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(06-28-2020, 07:40 PM)Lucidus Wrote: Indeed. If someone is accusing you of racism, shouting "white power" will most certainly disarm that assertion. One must stand in awe of the thought process that proclaims, "In order to prove I'm not what you accuse me of, I will pretend to be the very thing that you think I am, therefore reinforcing your opinion of me."
The response from the guy in the crowd who heard the golf cart guy yell it shows he took it as being dismissed and not that he actually uncovered a kkk member - so it really did disarm the assertion by playing along with the absurdity. But that's not how I would handle being accused of being a kkk member, so I'm not wavering from thinking the guy is an idiot for saying it.
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(06-28-2020, 08:34 PM)bfine32 Wrote: What is telling is you created a thread to spark civility in this forum; yet took exception with one of those two posts.
The sooner people denounce Trump and his divisive modus operandi the sooner civility returns. The guy is like a cancerous tumor you need to cut out.
Alas, we did lie down with a dog and we got fleas.
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(06-28-2020, 08:34 PM)bfine32 Wrote: What is telling is you created a thread to spark civility in this forum; yet took exception with one of those two posts.
I didn't see the first post and I was headed here to share the video of Scott's weak response and saw yours.
Nothing uncivil about it or my intentions. You just happened to post more support for Scott than I was going to.
Don't take it personally. We just disagree on if he is the only "genuine person in congress" or if he "slammed" Trump as much as he said it was wrong and shouldn't have happened.
See Republicans and Trump's diehard supporters often say "tsk tsk. He shouldn't do that" but they rarely add to that. It's like child rearing: If I never deal with repeated bad behavior except to say "aww...you shouldn't have done that" with no punishment or escalation in my response then the behavior will continue.
Scott saying "He shouldn't do that and I don't have anything else to add" is just another "Tsk tsk" and Trump will do it again and if it doesn't EXPLICITLY say something racist Scott won't say a word, IMHO.
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(06-28-2020, 10:09 PM)Nately120 Wrote: The sooner people denounce Trump and his divisive modus operandi the sooner civility returns. The guy is like a cancerous tumor you need to cut out.
Alas, we did lie down with a dog and we got fleas.
Isn't that what Tim Scott did?
As to your comment I quoted: It was not about Trump; it was about folks that see things differently than you. Go back are reread it.
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(06-28-2020, 10:18 PM)GMDino Wrote: I didn't see the first post and I was headed here to share the video of Scott's weak response and saw yours.
Nothing uncivil about it or my intentions. You just happened to post more support for Scott than I was going to.
Don't take it personally. We just disagree on if he is the only "genuine person in congress" or if he "slammed" Trump as much as he said it was wrong and shouldn't have happened.
See Republicans and Trump's diehard supporters often say "tsk tsk. He shouldn't do that" but they rarely add to that. It's like child rearing: If I never deal with repeated bad behavior except to say "aww...you shouldn't have done that" with no punishment or escalation in my response then the behavior will continue.
Scott saying "He shouldn't do that and I don't have anything else to add" is just another "Tsk tsk" and Trump will do it again and if it doesn't EXPLICITLY say something racist Scott won't say a word, IMHO.
2funny.
Actually the OP stated that Scott "blasted" Trump.
Let me guess: You didn't call that into question because you didn't see it.
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Some more NSFW stuff from Trump supporters while we're on the subject.
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(06-28-2020, 03:36 PM)Lucidus Wrote: How anyone who espouses the virtues of goodness, decency and morality could continue to support or defend this man is hard to fathom. I'm not sure how one can rationally and reasonably reconcile these things.
(06-28-2020, 03:40 PM)jason Wrote: Those were my thoughts 5 years ago.
Didn't vote for him and won't be voting for him in 2020 (not that it matters in CA), but I imagine that such people find the Democratic party platform anathema and wouldn't vote for their candidate accordingly. It's not that hard to comprehend, you have the exact same thing going on with the left, people saying they don't care if Biden digitally raped a woman because he's still better than Trump. Apparently politics trumping (no pun intended) morality is not unique to one side or the other.
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(06-28-2020, 10:25 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Isn't that what Tim Scott did?
As to your comment I quoted: It was not about Trump; it was about folks that see things differently than you. Go back are reread it.
I hear ya, it's just hard to be civil and polite about someone as intentionally incendiary as Trump. I do think if he gets 4 more years my cynicism may roll over to zero like an overused odometer and I'll just tap out.
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(06-28-2020, 10:43 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Didn't vote for him and won't be voting for him in 2020 (not that it matters in CA), but I imagine that such people find the Democratic party platform anathema and wouldn't vote for their candidate accordingly. It's not that hard to comprehend, you have the exact same thing going on with the left, people saying they don't care if Biden digitally raped a woman because he's still better than Trump. Apparently politics trumping (no pun intended) morality is not unique to one side or the other.
Oh I get that... For me it's not so much the politics, agenda, or whatever of the right or left. Personally I lean left socially, and right economically... But this guy's got to go. I do fully realize that the shit storm Trump has tapped into will not leave with him though. Joe Biden is far from my ideal choice for a replacement, but our goofy 2 party system is what it is. I believe people sitting it out or refusing to vote for the less stinky turd in 2016 landed us where we are. At this point it's literally anybody but Trump for me, and only one guy has that chance.
