The big "C" word

[BmorePat87]

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/525177-mcconnell-declines-in-floor-speech-to-congratulate-biden-as-president-elect?fbclid=IwAR3dt2a6tQCeZnkpY76fba8LT78tF9NClkpRgq-vGxGOXVgvqCEiOhUpTnI

McConnell refuses to accept the results of the election

https://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/congress-democrats-work-with-trump-231125

The day after the election in 2016, Schumer spoke with Trump, congratulated him, and said this:

“Senate Democrats will spend the coming days and weeks reflecting on these results, hearing from the American people, and charting a path forward to achieve our shared goals and to defend our values,”


As it stands, Trump would need to make up 94k votes over 4 states whereas Clinton lost by 114k votes over 4 states.

[hollodero]

(11-10-2020, 10:35 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/525177-mcconnell-declines-in-floor-speech-to-congratulate-biden-as-president-elect?fbclid=IwAR3dt2a6tQCeZnkpY76fba8LT78tF9NClkpRgq-vGxGOXVgvqCEiOhUpTnI

McConnell refuses to accept the results of the election

https://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/congress-democrats-work-with-trump-231125

And there I thought McConnell would make all conservatives very proud, for taking the uniquely brave stance to count all votes.

But now, please, just in case, let's not say anything critical about Donald Trump and throw shade on the election integrity instead.

Fan-tas-tic.

[GMDino]

Republicans seem to be in lockstep with Trump (despite some being proud of their "response" to the election results) and will not accept of acknowledge Biden's apparent win.

https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-donald-trump-virus-outbreak-elections-voting-fraud-and-irregularities-2d39186996f69de245e59c966d4d140f

Quote:WASHINGTON (AP) — The Trump administration threw the presidential transition into tumult on Monday, with President Donald Trump blocking government officials from cooperating with President-elect Joe Biden’s team and Attorney General William Barr authorizing the Justice Department to probe unsubstantiated allegations of voter fraud.


Some Republicans, including Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, rallied behind Trump’s efforts to fight the election results. Few in the GOP acknowledged Biden’s victory or condemned Trump’s other concerning move on Monday: his firing of Defense Secretary Mark Esper.

The developments cast doubt on whether the nation would witness the same kind of smooth transition of power that has long anchored its democracy. The Electoral College is slated to formally confirm Biden’s victory on Dec. 14 and the Democrat will be sworn into office in late January.


On Monday, Barr authorized U.S. attorneys to probe “substantial” allegations of voter irregularities and election fraud, though no widespread instances of that type of trouble in the 2020 election exist. In fact, election officials from both political parties have publicly stated that voting went well and international observers also confirmed that there were no serious irregularities.
Biden campaign lawyer Bob Bauer said Barr’s memorandum authorizing investigations “will only fuel the ‘specious, speculative, fanciful or far-fetched claims’ he professes to guard against.”


Biden pressed forward with plans to build out his administration, assembling a team of experts to face the surging pandemic. But the federal agency that needs to greenlight the beginnings of the transition of power held off on taking that step. And the White House moved to crack down on those not deemed sufficiently loyal as Trump continued to refuse to concede the race.


Trump remained out of sight at the White House, with conversations ongoing about how the defeated president would spend the coming days and weeks as he challenged the people’s verdict. Trump is not expected to formally concede but is likely to grudgingly vacate the White House at the end of his term, according to several people around him.


Also being discussed: the possibility of more campaign-style rallies as he tries to keep his supporters fired up despite his defeat. It was possible they would feature his family and top supporters but not the president himself.


The ouster of Esper, the Pentagon chief, was expected by some aides to be the first of several firings by Trump, now freed from having to face voters again and angry at those in his administration perceived to be insufficiently loyal. Others believed to be vulnerable: FBI Director Christopher Wray, CIA head Gina Haspel and infectious disease expert Dr. Anthony Fauci.

The president was given cover to keep fighting by McConnell, seen by many in the GOP as the one who may eventually need to nudge Trump to the exit.


“Our institutions are actually built for this,” McConnell said as he opened the Senate on Monday. “We have the system in place to consider concerns and President Trump is 100% within his rights to look into allegations of irregularities and weigh his legal options.”


Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer countered that the Republicans’ refusal to accept the election results was “extremely dangerous, extremely poisonous to our democracy.”


