Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Printable Version +- Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise (http://thebengalsboard.com) +-- Forum: Off Topic Forums (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-Off-Topic-Forums) +--- Forum: Politics & Religion 2.0 (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-Politics-Religion-2-0) +---- Forum: P & R Archive (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-P-R-Archive) +---- Thread: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along (/Thread-Why-we-need-Trump-and-Putin-to-get-along) Pages:
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Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - StLucieBengal - 07-07-2017 http://m.spiegel.de/international/world/a-1156296.html Democrats and their fake news friends have tried to strain relationships with Russia since they lost. The reality is that only a fool wouldn't want us to get along with Russia. Quote:Why We Need Trump and Putin To Get Along RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - michaelsean - 07-07-2017 Get along. Fine, but Putin is a weasel and and I would never trust him. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - GMDino - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 12:42 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Get along. Fine, but Putin is a weasel and and I would never trust him. Yep. And Trump thinks he is smarter than he is. He'll trust anyone who praises him and makes a "good deal" for him. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Belsnickel - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 12:42 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Get along. Fine, but Putin is a weasel and and I would never trust him. That's my opinion as well. Also, we should not remove the sanctions in place or return the compounds. That would be a very weak move on our part. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Dill - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 11:09 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: http://m.spiegel.de/international/world/a-1156296.html Lucie you are addressing two different groups of people here. 1. Trumpsters who don't believe Russia meddled in the US elections and there is a massive conspiracy between the MSM and Obama deep state operatives in our intel services who are pushing a false story to delegitimize Trump. And 2. The rest of the world, who believe that Putin directed interference in the US election to favor Trump, while Russian operatives had numerous contacts with the Trump campaign. For group 2, Russia strained relations with the US by invading the Ukraine, supporting Assad in Syria, and then disrupting our presidential elections. Democrats and the MSM did not force Putin to do this, and so they are not the cause of the strain. This group now fears the inexperienced Trump will bend over now and give Putin what he wants--removal of sanctions imposed by Obama and Congress and the global-level respect Obama denied Russia as a bad international actor. This group thinks the US needs to stand up to Russia, for its own security and Europe's. Trump's mysterious inability to criticize Putin's actions or agree with his own intel services leaves him a poor match for a former KGB agent who has been acting on the world stage for 17 years. Unless you are only addressing other Trumpsters, I am guessing you want to convince people in group 2 that group 1's narrative is the correct one. What would "getting along with Russia" look like in your view? Are you asking the rest of us to forget what our intel services and best news sources tell us about the attack on our election? How would you convince us either that Russia did not attack us or that, even if they did, we should not make a big deal out of the security threat? What should we expect from an Alpha leader? RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - StLucieBengal - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 12:42 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Get along. Fine, but Putin is a weasel and and I would never trust him. (07-07-2017, 12:47 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: That's my opinion as well. Also, we should not remove the sanctions in place or return the compounds. That would be a very weak move on our part. Why does Russia have a different set of standards when it comes to diplomacy than any other country? If we can align with the backwards middle eastern countries then we can align with Russia. Working with them has worked in the past. We also have an growing German problem that needs addressed. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - StLucieBengal - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 01:03 PM)Dill Wrote: Lucie you are addressing two different groups of people here. Please keep responses brief and to the point. I do not need a multi paragraph response where you spend 80% complaining about trump. I want to work with Russia where we can work together. If we can be friendly and work with the Muslims we can certainly work with Russia. As far as then "hacking" .... it's obvious that's just part of espionage. I am quite certain we meddle in others elections. Obama meddled in Israel and tapped the phones of Merkel. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Vas Deferens - 07-07-2017 ^^^. HA HA HA HA direct and to the point. Can't make this shit up folks. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 12:42 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Get along. Fine, but Putin is a weasel and and I would never trust him. Putin is not an enigma, he's a typical Russian strongman. The Russians historically want/need/love that type of leader. Much like Trump, he is thus easily manipulated by those who understand that mentality and play to it. A shame such subtleties are lost on the vast majority of politicians, and the general public as well. I still trust Putin far more than I trust Xi and the Chinese Communist Party. China will only be friendly right up to the point that they feel they're in a position where they no longer have to. I've said it before, but peeling Russia away from China's orbit should be our number one foreign policy priority. It is an achievable goal, they are not natural allies, the opposite being more true, and are only united in a disdain for the US. (07-07-2017, 12:47 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: That's my opinion as well. Also, we should not remove the sanctions in place or return the compounds. That would be a very weak move on our part. Well, they shouldn't without getting something substantial in return. I would be all for a quid pro quo agreement with Russia. We need to start somewhere. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Dill - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 02:36 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Please keep responses brief and to the point. I do not need a multi paragraph response where you spend 80% complaining about trump. I don't like thinking and writing in soundbites. I urge you to give that up too. So no, I'll continue to pose and answer questions with what I deem the requisite order and support. "The Muslims" are not a country. And no Muslim country has cyber-attacked us. THAT is why we can work with "the Muslims." Obama stood up to Putin. After calling Obama weak, you are ready for Trump to bend over for Putin because hacking is "just part of espionage" and "Obama meddled in Israel." Again, the problem of false equivalencies rears its ugly head--our CIA wiretapped Merkel, so we shrug when the Russians orchestrate a massive, multi-faceted attack on our election. Just part of espionage. