The Jewish Race

[jj22]

Hitler would be so proud.

Trump is getting ready to define Judaism as a race.

Something only done before the holocaust.

This guy is inept. Listening to his anti semitic base has gotten him in trouble once again.

[Vas Deferens]

(12-11-2019, 05:06 PM)jj22 Wrote: Hitler would be so proud.

Trump is getting ready to define Judaism as a race.

Something only done before the holocaust.

This guy is inept. Listening to his anti semitic base has gotten him in trouble once again.

It’s not just him. It’s the directive set by the state of Israel.

Looking forward to him signing the bill protecting Muslims too.

[Benton]

From what I've read, it's to give more protections and enforcement for the feferal educational arm of things. That's a good thing, outside of expanding government.

But I haven't read a whole lot on it.

[CJD]

(12-12-2019, 04:44 AM)Benton Wrote: From what I've read, it's to give more protections and enforcement for the feferal educational arm of things. That's a good thing, outside of expanding government.

But I haven't read a whole lot on it.

Yea, that was my initial reaction to it as well. I figured it was to more properly envelop Jewish people under Civil Rights and Hate Crime laws.

[GMDino]

(12-12-2019, 04:44 AM)Benton Wrote: From what I've read, it's to give more protections and enforcement for the feferal educational arm of things. That's a good thing, outside of expanding government.

But I haven't read a whole lot on it.

(12-12-2019, 09:48 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Yea, that was my initial reaction to it as well. I figured it was to more properly envelop Jewish people under Civil Rights and Hate Crime laws.

One of the "fears" rolling around on Twitter was that it was a step toward limiting free-speech and "anti-semitism" on campuses.  As no one with any sense trusts this administration I can see why they were worried.

And given how DJT can change things on a whim (or after a late night phone call from a foreign leader) I'd wait until everything is finalized.

[*michaelsean*]

(12-12-2019, 10:01 AM)GMDino Wrote: One of the "fears" rolling around on Twitter was that it was a step toward limiting free-speech and "anti-semitism" on campuses.  As no one with any sense trusts this administration I can see why they were worried.

And given how DJT can change things on a whim (or after a late night phone call from a foreign leader) I'd wait until everything is finalized.

I don't know that this will be the outcome, but I will say this is just a bit more reasonable than another suggestion I recently read.  

[masonbengals fan]

But we will just call him a Nazi in the meantime.

[GMDino]

But fake Jewish people love DJT!

Fun facts about this account retweeted by the president:
—Account is 1 day old
—First tweet was retweeted by the president
—Follows no one
—Claims to be a Jewish Trump supporter from Boro Park
—Profile picture is from a NYTimes story about Jewish Trump supporters in Borough Park pic.twitter.com/vC8GsEZe7e

— Ben Collins (@oneunderscore__) December 16, 2019

 

[CJD]

The controversy, as I understand it, based on what I've read from Jewish people against the idea:
1. It pushes the "dual loyalty" trope of Jewish Americans not really being American, but linked to Israel first (It is apparently something they've been fighting for a long time.) Trump has a history of this behavior, even saying things like

Quote:"In my opinion, you vote for a Democrat, you're being very disloyal to Jewish people, and you're being very disloyal to Israel," Trump told reporters outside the White House on Wednesday, "and only weak people would say anything other than that."

"I think any Jewish people that vote for a Democrat, I think it shows either a total lack of knowledge or great disloyalty," Trump said from the Oval Office.

https://www.npr.org/2019/08/22/753131249/trumps-disloyalty-claim-about-jewish-democrats-shows-he-doesn-t-get-how-they-vot

This narrative has been used as a basis for violence against Jews (for being "UnAmerican") and the Jewish community in America has been fighting it for a very long time. This new executive order severely damages their fight against this narrative.

2. It potentially allows the government to affect school funding if any curriculum or school functions criticize the Israeli government. This order was specifically crafted to protect Jewish people under Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

Quote:Title VI prohibits discrimination on the basis of race, color, and national origin in programs and activities receiving Federal financial assistance

For example, if students on a school campus hold a BDS rally or event, that could be construed as anti-Israel (it is anti-Israeli Government) which can then, under this change, be used to justify defunding a school for allowing "anti-Semitic" behavior on campus. But...being anti-Israel isn't the same as being Anti-Semitic. Opposing the Israeli Government, and the things they are doing to the Palestinians, is not a matter of race. It is a matter of policy. But this change could effectively equate the two.

Essentially, the concern is that it equates being Jewish to being of Israel, and protects the Israeli government from criticism, at least superficially.

3. If being Jewish is a race, then we can now call Christian - Jewish marriages "interracial marriages" despite both people potentially being white. And that's objectively silly (this one is more of a joke. The first two are the major issues). Most American Jewish people do not define themselves as a different race or nationality. They view being a Jew as being a cultural or religious identity. Their nationality is American.


The relatively good news is that this isn't unprecedented. Muslim, Hindu and Sikh religions are protected under Title VI because there is recognition that people of these religions generally share ethnic characteristics. So it's not unprecedented to protect religions in this manner. But I'm not sure making Jewish a nationality was the correct way to go. And it smacks of underhanded tactics (Such as further empowering the dual loyalty trope that Trump has used on several occasions).

[Dill]

(12-17-2019, 10:21 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: 2. It potentially allows the government to affect school funding if any curriculum or school functions criticize the Israeli government. This order was specifically crafted to protect Jewish people under Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964.
For example, if students on a school campus hold a TDS rally or event, that could be construed as anti-Israel (it is anti-Israeli Government) which can then, under this change, be used to justify defunding a school for allowing "anti-Semitic" behavior on campus. But...being anti-Israel isn't the same as being Anti-Semitic. Opposing the Israeli Government, and the things they are doing to the Palestinians, is not a matter of race. It is a matter of policy. But this change could effectively equate the two.

Essentially, the concern is that it equates being Jewish to being of Israel, and protects the Israeli government from criticism, at least superficially.

This is the part that concerns me. And if you criticize Israel for human rights violations, then you are an "anti-semite."  

(12-17-2019, 10:21 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: 3. If being Jewish is a race, then we can now call Christian - Jewish marriages "interracial marriages" despite both people potentially being white. And that's objectively silly (this one is more of a joke. The first two are the major issues). Most American Jewish people do not define themselves as a different race or nationality. They view being a Jew as being a cultural or religious identity. Their nationality is American.

Lots of black Jews in Israel, as well as northern Europeans. That makes it hard to call Jews a "race."

The other aspect of this race definition is that Arabs can fall under the designation "Semite" as well, if people want to return to that 19th century typology. People have spent a great deal of energy since WW II restricting the term to Jews, but it's not clear how successful their efforts would be for legislative/legal purposes. Should they fail, then criticism of Arab Muslims would be "anti-semitic" too--not what the Trump camp wants.

[6andcounting]

(12-12-2019, 01:11 AM)Vas Deferens Wrote: Looking forward to him signing the bill protecting Muslims too.

We'll just telling it is a bill banning all Muslims.