“Joe Biden won the election fair and square,” Schumer said.


A few other GOP senators sent tepid nods toward a transition. Sen. Ben Sasse of Nebraska offered congratulations to Biden, and Sen. Susan Collins of Maine noted the Democrat’s “apparent victory.” But many Republican lawmakers were reluctant to speak up about the election, seeing little political incentive to take a firm stance on Trump’s transition from the White House.


Republicans on Capitol Hill have been hesitant to push Trump to concede to Biden, knowing it would anger their base of Trump’s most devoted supporters. Most were also not overtly encouraging the president’s unfounded claims of fraud, while allowing baseless questions about the election process to linger.


Adding to the sense of uncertainty, the General Services Administration held off on formally beginning the transition, preventing Biden’s teams from gaining access to federal agencies. An agency spokesperson said late Monday that an “ascertainment” on the winner of the election had not yet been made. Citing what the agency did during the extended 2000 electoral recount, it signaled that it may not do so until Trump concedes or the Electoral College meets next month.

That Florida recount involved a margin of just 537 votes in the one state that would have determined which candidate reached 270 electoral votes. Biden’s leads across Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and Michigan, which pushed him over the threshold to win the White House, are far more substantial — and greater than Trump’s leads in the same states in 2016.


On a call Monday night with reporters, a transition official said the Biden team believes it is time for the GSA administrator to ascertain that Biden is president-elect. The official, who spoke only on anonymity as a ground rule for the call, said legal action is “certainly a possibility” if that doesn’t happen, though there are also other options being considered.


Across government, there were signs of a slowdown.


White House officials and Trump political appointees informed career government staffers they were not to begin acting on transition planning until GSA approved it, according to officials familiar with the matter.


In weekly Monday morning all-hands phone calls for Midwest-based employees of the Environmental Protection Agency, mid-level administrators responded to questions about the transition by telling staffers they had no information yet, said Nicole Cantello, an agency employee and president of the Chicago local of a union representing EPA workers.


A senior administration official said presidential personnel director John McEntee, the president’s former personal aide, has sent word to departments that they should terminate any political appointees seeking new work for now. Another official said the warning was not seen as likely to result in any firings but rather meant to reinforce to staff that they should not act counter to Trump while he refuses to concede. Those officials and others who were not authorized to discuss internal policies or describe private discussions requested anonymity.


But some elements of the federal government already were mobilizing to prepare for Biden to assume power. The U.S. Secret Service and Federal Aviation Administration extended a flight restriction over Biden’s Wilmington, Delaware, home through Inauguration Day. Biden’s security detail has been bolstered with agents from the Presidential Protective Division.


And despite Trump’s public stance, there was a growing realization in his inner circle that the election result would be impossible to overturn. Some senior officials have tried to make the case that Trump should turn his efforts to cementing his legacy, but they are wary of being labeled disloyal for even thinking it.


Legal challenges already have been dismissed in battleground states like Georgia and Wisconsin. And Trump’s legal efforts were dealt another blow Monday when campaign adviser David Bossie, tasked with leading the effort, tested positive for the coronavirus.


Bossie had been at the indoor White House election night party now being perceived as a possible superspreader event after other attendees — including chief of staff Mark Meadows, Secretary of Housing and Urban Development Ben Carson and other aides — contracted the virus.


At the White House, attendance among aides had dropped off since election night — partly because of the result and partly because a number are in quarantine after contracting or being exposed to people who came down with COVID-19. Vice President Mike Pence was slated to depart Tuesday for a vacation in Florida after a visit to Capitol Hill.


Trump’s public schedule hasn’t included an intelligence briefing since Oct. 1. The White House hasn’t provided a “readout” of any call between the president and a foreign leader in weeks. He hasn’t met with members of the White House coronavirus task force in months. He also offered no public comment on Tropical Storm Eta lashing the Florida Keys.


The drawn-out resolution to the election has only added to the culture of suspicion that has permeated the hollowed-out West Wing.

[GMDino]

More info on Barr's decision and the fallout so far:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/11/09/barr-oks-justice-dept-election-probes-despite-lack-fraud-evidence/6229191002/

Quote:WASHINGTON – Attorney General William Barr has authorized U.S. attorneys to pursue "substantial allegations" of voting irregularities during the 2020 elections, contradicting longstanding Justice Department practice of not taking steps that could impact the results of an election.