I'm gonna break every record they've got. I'm tellin' you right now. I don't know how I'm gonna do it, but it's goin' to get done.
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(06-28-2020, 08:49 PM)bfine32 Wrote: What makes you think I will?
In this very thread I applauded Tim Scott for slamming Trump on his tweet.
Trump hate is palpable on this thread.
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(06-28-2020, 05:50 PM)Lucidus Wrote: Reed's explanations begs the question; what levels of immorality would evangelicals tolerate / attempt to justify, if it leads to the achievement of their ultimate goals? Using Reed's rationale, it seems the end goal is far more important than the path you chose to take to get there. I would argue that if the path itself is compromised, then the ends have been tainted by the means, leaving you with the same problems of having been stained by the very immorality you profess to be fighting against.
Typically, it’s god can use a bad man to do good.
Which is true; just look at all the good god did with Satan. Just ask Job.
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(06-28-2020, 10:43 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Didn't vote for him and won't be voting for him in 2020 (not that it matters in CA), but I imagine that such people find the Democratic party platform anathema and wouldn't vote for their candidate accordingly. It's not that hard to comprehend, you have the exact same thing going on with the left, people saying they don't care if Biden digitally raped a woman because he's still better than Trump. Apparently politics trumping (no pun intended) morality is not unique to one side or the other.
The big problem with the two-party system; in order to have any potential of making your vote count, you have to vote for the least objectionable of the two options. Lots of people like to espouse the third-party or independent vote, and I'm not going to say that I don't roll that way quite often. The issue is that the likelihood of a those options being viable is slim to none thanks to our electoral system. It's not just a matter of getting people on board, it's the system that needs to be restructured to make it possible. For president, specifically, it would need to be national popular vote with ranked choice voting in order to give a third-party or independent a real shot at the White House.
"A great democracy has got to be progressive, or it will soon cease to be either great or a democracy..." - TR
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(06-28-2020, 10:43 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: It's not that hard to comprehend, you have the exact same thing going on with the left, people saying they don't care if Biden digitally raped a woman because he's still better than Trump. Apparently politics trumping (no pun intended) morality is not unique to one side or the other.
To be fair though, a reasonable argument can be made that he's actually still better than Trump. Morally or otherwise.
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(06-29-2020, 09:21 AM)hollodero Wrote: To be fair though, a reasonable argument can be made that he's actually still better than Trump. Morally or otherwise.
Lindsey Graham agrees. 
"A great democracy has got to be progressive, or it will soon cease to be either great or a democracy..." - TR
"The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little." - FDR
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(06-29-2020, 09:21 AM)hollodero Wrote: To be fair though, a reasonable argument can be made that he's actually still better than Trump. Morally or otherwise.
Morally? There should be zero doubt that he is better than Trump. If we are talking about setting a low bar the Trump™ Moral Bar is the lowest, bigly.
But that goes way outside of politics, that's just DJT.
A long time ago there was a discussion about how if you only want to vote for moral people who never did anything wrong no one would get elected. I held (and still hold) the position that no one is "perfect" but some was very bad and much worse than others. Trump is very bad.
Then there is experience, understanding of Government, caring about anything other than himself. The list goes on.
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(06-29-2020, 08:34 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: The big problem with the two-party system; in order to have any potential of making your vote count, you have to vote for the least objectionable of the two options. Lots of people like to espouse the third-party or independent vote, and I'm not going to say that I don't roll that way quite often. The issue is that the likelihood of a those options being viable is slim to none thanks to our electoral system. It's not just a matter of getting people on board, it's the system that needs to be restructured to make it possible. For president, specifically, it would need to be national popular vote with ranked choice voting in order to give a third-party or independent a real shot at the White House.
A friend on FB is third party all the way. Bashes every candidate except his. And while that is wonderful for him and maybe someday it will be a viable option he can't understand what you just wrote. They still think they can just get people to vote and they'll win somehow.
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3rd party candidate has zero chance of winning. Not to say that I haven't voted that way more times than most people.
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All of these "mistakes" by Trump remind me of a tramp I used to date whose tit was always "accidently" popping out at parties.
"Oopseey! Oh, sorry, I can't believe I just did that."
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(06-29-2020, 08:34 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: The big problem with the two-party system; in order to have any potential of making your vote count, you have to vote for the least objectionable of the two options. Lots of people like to espouse the third-party or independent vote, and I'm not going to say that I don't roll that way quite often. The issue is that the likelihood of a those options being viable is slim to none thanks to our electoral system. It's not just a matter of getting people on board, it's the system that needs to be restructured to make it possible. For president, specifically, it would need to be national popular vote with ranked choice voting in order to give a third-party or independent a real shot at the White House.
Has there ever been a big named independent candidate? If not, then maybe that would help garner more support for the independent party. Like maybe Mark Cuban? I believe he claims to be independent. Just a thought. But even then, with both house and senate being controlled by left or right, not sure how much would get done?
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