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Belsnickel - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 02:25 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Why does Russia have a different set of standards when it comes to diplomacy than any other country? If we can align with the backwards middle eastern countries then we can align with Russia. Working with them has worked in the past. We also have an growing German problem that needs addressed. I am not holding Russia to anything different than I would hold any other country. If you get caught involved in espionage activities, there are repercussions. Our current POTUS has shown signs of backing out of the repercussions the previous POTUS made happen, that is a sign of weakness. Everyone spies on everyone else, even friendly nations. But when you get caught things have to happen or you are made to look the fool. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - GMDino - 07-07-2017 Don't worry folks! Trump and Putin had a two hour AND SIXTEEN MINUTE meeting! They even sent the FLOTUS in to break it up...and they talked for another hour! They even agreed to not do the thing anymore that Trump said Russia probably didn't do! And everyone is saying it went really great. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/07/07/trump-putin-g-20/458210001/ Quote: President Trump repeatedly pushed his Russian counterpart on Russian interference in the 2016 presidential election, U.S. and Russian officials said Friday, with the two leaders agreeing not to meddle in each other's elections in the future. And none of that is propaganda! None! RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Bengalzona - 07-07-2017 Outside of its nuclear weapons stockpile, Russia IS a regional power. And that was done by design by, of all people, Putin. The Russian people don't like to believe that and propaganda tells them otherwise. But it is true. Actually, it has been one of the best decisions they have made. They slashed their military to only a fraction of their Soviet Cold War Era forces (especially their navy) and concentrated on developing quality to match Western standards over quantity. Rather than sponsoring governments and movements overseas (a.k.a. proxies), they have spent most of the past 20 years working internally on security and their economy. They finally seem to have come to a realization that, for the first time in almost a millennia, no country is trying to grab their land. Corporations, however, are a different matter and a different type of threat. This is why Russia is following the Chinese model of closer cooperation (and sometimes control) by the state and Russian businesses. That said, screwing around with our elections is unacceptable. It is okay for us to screw around with theirs, however. If you can't accept that dichotomy, then you really aren't a patriot. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - ballsofsteel - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 11:09 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: http://m.spiegel.de/international/world/a-1156296.html They already get along. Putin said he was a genius. You don't arrange silver showers for just anyone. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - jmccracky - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 04:39 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: That said, screwing around with our elections is unacceptable. It is okay for us to screw around with theirs, however. If you can't accept that dichotomy, then you really aren't a patriot. Exactly! Kind of like how it's cool if I screw my friends moms, but they sure as hell better not screw mine! p RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - StLucieBengal - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 04:08 PM)Dill Wrote: I don't like thinking and writing in soundbites. I urge you to give that up too. At least this time you spared us all the book and stopped using the bold feature like a 2 dollar ***** lol China has attacked us. Yet we work with them. The whole Middle East is packed full of bad actors with the exceptions being Israel, Egypt, and Jordan. Outside of those not much use for the rest of them. Working with Russia is not nearly as bad as working with China, Iran, Saudi Arabia. Quite frankly it's in our best interest to work closely with Russia. The enemies are China and the soon to be coming German problem. A US-Russia coalition could be quite useful. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - StLucieBengal - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 04:05 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Putin is not an enigma, he's a typical Russian strongman. The Russians historically want/need/love that type of leader. Much like Trump, he is thus easily manipulated by those who understand that mentality and play to it. A shame such subtleties are lost on the vast majority of politicians, and the general public as well. I still trust Putin far more than I trust Xi and the Chinese Communist Party. China will only be friendly right up to the point that they feel they're in a position where they no longer have to. I've said it before, but peeling Russia away from China's orbit should be our number one foreign policy priority. It is an achievable goal, they are not natural allies, the opposite being more true, and are only united in a disdain for the US. Well said. I agree 100% RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Vas Deferens - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 04:08 PM)Dill Wrote: I don't like thinking and writing in soundbites. I urge you to give that up too. Please tone down the words very very much. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - Dill - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 04:39 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: Outside of its nuclear weapons stockpile, Russia IS a regional power. And that was done by design by, of all people, Putin. The Russian people don't like to believe that and propaganda tells them otherwise. But it is true. I quite agree, although there are degrees of this. If the Russians contributed money to a candidate or critiqued the policy of a candidate, that is hardly beyond the pale. But flooding our media sphere with fake news while hacking and publishing one side's emails and aggressively trying to affect voter registration roles in numerous states--that rises to the level of a military assault crippling infrastructure like railroads or the power grid. I add that the election of Trump itself and its effect on the Executive might be analogized to introducing a destructive virus in to a computer network--though clearly we can't blame that all on the Russians. For the Russians, Trump is the gift that keeps on giving. RE: Why we need Trump and Putin to get along - hollodero - 07-07-2017 (07-07-2017, 05:22 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Quite frankly it's in our best interest to work closely with Russia. The enemies are China and the soon to be coming German problem. A US-Russia coalition could be quite useful. It's too bad you can't respond, I really am urging to learn more about that German problem and how Putin is a great ally against that threat. That stuff's amazing! |