"Such inquiries and reviews may be conducted if there are clear and apparently-credible allegations of irregularities that, if true, could potentially impact the outcome of a federal election in an individual State," Barr said in a memo to federal prosecutors Monday. 


Though President Donald Trump and his campaign have repeatedly claimed there has been fraud, there is no evidence of widespread voter fraud. In fact, election officials from both political parties have publicly stated the election went well, though they're having been minor issues that are typical in elections, including voting machines breaking and ballots that were miscast and lost.


TRUMP ISN'T GORE:Why 2020's legal challenges are so different from 2000, experts say


Barr noted in his memo that the Justice Department has not concluded that "voting irregularities have impacted the outcome of any election." 


The memo would allow prosecutors to pursue investigations into election-related matters before results are certified. The action could raise criticisms that Trump, who has yet to concede after losing to President-elect Joe Biden, will use the Justice Department to try to tip the results in his favor. 


The memo also prompted Richard Pilger, who oversees election crime investigations within the Justice Department, to step down from his post, according to the New York Times and Reuters. The department did not respond to questions from USA TODAY regarding Pilger. 

Vanita Gupta, who oversaw the Justice Department’s Civil Rights Division under President Barack Obama, said Barr’s memo had “no factual basis,” and states, not the federal government, is in charge of elections.
“Scaremongering about opening investigations doesn’t change (the) result,” Gupta tweeted. 
TRUMP'S LAWSUITS:Here's where they stand in battleground states


In an email to colleagues Monday, Pilger said he's resigning from his position after familiarizing himself with the Justice Department's new policy "and its ramifications." Gupta shared the email on Twitter. 

"I have enjoyed very much working with you for over a decade to aggressively and diligently enforce federal crime election law, policy, and practice without partisan fear or favor," Pilger wrote. 


The Trump campaign has filed several lawsuits in battleground states that Biden won by thousands of votes; some of which have been tossed by the courts for lack of evidence.


Biden holds substantial leads in five battleground states, and experts say it's unlikely that any legal action the Trump campaign pursues would affect the outcome. The closest state, Georgia, which will hold a recount, has Biden ahead by more than 10,000 votes as of Monday. 

In the memo to U.S. attorneys, which was first reported by the Associated Press, Barr wrote "it will likely be prudent" to begin preliminary investigations into election-related matters.


"While it is imperative that credible allegations be addressed in a timely and effective manner, it is equally imperative that Department personnel exercise appropriate caution and maintain the Department's absolute commitment to fairness, neutrality and non-partisanship," Barr wrote.


ELECTION INTEGRITY:How Republicans and Democrats in every state together protect against voter fraud


States have until Dec. 8 to resolve election disputes, including recounts and court contests over the results. Members of the Electoral College meet Dec. 14 to finalize the outcome.


The Justice Department also recently issued new guidance allowing prosecutors more authority to take action on voter fraud allegations even as voting is underway. Spokesman Matt Lloyd said last month that the guidance was part of communication that is "routinely" sent via email to federal prosecutors during election season. 


Earlier on Monday, Barr met with Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell on Capitol Hill. The Justice Department declined to comment on the meeting.


McConnell backed Trump's legal efforts, saying the president is "100% within his rights" to challenge the election results, although he did not echo baseless claims about voter fraud and a Democratic conspiracy to steal the election. 

[BmorePat87]

(11-10-2020, 11:04 AM)GMDino Wrote: More info on Barr's decision and the fallout so far:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/11/09/barr-oks-justice-dept-election-probes-despite-lack-fraud-evidence/6229191002/

the 2000 argument is bad, considering that they're nothing alike, but I'm not surprised they went with that. It's just disappointing that other Republicans are going with it too. 

[GMDino]

(11-10-2020, 11:20 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: the 2000 argument is bad, considering that they're nothing alike, but I'm not surprised they went with that. It's just disappointing that other Republicans are going with it too. 

I shared on FB a USA Today story about the difference between the two situations and you are correct that using Gore is a bad idea.

But I'm not surprised anymore about the Republicans bending over for Trump.  They don't dare upset his followers.

And everyone who complains about "the swamp" and "lifers in congress" and "politicians" needs to take a good hard look at Mitch. He checks all the boxes.

