Turner on the O-line

[GreenCornBengal]

(05-19-2020, 04:02 PM)Sled21 Wrote: He doesn't, he's just pretending he does.....

He uses the “you weren’t there” argument a lot. I just like to hit him with it whenever possible.

FWIW Fred is right, none of us actually know what took place. I tend to believe it was a hazing situation in an attempt to get Martin to “man up”. It didn’t go quite how they thought it would. Guys react differently to that type of behavior and Martin wanted nothing to do with it. I believe he WAS bullied, but the original intentions of the bullying were light hearted. It escalated quickly into something grotesque.

[fredtoast]

(05-19-2020, 04:01 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Again.... oh waaaa. "They're picking on me" 

What about the Asian assistant trainer that Incognito, Jerry, and Pouncy abused.  I guess he was just supposed to fight 3 NFL offensive linemen.  That is what all the "real men" here would do, right.

Here are some details about your hero

The Assistant Trainer was born in Japan and attended university there through 2001, before emigrating to the United States. Incognito, Jerry and Pouncey directed racial slurs at the Assistant Trainer, calling him a "Jap," a "Chinaman" and a "chink"; referred to him as a "dirty communist" or a "North Korean"; made demands such as "give me some water you ***** chink"; spoke to him in a phony, mocking Asian accent, including asking for "rubby rubby sucky sucky"; and called his mother a "rub and tug masseuse." 


Just good old boy having some fun, right.

Or as Sandwegde called it "brotherly love"

[fredtoast]

(05-19-2020, 02:15 PM)Synric Wrote: Johnathan Martin was a headcase. He recently took a plea deal for posting a picture of himself holding a shotgun tagging Icgonito and Pouncey along with his former High School and the Dolphins years after the Bullygate incident and definitely Highschool. He quoted "When your a bully victim & coward, your options are Suicide or Revenge.

Its obvious the guy has psychological issues.

So does that make it okay to bully and harass him?

[fredtoast]

(05-19-2020, 12:01 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Teammates fight constantly. Watch Hard Knocks some time.

Please tell me which Hard Knocks episode shows a group of players physically consistently harassing a teammate over a long period of time along with homophobic slurs.

[fredtoast]

(05-19-2020, 12:01 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: A little dust up in training camp is kind of expected, but serious infighting, grudges among teammates and such, are bad chemistry for the team.  I can't imagine anyone who would think that is acceptable or even encouraged. 

*hint*  Look at the people who are claiming Martin was a wuss and Incognito did nothing wrong.

[fredtoast]

(05-19-2020, 03:57 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Yeah, but Martin himself said that he never informed the coaches or management of any 'specifics' of what was going on while it was happening...only that he was having emotional problems. He also said the the coaches 'occasionally asked how he was doing' but that he didn't want to be a 'snitch'. 

Turner was implicated s part of the problem.  Turner gave every O-lineman an inflatable love doll for Christmas.  All of them got females except Martin who got a male doll.

[fredtoast]

Incognito was a psycho who hated Martin because he thought he was a homosexual. He never wanted to "toughen him up". Instead he wanted to "break him"

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/10455447/miami-dolphins-bullying-report-released-richie-incognito-others-responsible-harassment

Wells said his inquiry found Martin was taunted and ridiculed almost daily. After Martin left the team in October, Incognito boasted about "breaking Jmart" in a notebook the linemen used to tally fines and bonuses among themselves. When the investigation began, Incognito asked another player to destroy the book, but investigators obtained it.

[fredtoast]

Gee, I wish I had a big brother who loved me like this

https://wusfnews.wusf.usf.edu/post/miami-dolphins-suspend-richie-incognito-over-slurs-threats

A transcript of a voice mail that has been circulating Monday describes an offensive and expletive-laden message, allegedly from Incognito. It also uses a racial slur and threatens violence. The NFL and Dolphins have heard the voice mail, according to NFL News.

The Miami Herald reports that if Martin was the target of hazing, he wasn't alone.

"Incognito pressured Martin into paying $15,000 for an unofficial team vacation to Las Vegas – a trip that Martin didn't even join," the newspaper says. "One young defensive player, whose privacy the Miami Herald is protecting, is on his way to going broke because he has been unable to say no to the older players, a source said."


Boy those Dolphin teams really knew how to build a bond between teammates. Guess that is why they were so successful while Incognito was there.

[*Synric*]

(05-19-2020, 05:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Turner was implicated s part of the problem.  Turner gave every O-lineman an inflatable love doll for Christmas.  All of them got females except Martin who got a male doll.

He gave the male blow up doll to Andrew McDonald not Johnathan Martin.

[fredtoast]

(05-19-2020, 05:53 PM)Synric Wrote: He gave the male blow up doll to Andrew McDonald not Johnathan Martin.

Correct.  Player A was apparently McDonald.

[kalibengal]

(05-14-2020, 07:11 AM)HarleyDog Wrote: Wasn’t that a Marvin thing a few years ago?

I only remember the "Do Your Job " Campaign  
and him saying players that had "skins on the wall" all the time LOL 
Good Ole Marv...gotta luv it

[Bengalholic]

(05-19-2020, 05:31 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Incognito was a psycho who hated Martin because he thought he was a homosexual.  He never wanted to "toughen him up".  Instead he wanted to "break him"

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/10455447/miami-dolphins-bullying-report-released-richie-incognito-others-responsible-harassment

Wells said his inquiry found Martin was taunted and ridiculed almost daily. After Martin left the team in October, Incognito boasted about "breaking Jmart" in a notebook the linemen used to tally fines and bonuses among themselves. When the investigation began, Incognito asked another player to destroy the book, but investigators obtained it.

