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**Devils Advocate** · 10-26-2015, 10:10 PM

So much of taking a high round QB is based on how they were developed at the college level. Not many are (developed) nowadays. If it was a crap shoot before the rookie wage scale, it's like finding a needle in a haystack now. They just don't focus on developing QB's for the NFL anymore.

I don't really follow college ball but I knew as soon as I seen tape on Andy that he'd be a good NFL QB. he was the only guy I wanted and the only time I've ever hoped we'd draft a certain player up to that point. I've since hoped for certain players, but never prior to drafting Andy.

Not many QB's have worked out for their teams since Andy's draft class or even the few years before, which isn't really all that unusual, but many were taken in the higher rounds recently that, at least to me, obviously weren't gonna work out and I'm not even considered a casual fan of college ball.

The league did themselves a huge favor by implementing the wage scale. Otherwise many teams would be held hostage by poor QB's.

**Anderson HOF** · 10-26-2015, 10:35 PM

(10-25-2015, 10:03 PM)BengalChris Wrote: Luck is an excellent QB on a shitty team that can't protect him. And I believe they beat the snot out of us twice last year.

but you have to admit.. Luck himself has looked bad this year especially if he is an excellent QB.. 76 rating.. 11 TDS to 9 INT and 1-4 as the starter is not going to get it done for a elite QB especially ... If this continues for the season, he has for sure regressed as a QB this year

***SHRacerX*** · 10-27-2015, 08:18 AM

(10-26-2015, 08:07 PM)Beaker Wrote: Hewitt and Rey were both undrafted FAs. Peerman was drafted by the ravens and picked up by us as a FA.

Burfict and Lamur were also UDFAs. Peerman was a straight up FA, true, as was Adam Jones. Reggie was acquired by a trade. It wasn't so much how we got them but the fact that they assembled them. And coached them. The majority were third round or later selections. The overall performance by the front office has been outstanding.

**XenoMorph** · 10-27-2015, 03:23 PM

(10-26-2015, 10:35 PM)Anderson HOF Wrote: but you have to admit.. Luck himself has looked bad this year especially if he is an excellent QB.. 76 rating.. 11 TDS to 9 INT and 1-4 as the starter is not going to get it done for a elite QB especially ... If this continues for the season, he has for sure regressed as a QB this year

how many fumbles?

And does this save the colts money on the long term contract?

**MentalRage** · 10-27-2015, 04:36 PM

Texans have released Ryan Mallett today

***Bengal Dude*** · 10-27-2015, 04:47 PM

(10-26-2015, 06:32 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Don't feel bad, Dalton was my 2nd favorite QB in that class. My favorite was...Christian Ponder.

I was ecstatic when Dalton fell to us though.

Count me in as well. I really wanted us to take Ponder. Jake Locker was my favorite QB in the draft, although I didn't want us to take him, but Andy was #2 on my list for us. When our 2nd rounder came up, I was hoping it was Dalton over the other available QBs.

**BoomerFan** · 10-27-2015, 08:02 PM

I remember arguing with those people. I'm not saying I'm always right, but yeah I didn't like Ryan Mallet.

**Dmac18** · 10-27-2015, 10:03 PM

I was crucified when I stated we landed the best QB in that class. And I was crucified when I said luck will be an average/slightly above average QB. Everybody talks about how Lucks line is so bad and he don't have play makers. Well AARP member Hasselbeck won behind that line and Dalton still made the playoffs last year with a decimated Offense.

Sovereign Nation · 10-27-2015, 10:45 PM

Calm down people.

Luck is a good QB. Is he all that he is hyped to be? Nope. However Luck is a good QB.

Him being a QB doesn't take away from Dalton being a good QB as well. I have always stated that Luck will be the new Payton. Dalton will be the new Brees. Of course when I said this, guys who don't understand football kept bemoaning me for mentioning Dalton in the same sentence as Brees, but whatever.

There are such things as multiple teams having good QBs.

On to Mallett, yes there were a lot of folks that wanted Mallett. He had character issues coming out of college and it looks like those issues are still prevalent.

I wasn't happy with Dalton's selection at the time. However, I watched his game against SDSU, and I saw that he looked like a guy that would do everything it took to win. Then in his rookie season he took us to the playoffs, and repeated the process every year since coming here. To me he has shown himself to be a good QB that always had the potential to be great. This year so far, he has been great and if he continues, then he will validate the faith that I have always had in the kid.

**reuben.ahmed** · 10-27-2015, 11:12 PM

(10-27-2015, 10:45 PM)Sovereign Nation Wrote: I have always stated that Luck will be the new Payton.

since when did Gary play football

**Devils Advocate** · 10-27-2015, 11:18 PM

(10-27-2015, 04:36 PM)WMentalRage Wrote: Texans have released Ryan Mallett today

Wait til he wakes up and hears the news.

.... or, he prolly missed the memo.

**Joelist** · 10-27-2015, 11:38 PM

If I had to distinguish between Luck and Andy it would be that Luck started out hot and has if anything regressed. Lest we forget his turnover proclivities go back before this season. Andy started out more workmanlike and despite a hiccup last season mostly due to the cavalcade of injuries on offense he has improved each season.

