Would you defend your country?

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

Just found this interesting. A Quinnipiac poll asked registered Dems, GOP'ers and Independents if they would fight to defend the US if the country was invaded as Ukraine was. The results are as follows;

A majority (55 percent) say they would stay and fight, while 38 percent say they would leave the country. Republicans say 68 - 25 percent and independents say 57 - 36 percent they would stay and fight, while Democrats say 52 - 40 percent they would leave the country.

I know most, if not all, of you will interpret this based on your party affiliation. But it is, as I said interesting, that registered Dems are the only political group in which the majority would flee the country rather than fight for it. Why would this be the case? Why would Republican and independent voters be, overwhelmingly, willing to fight for their nation but registered Dems are 12 percentage points more likely to flee? Do GOP'ers and independents place more value in this nation than Dems?

Source:
https://poll.qu.edu/poll-release?releaseid=3838

[hollodero]

(03-15-2022, 10:41 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Just found this interesting.  A Quinnipiac poll asked registered Dems, GOP'ers and Independents if they would fight to defend the US if the country was invaded as Ukraine was.  The results are as follows;

A majority (55 percent) say they would stay and fight, while 38 percent say they would leave the country. Republicans say 68 - 25 percent and independents say 57 - 36 percent they would stay and fight, while Democrats say 52 - 40 percent they would leave the country.

I know most, if not all, of you will interpret this based on your party affiliation.  But it is, as I said interesting, that registered Dems are the only political group in which the majority would flee the country rather than fight for it.  Why would this be the case?  Why would Republican and independent voters be, overwhelmingly, willing to fight for their nation but registered Dems are 12 percentage points more likely to flee?  Do GOP'ers and independents place more value in this nation than Dems?  

Source:
https://poll.qu.edu/poll-release?releaseid=3838

Maybe more women lean democratic... or maybe democrats are just more honest in polls. Or they are cowards. I really wouldn't know.

I don't know what I'd do.

[Stewy]

(03-15-2022, 10:41 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote:   Do GOP'ers and independents place more value in this nation than Dems?  

Source:
https://poll.qu.edu/poll-release?releaseid=3838

No.  The Dem's don't have any guns.....

[KillerGoose]

I am a registered Democrat. I would stay and fight. In this hypothetical scenario, I would guess that if the mainland U.S. was invaded then the entire world would be in an upheaval. However, just for the sake of answering the question as it is, I would still stay and fight even if the rest of the world wasn't in turmoil. I do have some patriotism while acknowledging shortcomings of the country. The root of this feeling is difficult to explain, but I wouldn't feel right with myself if I fled. It would feel like I am going against my own morals and that would be a tough pill for me to swallow.

[treee]

There is almost no chance of a physical invasion of the US in our lifetimes but I'm sure there are a lot of LARPers out there who fantasize about it every day. I guess living in a modernized nation with nuclear deterrence is too boring for them.

[treee]

That said on the flip side I'm sure there are also a lot of people who in the abstract say they would not put it all on the line, but when it came down to it would make the sacrifice. I don't think there is necessarily a difference in the duty people feel towards their country when it comes to their political affiliation, it just manifests in different ways.

[CKwi88]

Did the poll specify that the Republicans would have to fight for the US and not try and overthrow our legally elected government?

[CJD]

Democrats probably think "many European countries (and Canada) already have the health care, social programs, social safety nets and general political leaning that I wish America would have, so if I need to flee America, I'd probably end up doing okay, maybe even better. Especially if a refugee situation allows me permanent residency in one of these EU countries."

It can be exhausting trying to change this country for the better, at least from a left leaning perspective, so maybe Democrats are more likely to believe the country is not worth dying over.

You saw a lot of celebrities were talking about moving to Canada if Trump were elected President. Most of them didn't end up going through with it (or any of them? I'm not sure), but that seed is in the minds of many left leaning people in America already.

I also think right wing people generally show more bravado than left wing people do. I'm not saying the Republicans and Independents are lying, but I think it's really easy to say "I'd definitely die for my country" when no one is asking you to and you are relatively certain no one ever will ask you to.

The left wing were the ones protesting the wars in Vietnam, Korea, Iraq and Afghanistan, so they probably already have a stilted view against fighting to defend this country (I know that proxy wars aren't the same as being invaded, but the sentiment still holds firm, I think).

The left wing is also made up of a variety of people who have often felt betrayed by the government, the "system" as it were, of this country. Women, Black people, Asian people and Hispanic people all voted Democrat by at least a 10 point margin in 2016, 2018 and 2020 and each of those groups of people have, whether presently or previously, been heavily discriminated against by America or American people in some way. So I think there's a fair chance those groups of people would be far less inclined, statistically, to put their lives on the line for a system they believe is corrupt, racist, sexist or otherwise irredeemable.

And that's not even accounting for LGBTQ+ people and other minorities that are not captured in voting data like religion (I think Muslim people likely vote disproportionately democrat as well, although if that is not the case, I wouldn't be completely surprised as religion is inherently conservative.)