The Wells report also states: 

"Nevertheless, although Incognito, Jerry and Pouncey verbally harassed Martin, we find that they did not intend to drive Martin from the team or cause him lasting emotional injury."

They were forced to conclude that because Martin's own texts (and now deleted FB posts) showed he wasn't exactly a saint himself, and he described his relationship with the trio as 'friends'. Early on, he didn't seem to have a problem with the 'culture' --- until he became the focus. Once that happened, all of a sudden, things changed. While I agree that Incognito, Pouncey and Jerry were shit heads and took it too far...Martin didn't seem to have an issue with it happening to other people.

As the Wells report also said:

'According to Incognito, Martin's departure from the Dolphins should be attributed to pre-existing mental health problems, alcohol and drug use and/or concerns about poor performance on the field. Martin has candidly acknowledged wrestling with all of these issues, and his text messages and other evidence demonstrate that these are real factors, not issues Incognito has manufactured out of whole cloth.'

I think his mental health issues and other problems really came to the forefront during the situation, in Martin's own words again:

'I figured out a major source of my anxiety. I'm a push over, a people pleaser. I avoid confrontation whenever I can, I always want everyone to like me. I let people talk about  me, say anything to my face, and I just take it, laugh it off, even when I know they are intentionally trying to disrespect me. I mostly blame the soft schools I went to,which fostered within me a feeling that I'm a huge p*ssy.'

'I always wonder why I have these feelings. I'm unbelievably blessed, I am living a dream that I have had my entire life, that most people would die even for the 105 opportunity to be where I am. I have an amazing family, had a great upbringing. Why do I always feel this way? I really am getting increasingly tempted to just get in my car and leave Miami, live by myself for months or a year or two off the grid. But something holds me back every time, because part of me still loves football. But I am losing touch with that part more and more every day.'

This is the same guy who threatened his former high school - who went on lockdown and got a restraining order on him - and who was driving around with weapons in his car. While he may have had to deal with some stupid shit while with the Dolphins, this guy has also had very serious mental issues before and after that experience.

[sandwedge]

(05-19-2020, 03:35 PM)fredtoast Wrote: That is because you don't know what all happened.

People who believe what Incognito did was okay have never been on a team that won anything.

I never said I did, hence the "SOUNDS LIKE".... 

I was on the greatest team of all time for 30 years and never lost. So take your BS elsewhere and stfu

[*bengalfan74*]

(05-19-2020, 05:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Turner was implicated s part of the problem.  Turner gave every O-lineman an inflatable love doll for Christmas.  All of them got females except Martin who got a male doll.

(05-19-2020, 05:53 PM)Synric Wrote: He gave the male blow up doll to Andrew McDonald not Johnathan Martin.

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story 

[Sled21]

(05-19-2020, 05:16 PM)fredtoast Wrote: What about the Asian assistant trainer that Incognito, Jerry, and Pouncy abused.  I guess he was just supposed to fight 3 NFL offensive linemen.  That is what all the "real men" here would do, right.

Here are some details about your hero

The Assistant Trainer was born in Japan and attended university there through 2001, before emigrating to the United States. Incognito, Jerry and Pouncey directed racial slurs at the Assistant Trainer, calling him a "Jap," a "Chinaman" and a "chink"; referred to him as a "dirty communist" or a "North Korean"; made demands such as "give me some water you ***** chink"; spoke to him in a phony, mocking Asian accent, including asking for "rubby rubby sucky sucky"; and called his mother a "rub and tug masseuse." 


Just good old boy having some fun, right.

Or as Sandwegde called it "brotherly love"

My hero? Never heard of the guy....

[Sled21]

(05-19-2020, 05:19 PM)fredtoast Wrote: So does that make it okay to bully and harass him?

Reading is fundamental Fred. I've clearly said several times in this thread Incognito is a headcase.

[Sled21]

(05-19-2020, 04:10 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: He may not factually know, but neither do we.

But only one person is acting like he does.....

[fredtoast]

(05-20-2020, 08:14 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Reading is fundamental Fred. I've clearly said several times in this thread Incognito is a headcase.

Then why the victim blaming.

You sound like the guys who say "I am not saying rape is okay, but she was wearing a short skirt and drinking a lot".

The knuckle draggers who always bring up some reason to blame the victim make it tough for all men.  Or the guys who think any type of mental abuse is okay on a football team.  Or guys who act like bragging about sexual assault is okay if it is "locker room talk".

This type of talk is what makes single mothers want to keep their sons from playing football, and it is all BS.

[fredtoast]

(05-19-2020, 08:52 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Never let the truth get in the way of a good story 

How does that fact change the story?

How does it change the fact that Turner knew about all this abuse?

Why would Turner lie about it if there was nothing wrong with what he did?

[Sled21]

(05-20-2020, 09:09 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Then why the victim blaming.

You sound like the guys who say "I am not saying rape is okay, but she was wearing a short skirt and drinking a lot".

The knuckle draggers who always bring up some reason to blame the victim make it tough for all men.  Or the guys who think any type of mental abuse is okay on a football team.  Or guys who act like bragging about sexual assault is okay if it is "locker room talk".

This type of talk is what makes single mothers want to keep their sons from playing football, and it is all BS.

This is where I would normally ask you what you're smoking, but I won't. That's a far stretch. We went from talking about Turner to rape?