As to whether Ponder or Locker or any of the others would have worked for us I tend to think not. We went for the QB who the scouts said was the most NFL ready coming out of college and it paid off. It has also helped that he has a drive to win, and we have benefitted off the field as well as both Andy and his wife have been great ambassadors for the city despite neither one being native to Ohio

**Bengals23** · 10-27-2015, 11:47 PM

(10-27-2015, 10:03 PM)Dmac18 Wrote: I was crucified when I stated we landed the best QB in that class. And I was crucified when I said luck will be an average/slightly above average QB. Everybody talks about how Lucks line is so bad and he don't have play makers. Well AARP member Hasselbeck won behind that line and Dalton still made the playoffs last year with a decimated Offense.

And you'll continue to be crucified if you truly believe that Luck is just an average QB. You writing him off based on these first few games is extremely premature.

**Toy Cannon** · 10-28-2015, 06:44 AM

(10-25-2015, 10:34 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Hey, I'm smarter than those guys. I never wanted Ryan Mallet in the second round, I wanted Blaine Gabbard in the 1st.

I think if the Bengals had drafted Gabbert and made him the starter right away, he would have really blossomed in his fifth year.

**XenoMorph** · 10-28-2015, 12:19 PM

(10-27-2015, 11:47 PM)Bengals23 Wrote: And you'll continue to be crucified if you truly believe that Luck is just an average QB. You writing him off based on these first few games is extremely premature.

Luck in my opinion just isnt careful with the football... He turns it over way to much to be rated higher than average QB.

**reuben.ahmed** · 10-28-2015, 12:48 PM

(10-28-2015, 12:19 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Luck in my opinion just isnt careful with the football... He turns it over way to much to be rated higher than average QB.

Agreed, nobody is in Brady territory but that kid isn't even close - most turnovers combined (int/fumbles). Brady is extremely careful with the ball. And you can't tell us Brady isn't asked to shoulder the bulk of the load. Then again nobody is statistically in his league, Rodgers is a close 2nd but Brady has longevity.

Luck needs to calm his turnovers down.

***SHRacerX*** · 10-28-2015, 12:59 PM

(10-28-2015, 12:19 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Luck in my opinion just isnt careful with the football... He turns it over way to much to be rated higher than average QB.

Agreed. He is a great physical talent, but he simply forces the ball far too often for a QB playing in his fourth year. And as far as not having any protection goes, it seems like their offensive line did just fine against our front four last year. He was getting the ball out sooner and checking it down. It isn't that he didn't take some shots, but the staple was moving the chains. He has a ton of weapons now. An ailing Matt Hasselback showed him how to spread it around and they also didn't abandon their running game so quickly.

It is laughable to me the people defending Luck are the same ones that attack Dalton. Remember, Andy lost Zeitler and Smith last year. He had to survive with Marshall Newhouse for a short while. He also was down his #1 WR for six games and his #2 WR for all 16. Eifert's loss a year ago also was a huge impact. People killed him for a drop in his production with those circumstances. Luck still has his weapons, last time I checked, and they play in a pathetic division.

I think Luck will likely have a new coach and a new OC next season and get a new opportunity.

**XenoMorph** · 10-28-2015, 01:29 PM

(10-28-2015, 12:59 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Agreed. He is a great physical talent, but he simply forces the ball far too often for a QB playing in his fourth year. And as far as not having any protection goes, it seems like their offensive line did just fine against our front four last year. He was getting the ball out sooner and checking it down. It isn't that he didn't take some shots, but the staple was moving the chains. He has a ton of weapons now. An ailing Matt Hasselback showed him how to spread it around and they also didn't abandon their running game so quickly.

It is laughable to me the people defending Luck are the same ones that attack Dalton. Remember, Andy lost Zeitler and Smith last year. He had to survive with Marshall Newhouse for a short while. He also was down his #1 WR for six games and his #2 WR for all 16. Eifert's loss a year ago also was a huge impact. People killed him for a drop in his production with those circumstances. Luck still has his weapons, last time I checked, and they play in a pathetic division.

I think Luck will likely have a new coach and a new OC next season and get a new opportunity.

Yeah his production drop especially TDs as we ran them in that year from the redzone more often than not (use the weapons you have) But i think his completition % went up dispite losing AJ for 6 or so games (he played in some hurt and was not effective) #2 Receiver Eifert for 15.8 games and Jones for 16. When all your weapons are hurt and some of your OL down your gonna have a bad time.

Lucks OL isnt great by any means But its better than what rivers is dealing with out in San Diego... But his shoulder might still be injured. but if that was the case would you roll with Hasslebeck who had not lost yet?

**reuben.ahmed** · 10-28-2015, 01:32 PM

will mallet land somewhere? To me it's funny that Mallet is kicked out and Manziel still exists on the Browns.

***Nately120*** · 10-28-2015, 04:00 PM

(10-28-2015, 01:32 PM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: will mallet land somewhere? To me it's funny that Mallet is kicked out and Manziel still exists on the Browns.

Ryan Mallett is even less talented and an even bigger asshat than Manziel.

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