The results of the survey make perfect sense to me.

[HarleyDog]

I will fight but I need some weapons since I don’t own any. Dang, I just realized how unprepared I am in this scenario. I best go stock up.

[Belsnickel]

I always think of these poll questions regarding what-if scenarios are interesting. In a true SHTF scenario like an invasion of our country, the answers to this poll are meaningless. There are LARPers that would be hiding in their basements and there are folks that could never see themselves holding a rifle that would volunteer to protect their family and friends.

I think the answer to the disparity in parties for the answers, though, is tucked away in both the sex and racial differences. Black women have historically been the most dependent Democratic voters since the GOP's Southern Strategy. Women were at 40% stay and fight and black respondents were at 38% stay and fight. I would have to really look at the data and run some stuff in SPSS to do more than just speculation, but I would suspect that is where the push occurs for the Democratic responses. I do think the racial breakdown in the data was the more interesting one.

Obviously, I don't want to assign motives to anyone and everything I am saying is pure speculation and based on generalities, so take them for what they are. The black community having such a low rate of defensive attitudes is likely tied to the generations of racial animosity and a lack of a feeling of duty to the protection of the country as a result of this. The Hispanic sample had a higher rate of defensive attitude than the white sample, which makes sense. With more of them having a more recent emigration story and coming from countries where violence like would be experienced during an invasion was something that caused their emigration it would create more of a sense of indebtedness to the country than decedents of peoples enslaved by/within this country.

[SunsetBengal]

(03-16-2022, 07:57 AM)HarleyDog Wrote: I will fight but I need some weapons since I don’t own any. Dang, I just realized how unprepared I am in this scenario. I best go stock up.

Weapons are fairly easy to attain, it's the ammo that's hard to come by these days..

[Belsnickel]

(03-15-2022, 11:13 PM)Stewy Wrote: No.  The Dem's don't have any guns.....

Monday evening I was helping teach Rifle Shooting Merit Badge and was eating dinner with the Scoutmasters before the meeting. We were chatting about guns and they know me really well and I was on a rant about the stupidity of the whole "assault rifle" thing and one of the SMs goes "you really aren't a typical Democrat, are you?" Now, we try to keep politics out of Scouting, but inevitably it comes up with some topics, so a lot of people know where I stand. I just said "that's because I'm not a Democrat, I'm just a progressive individual."

This just made me think of that conversation.

[Belsnickel]

(03-16-2022, 08:05 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Weapons are fairly easy to attain, it's the ammo that's hard to come by these days..

Not if you know the right folks.

[Belsnickel]

I didn't answer for me personally. In my current state I would do what I could to help any defensive effort. I would be a battlefield liability in my current physical condition, but trying to assist in logistics or something would be my bag. Obviously you don't want to run around unarmed in a war zone regardless of your role, and I wouldn't have any problem slinging my AR on and packing a sidearm for such an occasion. I just know that my place would not be actively seeking engagements with the enemy.

[*Nately120*]

When i see nearly 70 percent of Republicans back up their talk I'll be inspired enough to join their ranks.

Then again, I feel like any invading force could just claim they are taking over to end CRT and the liberal agenda and half our troops would celebrate then as liberators.  I realize that there is a desire to rally around the flag or a common cause against a common enemy, but still...right now a lot of people are convinced our government needs to be overthrown.

If I'm a dictator I look at those 68 percent of republicans who want to fight me and I say "Hmm....well, I'm here to get rid of that corrupt liberal president who cheated in the 2020 election and re-install Trump in office...you sure you want to fight me?"

Get Tucker Carlson to do a confused face monologue wondering why the media is so intent on convincing us to hate these liberators, and the tide has turned before a single shot is fired. 

[Rotobeast]

If I were to guess... I'm going to say the psychology points to the "fish in a barrel" situation. There are many Dems are packed into large cities and may feel an aggressor could cut off necessities or decimate large swaths of the city efficiently. The R's probably feel more confident in evading and retaliating with large portions of them populating rural areas that have much more cover and resources for survival. I know most of the people in my area would scream "Wolverines !" and chuckle somewhat maniacally as they skip towards the woodline.

[BFritz21]

Why would Dems fight for a country they hate?

There's the entire explanation for the poll results.

[treee]

(03-16-2022, 04:30 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Why would Dems fight for a country they hate?

There's the entire explanation for the poll results.

Low quality post

[BFritz21]

(03-16-2022, 04:44 PM)treee Wrote: Low quality post

Explain how that's wrong and low in quality.

[KillerGoose]

(03-16-2022, 04:45 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Explain how that's wrong and low in quality.

It's just a low effort post that doesn't provide any real answer or insight. It doesn't really generate any beneficial discussion. There are plenty of Democrats that would fight for their country. There are plenty of Democratic service members that currently do serve their country. It would be nice to have genuine discussions in this forum instead of "Republicans nazis/Dems bad lul".