[BigPapaKain]

If it didn't before, it sure as shit seems like the coup is on.

[Belsnickel]

(11-10-2020, 03:53 PM)BigPapaKain Wrote: If it didn't before, it sure as shit seems like the coup is on.

I think that was an attempt at humor. A poorly chosen one, but that's what that was.

[GMDino]

(11-10-2020, 03:57 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I think that was an attempt at humor. A poorly chosen one, but that's what that was.

I dunno. Republicans aren't known for their great sense of humor unless they're Mike Huckabee.  

[BigPapaKain]

(11-10-2020, 03:57 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I think that was an attempt at humor. A poorly chosen one, but that's what that was.

I might be inclined to believe it was a joke had the current administration not spent the last 4 years pissing all over the Democratic process by undermining it at every turn.

[Bengalzona]

I'm taking a "wait and see" approach. The recounts are mandatory by the state laws. I don't think his lawsuits will hold water, but it's probably better to go through the process and have them proved flawed than just to dismiss out of hand.

As far as Mitch and the Senate, this is sort of what I read into his comments as well.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(11-10-2020, 05:18 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: I'm taking a "wait and see" approach. The recounts are mandatory by the state laws. I don't think his lawsuits will hold water, but it's probably better to go through the process and have them proved flawed than just to dismiss out of hand.

As far as Mitch and the Senate, this is sort of what I read into his comments as well.

C'mon 'Zona, if we do that we can't be perpetually outraged.  

[GMDino]

(11-10-2020, 05:33 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: C'mon 'Zona, if we do that we can't be perpetually outraged.  

How about being occasionally outraged?  Can the people tired of Trump's BS be that?  

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(11-10-2020, 05:38 PM)GMDino Wrote: How about being occasionally outraged?  Can the people tired of Trump's BS be that?  

Of course, but it's rather too late for that.

[GMDino]

(11-10-2020, 05:40 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Of course, but it's rather too late for that.

Damn.  You should have started earlier then.  

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(11-10-2020, 05:42 PM)GMDino Wrote: Damn.  You should have started earlier then.  

Nah, there were plenty of people wailing in the streets.  No need to add to it.

[*bfine32*]

(11-10-2020, 05:38 PM)GMDino Wrote: How about being occasionally outraged?  Can the people tired of Trump's BS be that?  

Hell some of us are. I don't think you fit into the category.

[*Nately120*]

(11-10-2020, 05:33 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: C'mon 'Zona, if we do that we can't be perpetually outraged.  

I don't think it's so much outrage as just fatigue.  Trump has cried "foul" with upon every election, win or lose, in the past 4+ years and he made it clear before vote #1 was tallied in the 2020 presidential election that it was going to be a completely fraudulent exercise.  

The guy assured us the election would be fraudulent, he declared victory when a fraction of the votes were cast and then he cried foul as soon as his opponent started gaining ground.  Maybe if we tune into the Steelers/Bengals game and Ben complains the game is rigged before the coin toss, then scores a TD and declares that the game should stop and they be declared the winner, and then the Bengals come back and Ben insists that quarters 2-4 where the Bengals scored don't count because they cheated we'd all get this same collective feeling.

And now I remember you're a Steeler fan so um...think about how much you get sick of the Patriots, I guess. All 9 SBs the Patriots were in their opponents cheated massively, even the 6 that they won.

[Bengalzona]

I'm probably gonna catch hell from some quarters for saying this (heck, I'll catch hell from some quarters just for saying anything!), but when I listen to McConnell and Barr speak, I can understand their thought processes and logic. It doesn't mean I agree with them (I rarely do). But they are a stark contrast from Trump-speak, which I firmly believe was contrived purely to appeal to some people's emotions.

[NATI BENGALS]

(11-11-2020, 12:39 AM)Bengalzona Wrote: I'm probably gonna catch hell from some quarters for saying this (heck, I'll catch hell from some quarters just for saying anything!), but when I listen to McConnell and Barr speak, I can understand their thought processes and logic. It doesn't mean I agree with them (I rarely do). But they are a stark contrast from Trump-speak, which I firmly believe was contrived purely to appeal to some people's emotions.

There is a really simple explanation for that. 

They are intelligent. And they are not narcist psychos.