do you want to go? Ft Campbell has increased by over 14% since 2001 (I wonder why you didn't bring that up when dude pointed to Campbell's loses). I just asserted in the current climate the bases in KY are doing better than most. I guess we should include how many folks have come in with HRC, Cadet Command, ect...

You're actually arguing a net loss  of thousands of soldiers assigned to the Armor School is a "gain is a gain is a gain."

I didn't bring up the 12% increase at Campbell because I didn't know about it. But, that 12% increase would still result in a net loss when balanced with Knox's losses. Why was there a 12% increase since 2001?  Because the Army increased the troop levels to support a unnecessary invasion of Iraq. The fact the Army no longer needs the increased troop levels to occupy a country we are no longer occupying is why the troop levels are being reduced. The Army couldn't meet its own enlistment and retention needs without lowering their own standards so why you have been whining about getting rid of soldiers that normally wouldn't be in the Army to support a mission the Army is no longer conducting is beyond me.